Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[kithnou]

@bluewally

Why stop at Alcaraz, Kone and McGeady? I can name many more.
Eto'o. Robles and McCarthy are no midas touch. Run of the mill average footballers.
Someone mention Cleverley? Pour cold water on me with all the heat from this Midas.

 

[bluewally]

Hold on, I hear the screech of brakes and a u-turn here: didn't you say 'consistently' press for CL spots? Other than a massively bankrolled Spurs team in recent seasons, which other team fits that description? Not Everton, and certainly not WHU and Leicester.

I underline the point because it's worth underlining: we have not been funded to this point to challenge for CL places. That's why Moyes never came under scrutiny as a manager who failed all but once in 11 seasons to take a CL spot...and quite rightly. However, under much the same circumstances, Martinez IS tasked with getting them.

If there's unanswered questions they rest with you: why now, why Martinez? Why is the bar set higher for him than for those he succeeded?

At least under Moyes we got to Christmas thinking we had a chance.

How is the £80 m bobby spent not funding him for the CL push

I there board funding a 28m striker to avoid relegation. You don't reckon they thought that adding Roberto's choice of players to a team that finished 5th would kick them on

In a realistic cool headed assessment of Martinez, he's taken a team that finished 5th and spent 2 years and 80m putting his stamp on them and his only achievement is beating a poor Chelsea in a cup QF

 

[DrEFC]

And the cycle starts again.

• Course for lowest home win points fact
• 4 home wins in a year fact
• 2nd highest prem finish only, not as if we've never finished there before fact
• We've been to semi's and finals and won during the prem fact.
• 72pts is irrelevant as we still finished 5th fact
• Winning a cup doesn't Mark you out as a world class manager see McClaren, Redknapp, Gullit, Vialli- Swansea/Birmingham won the league recently!! Fact

You enjoy your Easter eggs Dave. Open the windows and breath in a big dose of reality. Financially and also with the cups looming it's pointless to sack him right now. But unlike your new found friend Bill, the new board member should have ambition, like we should have ambition and seriously consider Bob's post come summer.
If bob wins us a pot- which I believe he can in one off knockout games where there's no excuse for defensive tactics from an opposition and shows he can attract and organise an outstanding back line- then come back and say I told you so.
A ringing endorsement by his mate Jordi Cruyff means sod all. Like getting a certificate of achievement from Darren Ferguson. That's for cheeks BTW.

 

[degsy]

There we have it, Dave preparing the ground for his exit strategy - this simple line is seeded so at to save face for when what he knows deep within comes to pass soon and Bobby gets the boot!

not the first time he's blinked mate, caught him on another, now closed, thread; in which he played a major part in getting closed, except he can't won't see it...nothing new there from the pot / kettle master. but he does do it well though.

 

[bluewally]

And the cycle starts again.

• Course for lowest home win points fact
• 4 home wins in a year fact
• 2nd highest prem finish only, not as if we've never finished there before fact
• We've been to semi's and finals and won during the prem fact.
• 72pts is irrelevant as we still finished 5th fact
• Winning a cup doesn't Mark you out as a world class manager see McClaren, Redknapp, Gullit, Vialli- Swansea/Birmingham won the league recently!! Fact

You enjoy your Easter eggs Dave. Open the windows and breath in a big dose of reality. Financially and also with the cups looming it's pointless to sack him right now. But unlike your new found friend Bill, the new board member should have ambition, like we should have ambition and seriously consider Bob's post come summer.
If bob wins us a pot- which I believe he can in one off knockout games where there's no excuse for defensive tactics from an opposition and shows he can attract and organise an outstanding back line- then come back and say I told you so.
A ringing endorsement by his mate Jordi Cruyff means sod all. Like getting a certificate of achievement from Darren Ferguson.

I dont know if it was Johan or jordi. I've seen it attributed to both.

What I haven't seen is their opinion of his second and third seasons

I thought he was boss after season one too. Quickly became obvious in season 2 that he'd taken moyes defensive Lego apart and didn't know how to put it together again. Shame

 

[The Esk]

If there's unanswered questions they rest with you: why now, why Martinez? Why is the bar set higher for him than for those he succeeded?

I think there are plenty of unanswered questions on the pro Martinez side of the camp particularly over does he have the full set of skills required.

The bar is set for Martinez because (i) he claimed he could do it (ii) to Martinez' credit he has a group of players who should be competing for CL places and (iii) the increasingly open nature of the PL and the sustained new challenges naturally lead to the question why are we not amongst them?

With the best squad available and the most open PL ever why has Martinez not grasped the opportunity and taken us to where he stated he would take us?

You and I both know the answer to that, he does not possess all the necessary skills to do so.

 

[bluestevon]

I think there are plenty of unanswered questions on the pro Martinez side of the camp particularly over does he have the full set of skills required.

The bar is set for Martinez because (i) he claimed he could do it (ii) to Martinez' credit he has a group of players who should be competing for CL places and (iii) the increasingly open nature of the PL and the sustained new challenges naturally lead to the question why are we not amongst them?

With the best squad available and the most open PL ever why has Martinez not grasped the opportunity and taken us to where he stated he would take us?

You and I both know the answer to that, he does not possess all the necessary skills to do so.

Throw on top of that that mistakes that first crept in at the end of his first season after the Arsenal win when went to pieces subsequently have continued to be repeated without any signs that the manager can see the problems or just as worryingly that if he doees see the problems that he is unable to do anything about those problems, making a mistake is forgivable, making it tiwce is poor, making it ad nauseum is unforgivable.

No one person is bigger than the club, and certianly no one 'phillosophy' matter more than the good of the club, right now thats what we have in place - a phillosophy regarded as more important than the club itself, bye Roberto take your phillosophy to another place thank you very much

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

We've got a striker who could well win the golden boot this season, and we're likely to finish in the bottom half of the league.

That's not the hallmark of a great manager.

That bottom half finish is also going to ensure that said striker demands a move this summer, as he wants CL.

Criminal

 

[orchard]

Good post. For me it's not that he doesn't HAVE the skills, it's that fact in conjunction with he doesn't attempt to progress himself, an he's had adequate time now.

Sheedy in 'til Summer.

I think there are plenty of unanswered questions on the pro Martinez side of the camp particularly over does he have the full set of skills required.

The bar is set for Martinez because (i) he claimed he could do it (ii) to Martinez' credit he has a group of players who should be competing for CL places and (iii) the increasingly open nature of the PL and the sustained new challenges naturally lead to the question why are we not amongst them?

With the best squad available and the most open PL ever why has Martinez not grasped the opportunity and taken us to where he stated he would take us?

You and I both know the answer to that, he does not possess all the necessary skills to do so.

 

[davek]

and that's your opinion - it may or may not be an actual fact though, which is my opinion.
like your 'fact' the other day that plotters mostly want Moyes back.

my 2 opinions are...no they don't...they just want Martinez gone.

The fact is Martinez is still here and not gone

An opinion is he is the best man for the job and will get it right if given time
another opinion is the amount of time
my opinion is the cup may well be keeping him in a job and the that the issue will be reviewed at the end of the season.

...a pretty reasonable response in the febrile atmosphere of GOIT 2016 edition, it has to be said. Hat's off to you for that, at least.

 

[silent bob]

Posters being polite and reasonable???

Whatever next...

 

[sageyefc]

At least under Moyes we got to Christmas thinking we had a chance.

How is the £80 m bobby spent not funding him for the CL push

I there board funding a 28m striker to avoid relegation. You don't reckon they thought that adding Roberto's choice of players to a team that finished 5th would kick them on

In a realistic cool headed assessment of Martinez, he's taken a team that finished 5th and spent 2 years and 80m putting his stamp on them and his only achievement is beating a poor Chelsea in a cup QF

The amount spent relative to the rest of the league is still relatively average

 

[DrEFC]

I dont know if it was Johan or jordi. I've seen it attributed to both.

What I haven't seen is their opinion of his second and third seasons

I thought he was boss after season one too. Quickly became obvious in season 2 that he'd taken moyes defensive Lego apart and didn't know how to put it together again. Shame

Jordi is his mate, and obviously knows Johan through that. Martinez took Johans grandkid to Wigan also. If Johan thought Martinez was this world talent he'd of (though no direct quotes seen) probably recommended Barca not Ajax. But I'm mostly doing this to wind up Chicoazul.. x

 

[davek]

Consistently and sustain - two words inferring not just one season but over a period of time, no brakes or u-turns here, in fact I think it's time to press the accelerator lol

'Consistently and sustain' or any other verbs/adverbs you want to use...they have not been applied in relation to challenging for a CL spot to any other Everton manager...a point you seemingly dont to wish to address.

I'll leave it there until such time you feel like addressing it.

 

[ianefc]

Hold on, I hear the screech of brakes and a u-turn here: didn't you say 'consistently' press for CL spots? Other than a massively bankrolled Spurs team in recent seasons, which other team fits that description? Not Everton, and certainly not WHU and Leicester.

I underline the point because it's worth underlining: we have not been funded to this point to challenge for CL places. That's why Moyes never came under scrutiny as a manager who failed all but once in 11 seasons to take a CL spot...and quite rightly. However, under much the same circumstances, Martinez IS tasked with getting them.

If there's unanswered questions they rest with you: why now, why Martinez? Why is the bar set higher for him than for those he succeeded?

you know the answer to that question, it's a borderline facetious.

But the answer is, because the great job done at squad building means our squad should be aiming to compete.