Roberto Martinez discussion

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

He won more than he lost
He won more than he drew
He was not as bad at winning as people make out.

He was fine

He wasn't amazing

He left us in a stronger position than when he got here

It was probably time for a change though

 

[mythbuster]

Just a shame Moyes never got a decent net spend. If there's one area he excelled in, then it was the transfer market.

 

[Khalekan]

He won more than he lost
He won more than he drew

In other words he failed to win more games than he actually won.

In short, he never made it easy for us to win.....which is exactly what I said.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Just a shame Moyes never got a decent net spend. If there's one area he excelled in, then it was the transfer market.

This one season where he COULD spend big though, he's made a bit of a hash of it

I mean, Mata is a cracking player like, but not the player they needed

I can understand why he would have gone for Felli, but that hasn't worked out either

Maybe buying "name" players is something he'll need time to adapt to?

 

[Ihaters]

He was fine

He wasn't amazing

He left us in a stronger position than when he got here

It was probably time for a change though

I'd increase fine to quality, we were hanging on by our finger nails in recent years before he came, but agree entirely with the point.

It was time to move on, and we have to a manager who has acheived an almost identical season to Moyes against a backdrop of change. Suggests to me we have another quality manager.

 

[BoysInBlue]

I was responding to someone who was comparing Martinez to Moyes, and concluding that Martinez is better. I don't think there is anywhere near enough evidence to validate that conclusion.

I agree that Moyes took us as far as he could, but I don't agree that he was a failure. He did a very good job, but times change as do circumstances and expectations, so we needed a change, as did he.

He's certainly no worse.
He has us playing better football than Moyes.
We currently have 6 more points after 27 games than we did at the same stage last season under Moyes.
If we win our next 2 home games, we will have more points at that stage of the season, 29 games played, than Moyes ever amassed after the same period of games in his 11 years at the club.

There's actually plenty of evidence that he is a better manager. He's won a trophy in his managerial career for a start.

 

[Ihaters]

In other words he failed to win more games than he actually won.

In short, he never made it easy for us to win.....which is exactly what I said.

Of the three possible results, win, lose or draw, he won more than either option. What do expect from a near negative spend on a team fighting relegation, 90% wins?

 

[RaleighBlue]

Just a shame Moyes never got a decent net spend. If there's one area he excelled in, then it was the transfer market.

He never really proved himself with big money signings though. A genius at picking up a deal, but if you look at the more expensive buys the picture is a bit more grim.

Fellaini turned into good business though. I do hope Roberto is half as good at the bargains (and better at the big buys).

 

[mythbuster]

This one season where he COULD spend big though, he's made a bit of a hash of it

I mean, Mata is a cracking player like, but not the player they needed

I can understand why he would have gone for Felli, but that hasn't worked out either

Maybe buying "name" players is something he'll need time to adapt to?

Think it's early days yet. If given time, Moyes will put a great squad together at United.

 

[Khalekan]

Of the three possible results, win, lose or draw, he won more than either option. What do expect from a near negative spend on a team fighting relegation, 90% wins?

Nice try at deflection but you still can't refute the point that if your hero made Everton hard to beat (most of the time) he could never make it easy for us to win.

 

[Khalekan]

Think it's early days yet. If given time, Moyes will put a great squad together at United.

How much time?

 

[mythbuster]

He never really proved himself with big money signings though. A genius at picking up a deal, but if you look at the more expensive buys the picture is a bit more grim.

Fellaini turned into good business though. I do hope Roberto is half as good at the bargains (and better at the big buys).

Note sure about that like. Top 4 signings Yak, Fellaini, Bily and Johnson.

Apart from Bily, they all put in big performances for us at some point.

Total cost: £43.5m

Total Received: £43.5m

 

[SerenityNigh]

This one season where he COULD spend big though, he's made a bit of a hash of it

I mean, Mata is a cracking player like, but not the player they needed

I can understand why he would have gone for Felli, but that hasn't worked out either

Maybe buying "name" players is something he'll need time to adapt to?

It's fair to note that he's taking over a team from the greatest football manager of all time (*or one of the, if you don't agree with this claim). That's a very difficult transition. It's easy to transition when the clubhouse is in a funk from a bad manager because the new appointment brings in hope. There's never hope that the new manager will be better when he's replacing the greatest*.

Take that, and add to it an aging squad and poor, overpaid transfers and you've got a difficult situation. Moyes' always upbeat personality surely aids this somewhat, but it's certainly too soon to count him out. If he's not fired after his first season, I also expect him to start doing better.

 

[canuckblue]

Are you really basing it on a single win at Old Trafford against the worst Man United side in living memory? Moyes beat Man United in a Semi-Final at Wembley, but I don't think you can make conclusions on a manager's tenure based on just one single game.

I really don't have to defend Moyes performance in the transfer market, it speaks for itself, and it was what made the biggest difference in changing us from relegation candidates to UEFA Cup candidates during his 11 years, imo.

As for the mood of positivity, it happens a lot when a new manager arrives, and it happened when Moyes arrived as well. If Martinez is still bringing a mood of positivity in 11 years time then that will be great, but I think it is far too early to be classing him as a superior manager to David Moyes, or someone who has had a greater impact on Everton than David Moyes did, because he hasn't, not yet anyway.

In your opinion. Not one shared by a lot, if the posting on here is any indication.

 

[RaleighBlue]

Note sure about that like. Top 4 signings Yak, Fellaini, Bily and Johnson.

Apart from Bily, they all put in big performances for us at some point.

Total cost: £43.5m

Total Received: £43.5m

Fair enough. But if his career was defined by big budget buys rather than his hidden gems, I don't think people would call him a market genius.

They weren't terrible buys (other than Bily...who was awful), but they also weren't exactly brilliant business.