Roberto Martinez discussion

[Kiwi]

Where do you think last years squad would of finished with say Jose Mouriniho in charge? Where would you expect this years squad + the 3 needed players to finish with the above manager?

It certainly wouldn't of been 11th. There's very good players here. That Monday night football segment illustrated in just 2/3 quick clips how differently this guy is working from everyone else. We're the Guinne pigs for his work. It's crazy people defend him.

Jose Mourinho is a world class manager. Roberto is still learning his trade. Hardly a fair or even comparison.

 

[Christiffa25]

Jose Mourinho is a world class manager. Roberto is still learning his trade. Hardly a fair or even comparison.

well if that's the case you can't expect top performances out of players under a manager who's learning his trade.

Specially young players who need guidance them selves.

 

[nsno-chris]

Missed this last night so thanks for posting that. It's a must-watch for anyone who wants to know about the Martinez philosophy and why he does certain things....

...like not being arsed about defending.

First time I've seen that.

Accept you're going to concede goals and be better at what you do to win the game. The idea seems good but the implementation is quite worrying, surely if he combined identifying and working on mistakes with his passing/possession philosophy then it will have more benefits than negatives.

His view on the Chelsea free kick was quite strange, surely the harder you make it for the opposition then risk of conceding reduces. He doesn't seem to play the percentages.

 

[Moomin]

I see some people are now labelling him with the dithering stuff Moyes got.

Maybe, just maybe it's due to our current and previous manager not getting backed by the current custodians of the club.

I think some of the vitriol Roberto gets should be directed at the board. It's like people forget we went about 5 transfer Windows without making a significant signing and had a firesale at the end of it.

 

[Saint Domingo]

I see some people are now labelling him with the dithering stuff Moyes got.

Maybe, just maybe it's due to our current and previous manager not getting backed by the current custodians of the club.

I think some of the vitriol Roberto gets should be directed at the board. It's like people forget we went about 5 transfer Windows without making a significant signing and had a firesale at the end of it.

Never understood the 'dithering' insult at Moyes. I mean you could hit him for a lot of stuff whether you were for him or against him? But his caution in the transfer market?! The man was working with a negative net spend pulling gems out all over the place only to have them sold off and be given even less money yet people want to complain he dithered over deals? Utter madness.

 

[nsno-chris]

I think moyes was renowned for dithering over transfers, it was known that he did a lot of due diligence into players characters etc; he did the same at United and ended up with felliani

Not excusing the boards lack of backing during his tenure; does the same apply to RM time will tell, well in about 19 days, whether he has the backing or he his looking for a certain type of player which us hampering our lack of activity

Time is not in our side is something we can agree on, we need players and it's a case of trying to find out who is not delivering

 

[ah11984]

Stats from all Premier League games last season.

 

[Moomin]

I think moyes was renowned for dithering over transfers, it was known that he did a lot of due diligence into players characters etc; he did the same at United and ended up with felliani

Not excusing the boards lack of backing during his tenure; does the same apply to RM time will tell, well in about 19 days, whether he has the backing or he his looking for a certain type of player which us hampering our lack of activity

Time is not in our side is something we can agree on, we need players and it's a case of trying to find out who is not delivering

I think he suffered at United with it being Woodward's first season in charge, the failure and haggling over Fabregas springs to mind.

Woodward has upped his game since dramatically according to United Fans I know. But, Moyes was still dire for them.

 

[jaycee]

I see some people are now labelling him with the dithering stuff Moyes got.

Maybe, just maybe it's due to our current and previous manager not getting backed by the current custodians of the club.

I think some of the vitriol Roberto gets should be directed at the board. It's like people forget we went about 5 transfer Windows without making a significant signing and had a firesale at the end of it.

I have never understood the aggro our managers get about dithering,if you only have a certain amount of cash available the
need to identify players who can merge with your current squad is vital,once the target is identified I would assume its upto the board/CEO to make the offer and discuss wages

 

[Moomin]

I think moyes was renowned for dithering over transfers, it was known that he did a lot of due diligence into players characters etc; he did the same at United and ended up with felliani

Not excusing the boards lack of backing during his tenure; does the same apply to RM time will tell, well in about 19 days, whether he has the backing or he his looking for a certain type of player which us hampering our lack of activity

Time is not in our side is something we can agree on, we need players and it's a case of trying to find out who is not delivering

This link to an article gives a brilliant insight to Moyes over transfers


http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/2fa7ef1e-b2c0-11e2-8540-00144feabdc0.html#slide0

 

[Shipped]

View attachment 12567


Stats from all Premier League games last season.

That's a terrible presentation of data to get a misleading conclusion.

41% won by teams with most possession.
35% lost by teams with most possession.
24% drawn by teams with most possession.

That's all you need and gives the clear impression you're more likely to win the game when winning the possesion stats.

Combining the draw and loss stats to 59% not won is unneccessary.
You could just as easily add a 65% not lost with most possesion stat.

 

[Tubey]

Don't worry lads, we're in an incredible moment and we'll have a phenomenal start to the season with the group.

 

[mkrudden]

Missed this last night so thanks for posting that. It's a must-watch for anyone who wants to know about the Martinez philosophy and why he does certain things....

...like not being arsed about defending.

Not having a pop mate, but where on earth have you got that impression from?

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

If he signs Van Dijk, all is forgiven

 

[mkrudden]

Don't worry lads, we're in an incredible moment and we'll have a phenomenal start to the season with the group.

Tubey, my friend.

We often agree on things so I want to specifically ask you the following:

Do you think that 2 seasons, heck even 4 seasons (providing of course we stay competitive), is an unfair time frame for Martinez to introduce a totally different mentality and dynamic into the club?

For whatever reason (board/debt etc) we can't go out and buy Iniesta, Xavi and Rakitic for the system, and therefore in buying these younger players he wants to develop them himself.

Isn't it one or the other? Buy the perfect players for the system (a successful system, see Munich/Barca) or 'grow' your own players to be able to achieve success?

I know this sounds ridiculous, but I'd be happy if we finish 12th this season, 8th next season if it meant we finished 4th the season after. And further, i'd be happy to take the risk of the first two and then look at him in 2 years time and see the progress (cups? signings?)

He deserves patience and credit for what he's trying to do ie make us a team who is in control of the ball and the game. I fully admit that his first season clouded his judgement in that it made us look like a) we were the 5th best team in England b) that we needed to continue to improve on signings (not just retain that squad) as it's likely teams wouldn't go toe to toe in his second season.

I still think he's brilliant and deserves time.

Over to you Tubes?