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Ronald Koeman discussion

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Think today was just a case of us being outclassed if I'm honest. Spurs have been quality for a couple of seasons now and today just further reinforced the fact that we are still at least a couple seasons behind their current setup.

That said, think in retrospect McCarthy should've been in ahead of Barry. We needed more workrate in the middle of the park, felt like Gana was having to do most of the work.
 
Toffe3m4n said:
Think today was just a case of us being outclassed if I'm honest. Spurs have been quality for a couple of seasons now and today just further reinforced the fact that we are still at least a couple seasons behind their current setup.

That said, think in retrospect McCarthy should've been in ahead of Barry. We needed more workrate in the middle of the park, felt like Gana was having to do most of the work.
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Think we can bridge the gap somewhat if we give Koeman time to work like Poch has had with them. He's had nearly three years now and built a strong squad that now competes with the strongest squads in the league. I think Koeman can do the same with us.
 
Toffe3m4n said:
Think today was just a case of us being outclassed if I'm honest. Spurs have been quality for a couple of seasons now and today just further reinforced the fact that we are still at least a couple seasons behind their current setup.

That said, think in retrospect McCarthy should've been in ahead of Barry. We needed more workrate in the middle of the park, felt like Gana was having to do most of the work.
Click to expand...


Yup. They've only finished outside of the top 5 once during this decade.
 
Though they played a part, I don't think individual errors played the biggest role yesterday

People said that a lot for the past two seasons as well to excuse Martinez's tactical mistakes and I didn't agree with it then either

Koeman got it wrong. He hasn't done it often, but yesterday he did. Now, anyone can get the tactics wrong, what worried me though was how it took him over an hour to make changes. I said a couple of days back in this very thread that I felt Koeman was tactically flexible and wouldn't be afraid to switch game plans if the current one wasn't working

Sadly that wasn't the case yesterday and I hope that next time we're in that sort of situation he makes the changes sooner

That all being said, bad results sometimes happen and there is a gulf between us and the top clubs. I think Koeman is gradually making us better, but I think yesterday highlighted more than anything that we still have a long way to go before we're on par with those sides. We're going to need to be patient
 
Toffe3m4n said:
Think today was just a case of us being outclassed if I'm honest. Spurs have been quality for a couple of seasons now and today just further reinforced the fact that we are still at least a couple seasons behind their current setup.

That said, think in retrospect McCarthy should've been in ahead of Barry. We needed more workrate in the middle of the park, felt like Gana was having to do most of the work.
Click to expand...

If we'd gone at them with our best but just been outclassed I could accept that no problem. Instead we restored a slow ageing player to the line up for no obvious reason, our keeper who had kept 7 clean sheets in 10 is beaten by a 30 yarder and rolls another one to our players in trouble, our tough tackling midfield was nowhere to be seen. We just malfunctioned as usual, knife to a gun fight written all over it. There wasn't any point in the 90 where it looked like we had a chance of winning. We predictably played a bit when we were 2 down and the pressure was off. This group of players can't function under the slightest ounce of pressure or expectation. They'll be back to beating Hull at home soon telling everyone how they've turned a corner.
 

Khalekan said:
Oh, so we now have "divisions" of "best of the rest", do we?

FFS we are as close to United as Baggies are to us and we are are closer to the RS in 4th place than Saints in 10th are to us :oops:

If you really want to have divisions of best of the rest then at least put us in a league of our own :dance:

But whatever way you want to cut it.....5th place is best of the rest and will remain so until that position is granted CL entry.
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I was only taking the mickey mate:dance:

I trust you picked up on that:(
 
Mikey_Fitzgerald said:
Though they played a part, I don't think individual errors played the biggest role yesterday

People said that a lot for the past two seasons as well to excuse Martinez's tactical mistakes and I didn't agree with it then either

Koeman got it wrong. He hasn't done it often, but yesterday he did. Now, anyone can get the tactics wrong, what worried me though was how it took him over an hour to make changes. I said a couple of days back in this very thread that I felt Koeman was tactically flexible and wouldn't be afraid to switch game plans if the current one wasn't working

Sadly that wasn't the case yesterday and I hope that next time we're in that sort of situation he makes the changes sooner

That all being said, bad results sometimes happen and there is a gulf between us and the top clubs. I think Koeman is gradually making us better, but I think yesterday highlighted more than anything that we still have a long way to go before we're on par with those sides. We're going to need to be patient
Click to expand...

I think the plan was always to keep it tight, then change Barry for an attacking player for the last 30.

If he'd have switched to a more attacking formation after the 1st goal when Spurs were rampant, they could have killed the game in the first half and been 3-0 up by half time.

We looked like we'd steadied the ship and got a foothold, which is what we had to do, and then the 2nd goal is an absolute killer. A shocking goal to give away.

Koemans biggest mistake was starting Barry. It's easy to pick holes in a gameplan after you've lost, but I don't think there was that much wrong with how we set up.
 

bicycleheader said:
Surely that is the cooler head? Picking out a player looking for the ball to try and build a move?

Rather than another % hoof up to Rom?

We obviously disagree on how much danger Schneiderlin was in when Robles, apparently under instruction from Ronko, throws it out.

I think it was fine to pass it there, and Schneiderlin needs to be cooler and more alert if he is going to be the player coming for the ball to start us off from deep.
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Look at the position we were in at the time. We were well under the cosh and the defence was looking to press up the pitch.

Having watched it again I'm in no way closer to changing my opinion.

Schneiderlin had a poor game and he should have got rid, but he shouldn't have been put in that position in the first place IMO.
 
Saint Domingo said:
If we'd gone at them with our best but just been outclassed I could accept that no problem. Instead we restored a slow ageing player to the line up for no obvious reason, our keeper who had kept 7 clean sheets in 10 is beaten by a 30 yarder and rolls another one to our players in trouble, our tough tackling midfield was nowhere to be seen. We just malfunctioned as usual, knife to a gun fight written all over it. There wasn't any point in the 90 where it looked like we had a chance of winning. We predictably played a bit when we were 2 down and the pressure was off. This group of players can't function under the slightest ounce of pressure or expectation. They'll be back to beating Hull at home soon telling everyone how they've turned a corner.
Click to expand...

Why be so negative?

It's our first defeat of 2017 fgs.

Just goes to show that we have a lot of work still to do to bridge the gap.
 
Mountfield1985 said:
I think the plan was always to keep it tight, then change Barry for an attacking player for the last 30.

If he'd have switched to a more attacking formation after the 1st goal when Spurs were rampant, they could have killed the game in the first half and been 3-0 up by half time.

We looked like we'd steadied the ship and got a foothold, which is what we had to do, and then the 2nd goal is an absolute killer. A shocking goal to give away.

Koemans biggest mistake was starting Barry. It's easy to pick holes in a gameplan after you've lost, but I don't think there was that much wrong with how we set up.
Click to expand...
They could yes, or we could have pulled it back to 1-1 and changed the whole dynamic. Truth be told, it could have been 3-0 at half time anyway. That it wasn't was more luck than judgement.

I think the gameplan was wrong, and I think it has been for a couple of weeks to be honest. A few weeks ago I think we had the balance of the side just right, but in recent weeks we've tweaked it and it hasn't looked quite as good. Davies is much better deeper in my opinion, I don't think he has the flair to play further forward, he's better seeing passes from deep and putting people away. Gana Barry and Schneiderlin was clearly a case of too many cooks in my opinion, they got in eachothers way and nobody really seemed to take responsibility, seemingly believing one of the others would.

The defeat yesterday was neither unexpected nor the end of the world, but i'll be very disappointed if we turn up like that at Anfield or Old Trafford.
 

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