I think bobby’s best tactics yesterday came before he even stepped foot in that dressing room, refusing to be drawn into selling stones to a club like chelsea built up such an atmosphere for that game yesterday on and off the pitch it just had to go our way, every player out there getting such applause they must of been flying high, even a standing applause for kone, who would of seen that coming a few months ago. and then of course turning down norwich on comes the mighty naismith with a perfect hattrick! i think that performance had been building up for last couple of weeks and please may it continue!
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I'm quite interested by the winger situation. It isn't just here, it's right across the premier league; managers really don't seem to trust them.
A huge part of any wingers game is to have a decent defensive relationship with his fullback, and it works vice versa when attacking on the overlap. Yet as 4.2.3.1 has taken over, and the game has got more defensive it seems as though the trust has gone in 'widemen' to be able to muck in. As so we see Besic and Cleverley, or as yesterday Naismith and Kone ahead of the fullbacks. Liverpool had Ings wide left yesterday.
And this is where I don't really get it. Strikers are terrible defenders, for good reason; I'd much rather have them working on the finishing in training, than worrying about tracking marauding fullbacks. Kone completely lost Azpilacueta yesterday, for instance.
Yet deploying a striker out there seems to be seen as the safer option than any of our wingers, who are surely more adept in that position, and have the added role of occupying the fullbacks mind. (There is no way Ivanovich would have been pushing as high up the pitch if he had someone with pace like Del or Lennon ready to counter past him.)
I just haven't seen any evidence that our wide players aren't capable of performing both functions. If it turns out they can't, then that's what they have to be concentrating on in training themselves, rather than being stuck on the bench game after game with the tag 'flair player' working against their best interests.
A huge part of any wingers game is to have a decent defensive relationship with his fullback, and it works vice versa when attacking on the overlap. Yet as 4.2.3.1 has taken over, and the game has got more defensive it seems as though the trust has gone in 'widemen' to be able to muck in. As so we see Besic and Cleverley, or as yesterday Naismith and Kone ahead of the fullbacks. Liverpool had Ings wide left yesterday.
And this is where I don't really get it. Strikers are terrible defenders, for good reason; I'd much rather have them working on the finishing in training, than worrying about tracking marauding fullbacks. Kone completely lost Azpilacueta yesterday, for instance.
Yet deploying a striker out there seems to be seen as the safer option than any of our wingers, who are surely more adept in that position, and have the added role of occupying the fullbacks mind. (There is no way Ivanovich would have been pushing as high up the pitch if he had someone with pace like Del or Lennon ready to counter past him.)
I just haven't seen any evidence that our wide players aren't capable of performing both functions. If it turns out they can't, then that's what they have to be concentrating on in training themselves, rather than being stuck on the bench game after game with the tag 'flair player' working against their best interests.
davek
Player Valuation: £150m
Different personnel out wide for different opponents.
Against the lesser lights I'm sure we'll see 1 winger (or even 2 at some point of the game) deployed by Martinez.
Chelsea was maybe the wrong time to have a player like Deulofeu or Mirallas on the pitch. Lennon, maybe, because of his workrate. But in that instance RM possibly felt he'd ease Lennon back in rather than start him against the champions.
evertony
Player Valuation: £50m
It's about opinions - we'll all agree on that.
I'd also wager that a majority who were there yesterday don't agree with your opinion on RM's tactics. For what it's worth, in the 8-9 mins that Besic was on the pitch he spent more time in our attacking third than he did in our defensive third. Ultimately, I thought his plan was to have McCarthy further forward like he did a few times last season and have Besic and Barry holding deeper......it confirms why we are forum dwellers whilst Roberto is the manager of Everton......in real life, not FIFA.
He gets Everton. Refreshing to see and nice to know he has learned the history and uses it as a yardstick. Think he understands the NSNO and appreciates the supporters.
davek
Player Valuation: £150m
The club's traditions fit in with his own outlook of how the game should be played. It's a very close fit. A point seemingly lost on those hoping for hoofball to be resurrected.
Stanley Parker
Player Valuation: £15m
That's not quite right. Last season we lost to Chelsea because we gave away two early goals. It was only after that, that we went for it. And that was why we lost 3-6 instead of 0-2.
Not many fans applauded the decision to field three defensive midfielders yesterday. I imagine that most fans were hoping for a rather more attacking line-up. Do you think we would have won 3-1 if we had persevered with all three defensive midfielders? As fortune would have it, we had to make a change.
The bench yesterday contained Robles, a new defender, two midfield players, and three right wingers. Replacing Besic with Naismith was a good move. But Naismith played out on the right. How do you know that the introduction of Lennon - or Deulofeu or Mirallas - wouldn't have been just as - or even more - successful?
Lowste
Player Valuation: £30m
All I know is he made a brave decision and it paid off, and he needs to be applauded for it.
There will be occasions for you to moan at him, today isn't one of them.
Stanley Parker
Player Valuation: £15m
It was a great win! But some fans have claimed that Martinez outwitted Mourinho tactically. Can they explain exactly how our plan was intended to work? And how it actually worked on the day?
How did we negate the threat of Pedro and Hazard? How did we create chances in front of goal? The play wasn't all one way. Chelsea had 61% possession and won 14 corners.
Blue Cheese
Mental Patient, GOT Ward
But we didn't, ffs some people are never happy. We are doing better than most of us expected, the guy can't win with some.(and yes I wanted him gone end of last season)
Stanley Parker
Player Valuation: £15m
It was a great win. And I'm not moaning about the substitution!
But if you think that Roberto was brave to bring on Naismith, do you think that he was cautious to select three defensive midfielders in the starting eleven?
Can you explain the tactical thinking behind the starting eleven, and exactly how such a brave substitution affected the pattern of the play.
Or was the way we played the fortunate result of a forced substitution?
Titus Bramble
Best centre half to grace the Premier League
Why are we picking holes in a 3-1 win?
Yes we didn't start any wingers, but that meant we packed the centre of midfield so they couldn't play through us. Also, in regards to Besic, he first hurt himself bursting into the box and eventually decided he couldn't continue after making another break into the box. It's a bit simplistic to keep saying 'we started 3 defensive midfielders derp'... Besic was obviously not going to be sitting back and defending based on his start. Ok, he most probably wouldn't have brought the goal threat Naismith does, but he was getting forward.
We won and won well. Enjoy it.
Yes we didn't start any wingers, but that meant we packed the centre of midfield so they couldn't play through us. Also, in regards to Besic, he first hurt himself bursting into the box and eventually decided he couldn't continue after making another break into the box. It's a bit simplistic to keep saying 'we started 3 defensive midfielders derp'... Besic was obviously not going to be sitting back and defending based on his start. Ok, he most probably wouldn't have brought the goal threat Naismith does, but he was getting forward.
We won and won well. Enjoy it.
Lowste
Player Valuation: £30m
I think the game plan was to keep it tight and subdue which on paper is a very attacking team, and also make sure we don't make the mistakes of last year.
Besic started off more in an attacking role and was very prominent in the initial stages, so don't think he was a cautious inclusion. In bringing Naismith on I think he went for the same game plan but with a slight more attacking edge.
So no to the cautious approach and no to the fortunate substitution
All in all tactics that worked and need to be appreciated
I think trying to find fault reinforces you dislike for the man - just enjoy the moment as there will be times he gets it completely wrong
Stanley Parker
Player Valuation: £15m
Thank you for this reasoned reply! But I couldn't see any fans around me who welcomed the line-up with three defensive midfielders.
This might have been warranted against the Champions of last season, but Chelsea won't be the Champions of this season.
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