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Ronald Koeman discussion

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davek said:
There's a massive improvement in concentration and getting behind the ball. Play? No. We aren't playing on the attack in any way like the style we did under Martinez.
Click to expand...

So far this season:
Goals scored per game - 1.62
Goals conceded per game - 1.04
Passes per game - 448.81
Pass accuracy - 78%
Wins - 12

2015/2016
Goals scored per game - 1.55
Goals conceded per game - 1.45
Passes per game - 472.29
Pass accuracy - 81%
Wins - 11

2014/2015
Goals scored per game - 1.26
Goals conceded per game - 1.32
Passes per game - 494.97
Pass accuracy - 82%
Wins - 12

So we've sacrificed some passing, but we're on course to score more, concede less, win more than 2/3 of the previous regime and generally just be better. And you know what? The style for the last 10/11 games (quarter of the season, with another quarter to go) has been good as far as I'm concerned with not much hint that it's going to change.

Tl;dr - disagree
 
Jokerdan said:
Jeesh, man! Accept it for what it is...a huge improvement over the past couple of seasons with potential for even better improvement. RK is probably the daddy figure that many of our players needed - a pat on the head when good, fatherly advice and a kick up the Harris when needed. Players are like children and if they have a strong leader overseeing them who they respect they want to do nothing more but please him. Barkley is a case in point.
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They're professionals. That has to come from themselves. If there's a player who needs a father figure they are pretty weird, imo.
 
degsy said:
Attacking style...Nah CBA'd
short version; utter wham.
Click to expand...
We played with a lot of atacking style under Martinez - committing numbers to attack. We dont do that under Koeman. We just dont and it's no use arguing we do. We rely on one player to get the goals, and he is having to because no one else chips in as they dont get into positions to.

Our record for having a decent spread of goalscorers this season is utter muck.
 
Titus Bramble said:
So far this season:
Goals scored per game - 1.62
Goals conceded per game - 1.04
Passes per game - 448.81
Pass accuracy - 78%
Wins - 12

2015/2016
Goals scored per game - 1.55
Goals conceded per game - 1.45
Passes per game - 472.29
Pass accuracy - 81%
Wins - 11

2014/2015
Goals scored per game - 1.26
Goals conceded per game - 1.32
Passes per game - 494.97
Pass accuracy - 82%
Wins - 12

So we've sacrificed some passing, but we're on course to score more, concede less, win more than 2/3 of the previous regime and generally just be better. And you know what? The style for the last 10/11 games (quarter of the season, with another quarter to go) has been good as far as I'm concerned with not much hint that it's going to change.

Tl;dr - disagree
Click to expand...
Oh look, you left out a whole season.
 

davek said:
Oh look, you left out a whole season.
Click to expand...

Knew you'd say that...

I've never disagreed that whole season was ace, but the balance between attack and defence was never maintained for the seasons after. We are readressing that balance this season, ok it's not free flowing attacking football, but we are winning more because of it.

You've said it yourself David, our performances have improved as the season has gone on
 
Titus Bramble said:
Knew you'd say that...

I've never disagreed that whole season was ace, but the balance between attack and defence was never maintained for the seasons after. We are readressing that balance this season, ok it's not free flowing attacking football, but we are winning more because of it.

You've said it yourself David, our performances have improved as the season has gone on
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They've gone from abhorrent to watchable.

I also said that it's short lived and has been forced on Koeman by Bolasie's injury, so I dont think we can make any declaration about corners turned stylistically.

As far as I'm concerned, and what I know of him, this is a very un-Koeman like style of play we have at the moment, apart from the work-rate demanded. We'll see next season whether he reverts back to some midway point between this game we play right now and the long ball muck served up for most of the season. As said yesterday, I think that will be dictated largely by Lukaku's decision to stay or go. If he goes I expect a vastly different type of striker(s) and a much different approach to our attacking play.
 
davek said:
We played with a lot of atacking style under Martinez - committing numbers to attack. We dont do that under Koeman. We just dont and it's no use arguing we do. We rely on one player to get the goals, and he is having to because no one else chips in as they dont get into positions to.

Our record for having a decent spread of goalscorers this season is utter muck.
Click to expand...


26/38 games this season
No. Player; League; FA Cup; EFLC; Europe Total

10 Lukaku 17 1 0 0 18
8 Barkley 4 0 1 0 5
23 Coleman 5 0 0 0 5
3 Baines 3 0 0 0 3
11 Mirallas 3 0 0 0 3
9 Kone 0 0 2 0 2
18 Barry 2 0 0 0 2
5 Williams 1 0 0 0 1
12 Lennon 0 0 1 0 1
14 Bolasie 1 0 0 0 1
16 McCarthy 1 0 0 0 1
17 Gana 1 0 0 0 1
19 Valencia 1 0 0 0 1
26 Davies 1 0 0 0 1
31 Lookman 1 0 0 0 1
og 1 0 0 0 1
15players

Last Season 38/38.
No. Player; League; FA Cup; COLC Europe Total
10 Lukaku 18 3 4 0 25
20 Barkley 8 2 2 0 12
9 Kone 5 2 0 0 7
11 Mirallas 4 1 1 0 6
12 Lennon 5 1 0 0 6
25 Funes Mori 4 0 1 0 5
99 og 3 1 1 0 5
14 Naismith 3 0 1 0 4
19 Deulofeu 2 0 2 0 4
3 Baines 2 0 0 0 2
15 Cleverley 2 0 0 0 2
16 McCarthy 2 0 0 0 2
21 Osman 0 0 1 0 1
23 Coleman 1 0 0 0 1
14players

In the best Panto tradition...'Oh no it isn't.'
 
davek said:
They've gone from abhorrent to watchable.

I also said that it's short lived and has been forced on Koeman by Bolasie's injury, so I dont think we can make any declaration about corners turned stylistically.

As far as I'm concerned, and what I know of him, this is a very un-Koeman like style of play we have at the moment apart from the work-rate demanded. We'll see next season whether he reverts back to some midway point between this game we play right now and the long ball muck served up for most of the season. As said yesterday, I think that will be dictated largely by Lukaku's decision to stay or go. I=f he gpoes I expect a vastly different type of striker(s) and a much different approach to our attacking play.
Click to expand...

Do enjoy a bit of hyperbole...

I feel it's more to do with a stronger central midfield due to the emergence of Davies, getting Schneiderlein in and the return of Gueye which has allowed us to change how we play. This just happened to coincide with the injury imo.

Koeman said after the Arsenal win that was how he wanted us to play on a regular basis, that was one of our best performance this season don't you reckon? If he wants us to keep that up, which he has mostly so far, then I'll be happy is a pig in you know what
 

davek said:
We played with a lot of atacking style under Martinez - committing numbers to attack. We dont do that under Koeman. We just dont and it's no use arguing we do. We rely on one player to get the goals, and he is having to because no one else chips in as they dont get into positions to.

Our record for having a decent spread of goalscorers this season is utter muck.
Click to expand...

http://toffeeweb.com/season/15-16/goalscorers.php

http://toffeeweb.com/season/16-17/goalscorers.php

Hardly an alarming difference and the season is only 3/4 of the way through.
 
I think we have all agreed that a first season is not best representative of any new manager's managerial nous. There is too much previous regime's residual squad 'baggage' (good and bad) to glean any real insight.
I believe you need 2-3 seasons' evidence/performance before meaningfully appraising a manager's footballing wherewithal
 

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