Ronald Koeman discussion

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Koeman's biggest mistake was trying to match City in the midfield rather than building on the counter attacking success we had built earlier. If he had brought on Mirallas or Lookman, we probably would have killed the game off. I think he realizes that now, and except for that he got the game plan completely right.
 

JLW said:
2 games 4 points what's all the fuss about?? We got a point away from home against the favourites for the title..
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Exactly
The games against City , Chelsea Spurs and United won't define our season.
As I see it City Chelsea and United are practically nailed on top 3 , in what order depends on injuries and luck
Spurs at Wembley is their drawback
So us Spurs Arsenal and RS battling it out for the rest of the top 7
Again injuries and luck will have a lot to do with it
If we get 4th or 5th by one point we will look back at last night and say that's the point that done it.
Ron got most of it right last night
Siggy not being match fit and Klassen still settling were obvious drawbacks.
IMO Lookman is too inexperienced and not tactically aware enough to throw in to a game like last night and I think Kev may just have been a bit too wound up and hotheaded in the situation.
He has previous against Southampton for coming on as a sub and going he'll for leather and you can't give Silva free kicks around the area.
Tactics worked second half and then Pep changed it , he's no mug don't forget.
Add that to the quality of the City side and I'm happy with one point
PS how often have you heard managers and players say how hard it can be to play against 10 men.
 
Brisan123 said:
Exactly
The games against City , Chelsea Spurs and United won't define our season.
As I see it City Chelsea and United are practically nailed on top 3 , in what order depends on injuries and luck
Spurs at Wembley is their drawback
So us Spurs Arsenal and RS battling it out for the rest of the top 7
Again injuries and luck will have a lot to do with it
If we get 4th or 5th by one point we will look back at last night and say that's the point that done it.
Ron got most of it right last night
Siggy not being match fit and Klassen still settling were obvious drawbacks.
IMO Lookman is too inexperienced and not tactically aware enough to throw in to a game like last night and I think Kev may just have been a bit too wound up and hotheaded in the situation.
He has previous against Southampton for coming on as a sub and going he'll for leather and you can't give Silva free kicks around the area.
Tactics worked second half and then Pep changed it , he's no mug don't forget.
Add that to the quality of the City side and I'm happy with one point
PS how often have you heard managers and players say how hard it can be to play against 10 men.
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I know what you mean, but in a way they will.

If you look at it as a top 7 last season, we took 3 points from our away games against the other 6. Liverpool, who took the 4th place we're supposedly aiming for, took 12 from theirs. That's why they got 4th and we didn't.

The issue we have is that we will drop points in games you would expect us to win. Everyone does, it's normal. What the best teams do is balance that out by also winning games you wouldn't necessarily expect them to. Because we virtually never do that, we always end up falling short of that top 4.
 

Lanolin said:
I know what you mean, but in a way they will.

If you look at it as a top 7 last season, we took 3 points from our away games against the other 6. Liverpool, who took the 4th place we're supposedly aiming for, took 12 from theirs. That's why they got 4th and we didn't.

The issue we have is that we will drop points in games you would expect us to win. Everyone does, it's normal. What the best teams do is balance that out by also winning games you wouldn't necessarily expect them to. Because we virtually never do that, we always end up falling short of that top 4.
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Exactly, we get the same excuses from the same people every time we put in a non performance away from home. 'Happy with a point' 'won't define our season' 'they'll batter other teams here'. The fact of the matter is that the rest of the top 6 and even teams below us will pick up more points away at the top 6 than we will if we keep up the mentality of previous seasons. The rest of the top 6 will also pick up far more points away from home than us in general. Fair enough there's times when you catch a top side in full flow (Chelsea last season) away from home and you take a beating, anyone can accept that, but there's been countless times we've hit the top 6 when they've been in turmoil with injuries etc. or they've been in turgid form, managers about to be fired, and we never ever punish them away from home in the way other teams do. Until we start playing football away from home and not just looking to contain teams we won't come any higher than 7th. Last seasons away from home we were poor and Koeman has to show progression in this area.
 
Brisan123 said:
Exactly
The games against City , Chelsea Spurs and United won't define our season.
As I see it City Chelsea and United are practically nailed on top 3 , in what order depends on injuries and luck
Spurs at Wembley is their drawback
So us Spurs Arsenal and RS battling it out for the rest of the top 7
Again injuries and luck will have a lot to do with it
If we get 4th or 5th by one point we will look back at last night and say that's the point that done it.
Ron got most of it right last night
Siggy not being match fit and Klassen still settling were obvious drawbacks.
IMO Lookman is too inexperienced and not tactically aware enough to throw in to a game like last night and I think Kev may just have been a bit too wound up and hotheaded in the situation.
He has previous against Southampton for coming on as a sub and going he'll for leather and you can't give Silva free kicks around the area.
Tactics worked second half and then Pep changed it , he's no mug don't forget.
Add that to the quality of the City side and I'm happy with one point
PS how often have you heard managers and players say how hard it can be to play against 10 men.
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Chelsea aren't nailed on by a long shot, a week ago they looked an utter shambles - very much like they did last season with Mourinho in charge, they also have a very small squad and have the CL to deal with unlike last season - that will take a massive toll on them this season.

United have started brilliantly - but against two utter dross teams - they also started last season looking brilliant as well then soon as Europe started they faltered badly. Won't be able to judge them properly until they have actually played a few decent teams.

City do look quality - and they have great depth as well
 
Saint Domingo said:
Exactly, we get the same excuses from the same people every time we put in a non performance away from home. 'Happy with a point' 'won't define our season' 'they'll batter other teams here'. The fact of the matter is that the rest of the top 6 and even teams below us will pick up more points away at the top 6 than we will if we keep up the mentality of previous seasons. The rest of the top 6 will also pick up far more points away from home than us in general. Fair enough there's times when you catch a top side in full flow (Chelsea last season) away from home and you take a beating, anyone can accept that, but there's been countless times we've hit the top 6 when they've been in turmoil with injuries etc. or they've been in turgid form, managers about to be fired, and we never ever punish them away from home in the way other teams do. Until we start playing football away from home and not just looking to contain teams we won't come any higher than 7th. Last seasons away from home we were poor and Koeman has to show progression in this area.
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Free flowing Harlem Globe Trotters City, won 2 games against their peers in the top 7 last season - home and away.
 
It is depressing to read the pessimism from some of us who can't see the validity of arguing taking the game to a team that was a man down after we've nearly spent 150 million ourselves this summer.

Yeah a draw away to them is a good result, but not capitalizing on being a man up when we were also 1-0 up for 45 minutes is a disappointment whatever way you cut it imo.

People saying we can't go forward against them a man down without being punished is an indictment of where we are as a team right now and how far we still have to go.
 

bluestevon said:
Chelsea aren't nailed on by a long shot, a week ago they looked an utter shambles - very much like they did last season with Mourinho in charge, they also have a very small squad and have the CL to deal with unlike last season - that will take a massive toll on them this season.

United have started brilliantly - but against two utter dross teams - they also started last season looking brilliant as well then soon as Europe started they faltered badly. Won't be able to judge them properly until they have actually played a few decent teams.

City do look quality - and they have great depth as well
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City showed their worth last Sunday.
Add Cahill Fabregas Hazard Pedro to that squad as well as one or two more Drinkwater and others linked ) and they won't be far off even with Europe.
Jose has his type of team now
Big physical players who will bully teams ,granted Rom wont but add 1 more winger and Zlatan after Christmas and United will in my opinion do well but time will tell
City as you say are strong and he wants Evans and Sanches to add to the squad
 
jtl60 said:
I didn't see any of the aftermatch interviews etc, but did they ask Koeman why he changed to a back 4 during the second half?
It seemed to give them the impetus to attack us more and the back three of Williams/Jags/Keane were looking solid
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Think he mentioned that City started to play through the middle and we were getting overrun. Basically 3 at the back with wing backs wasn't enough so he had to change to flat back 4.
All these shouts for Lookman and the likes coming on need to think on that they would have been lucky to have any impact at all when City had 9 players better than us keeping the ball in the middle of the park. Forget the 10 v 11 as up until the changes it was 7 v 6 in their favour in the middle where the game was being played. After the changes we got better and only got punished by our own mistake.
 
Lanolin said:
And still got more away points than us from those fixtures, which just about says it all.
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Exactly. Liverpool won at the bridge and the Emirates, those sort of points are huge for a top 4 challenge and it proved so. Some of our fans think we'll get top 4 by drawing every away game apart from those at Anfield Emirates Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane which are fine to lose every season and then just blitzing everyone at home. That approach at best gets you 7th. Our away form last season cost us a crack at the top 4.
 

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