Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[oldblue]

I've said this before but there's a big difference between a pen and what happened to us at Stamford Bridge - and conversely at the Etihad in the cup.

Penalties aren't guaranteed goals.

Yep. They are always debatable and missable. And I seriously doubt there's clear evidence we've had the best of those decisions anyway

 

[Ashtonian]

I said we'd beat Chelsea. So when I say we're winning the cup there is no questioning me.

Until we don't mind you, then the assurance means nothing.

haha i am not actually predicting anything right now, i did a year ago and it turns out i wasn't knee jerking to a bad season. Do i want martinez to prove me wrong and be a great manager? Abolutely! Hell i have said that more than anything that i want to be wrong aqbout Martinez, but its been 13 months, and we are still struggling.

If he is sacked in the summer, great, wanted him sacked last march. If he wins the cup, great! Nice to win a trophy, but it only adds pressure on him. If he is still here this time next year then we better be a hell of a lot higher than 12th, or preparing to wave the white flag and give up.

 

[Ashtonian]

I think there is an incontrovertible truth that both pro and anti-Martinez camps can agree upon: our League campaign has been underwhelming.
Further, I think the whys and wherefores of such require scrutiny.
The blue-tinted glasses we all possess have absolved some of the playing squad from fault in our scratchy performance. R Martinez cannot hold their hands out there on the pitch. I suggest players like Coleman and Baines are playing pretty bang average. I suggest Jagielka is no captain. I suggest Cleverley and McCarthy are under-equipped to utilise the space created by Barkley (who's boss) being so closely marked.
Our team isn't really as good as we think it is.
But R Martinez keeps publicly proclaiming them are all phenomenal, world class.

Guess what Roberto?...they aren't...and his set up/tactics exposes this reality on an all too frequent basis.
In many ways, his hyperbole is the architect of his own possible downfall...
...because I think he genuinely believes it.

Hubris/nemesis.

On large i agree mate, but i think in terms of some players, the issue is lack of competition for them so the complacency has crept in over the past couple of years. Even Baines recently dropped is back in the team for largely no reason given other than to reinstate him.

 

[kithnou]

I think there is an incontrovertible truth that both pro and anti-Martinez camps can agree upon: our League campaign has been underwhelming.
Further, I think the whys and wherefores of such require scrutiny.
The blue-tinted glasses we all possess have absolved some of the playing squad from fault in our scratchy performance. R Martinez cannot hold their hands out there on the pitch. I suggest players like Coleman and Baines are playing pretty bang average. I suggest Jagielka is no captain. I suggest Cleverley and McCarthy are under-equipped to utilise the space created by Barkley (who's boss) being so closely marked.
Our team isn't really as good as we think it is.
But R Martinez keeps publicly proclaiming them are all phenomenal, world class.

Guess what Roberto?...they aren't...and his set up/tactics exposes this reality on an all too frequent basis.
In many ways, his hyperbole is the architect of his own possible downfall...
...because I think he genuinely believes it.

Hubris/nemesis.

Brilliantly written as always, and completely on the mark about all those players. Overrated playing list by most.

 

[oldblue]

Until we don't mind you, then the assurance means nothing.

haha i am not actually predicting anything right now, i did a year ago and it turns out i wasn't knee jerking to a bad season. Do i want martinez to prove me wrong and be a great manager? Abolutely! Hell i have said that more than anything that i want to be wrong aqbout Martinez, but its been 13 months, and we are still struggling.

If he is sacked in the summer, great, wanted him sacked last march. If he wins the cup, great! Nice to win a trophy, but it only adds pressure on him. If he is still here this time next year then we better be a hell of a lot higher than 12th, or preparing to wave the white flag and give up.

Well I said I could see major problems this time last year. And repeated my worries after the win away to Southampton. But somehow I've come to the conclusion a lot of my worries could be dealt with and are being. Where does this leave us except hoping and praying. As ever

 

[Igrok]

Brilliantly written as always, and completely on the mark about all those players. Overrated playing list by most.

How come Baines, Jagielka, Coleman and the rest became overrated all at the same time...looks like a conspiracy against great manager...

 

[kithnou]

How come Baines, Jagielka, Coleman and the rest became overrated all at the same time...looks like a conspiracy against great manager...

No mate, The Manager is rated fairly by most I feel.

 

[deipnosophist]

On large i agree mate, but i think in terms of some players, the issue is lack of competition for them so the complacency has crept in over the past couple of years. Even Baines recently dropped is back in the team for largely no reason given other than to reinstate him.

...as was Tim Howard for Robles a while back. R Martinez's biggest shortcoming, for me, is his misplaced belief in players who, to be frank, 'ain't all that'.
And he sets up our team to play in entertaining fashion up front, whilst neglecting fundamental defence strategy...it's like building a flash looking house on weak foundation.
There's too much sand in our concrete.

I would cut R Martinez more slack if he lent suggestion to me as to his seeing and addressing this; but he continues to prevaricate issues.

We are NOT phenomenal. It is NOT the fans fault. It is NOT "we were unlucky". It is NOT "we deserved the win". It is NOT "international duties distracted our players"

We are a potentially pretty good team who is not being coached well.

You cut your coat according to your cloth.

Mr Martinez, if he's to stay, needs to memorise this idiom el pronto.

 

[Igrok]

Moyes + current squad = top 6
Mourinho + current squad = top 4-5
Martinez + current squad = only cup runs
Guess who you dont want to give money for a new squad?

 

[Ashtonian]

Moyes + current squad = top 6
Mourinho + current squad = top 4-5
Martinez + current squad = only cup runs
Guess who you dont want to give money for a new squad?

sadly out of the three if i wanted someone to spend transfer funds it would be martinez lol

His one quality i will happily praise him for. Players after McGeady have been largely decent.

 

[McBain]

I think there is an incontrovertible truth that both pro and anti-Martinez camps can agree upon: our League campaign has been underwhelming.
Further, I think the whys and wherefores of such require scrutiny.
The blue-tinted glasses we all possess have absolved some of the playing squad from fault in our scratchy performance. R Martinez cannot hold their hands out there on the pitch. I suggest players like Coleman and Baines are playing pretty bang average. I suggest Jagielka is no captain. I suggest Cleverley and McCarthy are under-equipped to utilise the space created by Barkley (who's boss) being so closely marked.
Our team isn't really as good as we think it is.
But R Martinez keeps publicly proclaiming them are all phenomenal, world class.

Guess what Roberto?...they aren't...and his set up/tactics exposes this reality on an all too frequent basis.
In many ways, his hyperbole is the architect of his own possible downfall...
...because I think he genuinely believes it.

Hubris/nemesis.

The conjugation of his confabulation cohabiting with his penchant for pungent punctuation flabbergasts even the most steadfast proponent of his autonomous accomplices and vacates even the most excessive evangenated extrapolaters into an ever evaporating natatorium of flagrant flagellators flailing facetiously in dedicatedly diptera decorated canus lupis familiaris kopros.

Or he talks some serious dog [Poor language removed] at times lad.

 

[deipnosophist]

The conjugation of his confabulation cohabiting with his penchant for pungent punctuation flabbergasts even the most steadfast proponent of his autonomous accomplices and vacates even the most excessive evangenated extrapolaters into an ever evaporating natatorium of flagrant flagellators flailing facetiously in dedicatedly diptera decorated canus lupis familiaris kopros.

Or he talks some serious dog [Poor language removed] at times lad.

I particularly liked "penchant for pungent punctuation"...alliterative De Seuss at its best lol

 

[Igrok]

sadly out of the three if i wanted someone to spend transfer funds it would be martinez lol

His one quality i will happily praise him for. Players after McGeady have been largely decent.

There are others available whose names dont start with M...

 

[TheHumbleEgg]

I'm not claiming to have inside knowledge of what the board are and are not discussing.

...it's weird though innit mate, if anyone thinks for a single, solitary second that RM's position hasn't been discussed on the top branch of the big tree then they're sorely misguided. If the MOSH has been peeping for 18 months - as has been mooted - do people honestly think he's not been paying attention? How odd is that? 'Man throwing potential multi-millions at club happy to embrace abject mediocrity...' Yeah?

Nah.

 

[Ashtonian]

There are others available whose names dont start with M...

Koeman all day long for me lol Nothing too risky but potential for more than just a one tactic wonder.