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Roberto Martinez discussion

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bluestevon said:
How can you explain Leicester this season then mate? Or the fact that Spurs haven't exactly spent anything significantly more than us for a good few seasons and have had to replace their best players on a regular basis?
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Well both them teams could still finish outside the top 4 or 6 yet, so lets wait and see....while we could win a cup.
 
bluewally said:
I'm not being smart but I can't tell what your point is. Are we ok or [Poor language removed]?
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It means offensively Martinez has us essentially in a title race this season.

Defensively he has us in a relegation battle.

So no surprise we find ourselves mid table. Worryingly though, it shows you how close we are to either of them.
 
61 games over 18 months have yielded 76 points.

An average of 1.25 points a game. This would be 47.5 points a season.

This is our worst run of form since the days of Walter Smith.

The 61 league games before that saw us get 112 points.

An average of 1.84 points a game. That is 69.9 points a season.

The 61 games before that 93 points. That is a 58 point average.

The point I'm making is that this isn't a blip in form. This is a sustained block of poor form and it isn't improving. In fact it is getting worse. It is 10 points a season worse than Moyes was achieving in the period where we couldn't sign any players. And over 20 points a season worse off than the first year of Martinez and last 6 months of Moyes (seemingly the ideal blend)
 
Pabbers said:
Well both them teams could still finish outside the top 4 or 6 yet, so lets wait and see....while we could win a cup.
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If i was a betting man mate then i'd wager that both Leicester and Spurs are nailed on now for top 4, 10 and 5 gap to a United in free fall, 11 and 6 gap to a West Ham who are mediocre, 13 and 8 point gasp to a Liverpool who basically utter crap. Even bigger gap to Saints, Watfor, Palace and us - none of whom have the ability to put any sort of run together that would be needed.

We 'could' win a cup - but getting past City away and then likely the rs at Wembley doesn't look particularly likely to happen
 

bluestevon said:
If i was a betting man mate then i'd wager that both Leicester and Spurs are nailed on now for top 4, 10 and 5 gap to a United in free fall, 11 and 6 gap to a West Ham who are mediocre, 13 and 8 point gasp to a Liverpool who basically utter crap. Even bigger gap to Saints, Watfor, Palace and us - none of whom have the ability to put any sort of run together that would be needed.

We 'could' win a cup - but getting past City away and then likely the rs at Wembley doesn't look particularly likely to happen
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Nothing is nailed on, you could be right and so could i.

Its not been great, but it was never that great under moyes, or any manager since that 1 season under Royle.

Moyes avg 7th place and that was pretty much seen as midtable and kind of 'ok', i dont think we are much worse than that now.
 
We need jags back in the team, as much as I respect bobby 4 trying 2 give young lads there chance, we need a leader on the pitch, someone that is gonna take the game by the scruff of its neck when needed, yesterday was so so painful 2 watch + with kids it will only get worse cos any confidence they did have is just getting drained out of them, having ur own fans booing u at 21yrs of age is gonna b painful 2 anyone let alone kids of that age, how bobby doesnt see this I dont know, every team needs leaders no matter how much ability is on show, give stones a breather b4 he self destructs + loses all confidence in himself, lukaku, gerri, all looking really tired of trying at times out there. There kids they need someone 2 look up to at times, a little pat on the shoulder, a word in the ear 2 calm them down! Wake up bobby ur draining r team!!
 
Ashtonian said:
Had this thought on my way to work. People keep saying 'well if he wins a cup he gets one more year'

I'm sure if you ask now Wigan would swap that F.A cup they have for a much better league performance in hindsight. At what price is a cup win under martinez considering his last one?
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On the contrary, the Wigan fans think that having the name of Wigan Athletic engraved on the FA Cup is the greatest thing that ever happened to the club.

They valued a cup win far above survival in the Premier League; they were tired of the struggle far out of their depth.
 
Ashtonian said:
It means offensively Martinez has us essentially in a title race this season.

Defensively he has us in a relegation battle.

So no surprise we find ourselves mid table. Worryingly though, it shows you how close we are to either of them.
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Goals for is slightly midleading though. Sure we have scored that amount of goals etc. and that's totally true. But we put 10 past Villa and Sunderland. 2 games which inflate our goal difference column and warranted only 6 points.

I think the issue now is that there is only so long people can wait thinking we're about to turn a corner. Once that corner never comes, players will start to lose faith and form will dip.
 

Pabbers said:
Nothing is nailed on, you could be right and so could i.

Its not been great, but it was never that great under moyes, or any manager since that 1 season under Royle.

Moyes avg 7th place and that was pretty much seen as midtable and kind of 'ok', i dont think we are much worse than that now.
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But wasn't one of the reasons that most were happy to see the back of Moyes that we wanted to see us push on from the constant will we get 5th,6th,7th or 8th trophy every season mate?

There is no denying that right now we have the best squad i have seen in 25 years, yes Martinez deserves a lot of credit for that - rightly so, and yes he deserves credit for bringing on the young players who we already had at the club - notably Stones and Barkley ofc.

But that makes the fact he is performing THIS badly with those players even the more disappointing.

Also what cannot be overlooked is he has left glaring holes in the team as well and not sought to address it, Goalkeeper, left wing, depth at Striker meaning Rom has to play 90 every single game no matter what. As a director of football Martinez would probably do a great job for a good manager, as a manager he is just bang average.

Thanks Roberto for assembling a very talented young squad, now hand it over to someone who knows what to do with it on the pitch
 
After sleeping on it im still fuming. I really cant see how we can keep him in charge.

In his last two seasons at Wigan his win percentage was 25%. If our form continues until the end of the season ours will be around the 30% mark with a much more talented team. Thats simply not good enough. Yes Wigan lost alot more games than we have but its wins that get you high up the table. He needs to start winning games and consistently so. Over the past season and a half there has been no signs of him being able to manage the team to do so.

With our board it will take us to voice our displeasure at the next home game we throw away to see any change. I'm not sure everyone will be behind that though.
 
Stanley Parker said:
On the contrary, the Wigan fans think that having the name of Wigan Athletic engraved on the FA Cup is the greatest thing that ever happened to the club.

They valued a cup win far above survival in the Premier League; they were tired of the struggle far out of their depth.
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they are now in league one mate. BEfore roberto they were at least having a half decent attempt of establishing themselves in the top league. Bruce had them mid table before he left and roberto then took them down the league each season before finally relegating them and condeming them pretty much back down the divisions (player exodus).

More to the point, what saved wigan in the past? It was a late surge of points from around end feb-start of march onwards? Can you think of a season everton have had where we didn't drag ourselves out of danger until march time?

As much as many people don't want to admit it, the parralels are there.
 
bluestevon said:
But wasn't one of the reasons that most were happy to see the back of Moyes that we wanted to see us push on from the constant will we get 5th,6th,7th or 8th trophy every season mate?

There is no denying that right now we have the best squad i have seen in 25 years, yes Martinez deserves a lot of credit for that - rightly so, and yes he deserves credit for bringing on the young players who we already had at the club - notably Stones and Barkley ofc.

But that makes the fact he is performing THIS badly with those players even the more disappointing.

Also what cannot be overlooked is he has left glaring holes in the team as well and not sought to address it, Goalkeeper, left wing, depth at Striker meaning Rom has to play 90 every single game no matter what. As a director of football Martinez would probably do a great job for a good manager, as a manager he is just bang average.

Thanks Roberto for assembling a very talented young squad, now hand it over to someone who knows what to do with it on the pitch
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Well that and it was boring football, think we all wanted better footy which may lead to better results.
 

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