Ross Barkley

[Chang Elephant]

Because that's precisely what he is. A prospect.

Until he gets a good run of games week in week out, and develops mentally and physically to it, we will never benefit.

A prospect needs developing by top coaches, not championship cloggers. Why are you running Moyes and Round down ?

 

[Chang Elephant]

"Barkley needs to develop as a player out on loan" (c) Neg Rapper

 

[Tubey]

Sorry, he'd learn more being in and around our first team squad than being in constant danger of a severe leg break in the lower leagues where he'll be hacked to death by the dregs of professional football.

I'd understand a loan to a leading Championship side, but Wednesday will be ultra-defensive and fight for their lives all year after just winning promotion; what is the point in sending him to a club to be hacked to pieces AND develop a losing mentality?

It's a poor move. Chelsea loans top prospect Lukaku to a Premier League side that plays decent football for experience; we send our young superstar to no mans land. Makes zero sense.

 

[BoysInBlue]

A prospect needs developing by top coaches, not championship cloggers. Why are you running Moyes and Round down ?

Only so much you can learn on a training pitch. You learn far more from playing matches, and plenty of great players in the past have developed and benefited from loans spells at lower clubs.

Got nothing to do with the value of Moyes/Round coaching (of which is very highly respected - Moyes teaches other coaches!).

 

[Chang Elephant]

Disgraceful comment Tubes, I expect you'll be severely negged for putting forward an opinion.

 

[Chang Elephant]

Only so much you can learn on a training pitch. You learn far more from playing matches, and plenty of great players in the past have developed and benefited from loans spells at lower clubs.

Got nothing to do with the value of Moyes/Round coaching (of which is very highly respected - Moyes teaches other coaches!).

How dare you dispute my opinion <reaches for neg gun>

 

[Tommy.]

Sorry, he'd learn more being in and around our first team squad than being in constant danger of a severe leg break in the lower leagues where he'll be hacked to death by the dregs of professional football.

I'd understand a loan to a leading Championship side, but Wednesday will be ultra-defensive and fight for their lives all year after just winning promotion; what is the point in sending him to a club to be hacked to pieces AND develop a losing mentality?

It's a poor move. Chelsea loans top prospect Lukaku to a Premier League side that plays decent football for experience; we send our young superstar to no mans land. Makes zero sense.

Wednesday actually played some half decent stuff last season.
Regardless of that, you could argue a fighting season could be the making of him, add that extra bit of steel to his game.

Ross Barkley is in no way too good to be loaned out at 18 years old to a Championship side, ask David Beckham.

 

[chrismanduk]

Sorry, he'd learn more being in and around our first team squad than being in constant danger of a severe leg break in the lower leagues where he'll be hacked to death by the dregs of professional football.

I'd understand a loan to a leading Championship side, but Wednesday will be ultra-defensive and fight for their lives all year after just winning promotion; what is the point in sending him to a club to be hacked to pieces AND develop a losing mentality?

It's a poor move. Chelsea loans top prospect Lukaku to a Premier League side that plays decent football for experience; we send our young superstar to no mans land. Makes zero sense.

The championship isn't a cloggers league.
Players like Bale, Ramsay, oxlade c, walcott have all been mentored in that league.
Certainly didn't do them any harm

 

[Tommy.]

A prospect needs developing by top coaches, not championship cloggers. Why are you running Moyes and Round down ?

Because samples of top flight football doesn't better consistent professional games a level down.

Why would anyone loan out any talented youngsters if that was the case?

 

[BoysInBlue]

How dare you dispute my opinion <reaches for neg gun>

 

[Tubey]

Wednesday actually played some half decent stuff last season.
Regardless of that, you could argue a fighting season could be the making of him, add that extra bit of steel to his game.

Ross Barkley is in no way too good to be loaned out at 18 years old to a Championship side, ask David Beckham.

He is. He really is.

I'd agree with you if we were talking about Vellios, as I think he'd benefit from learning more about the hustle and bustle of English football and he's a strong lad who'd gain confidence from learning how to ruffle up a defender.

But Barkley (without accusing him of explosive knees etc.) is such an overwhelming talent that you don't expose him to that. You nurture him, boost his confidence and make sure he knows he's very much a part of the first team picture. You don't give him 8 minutes at the end of every third game like he's a bit part player and always will be.

He's a scouse lad; he doesn't need toughening up. What he needs is minutes at a high level to learn the tactical part of the game, not the physical. Leon Osman went on loan in the lower leagues for physical reasons to recover from his injury and benefited immensely from it, but Ross needs an entirely different program in my view.

You don't learn tactics and professional nous in the Championship! You learn it from playing with good players.

 

[Chang Elephant]

Because samples of top flight football doesn't better consistent professional games a level down.

Why would anyone loan out any talented youngsters if that was the case?

He's a top talent we should hold onto, play, and nurture. Rooney was wasted for the year we had him in the squad....Moyes was too cautious.....the scottish get put him in from game one. He's too good to be playing with the lower league jokers.

 

[Tubey]

The championship isn't a cloggers league.
Players like Bale, Ramsay, oxlade c, walcott have all been mentored in that league.
Certainly didn't do them any harm

All of those players played a handful of games in the lower leagues before it was obvious they stuck out like a sore thumb and the bigger clubs grabbed hold of them.

You know what else is consistent with all those examples? They played regular football at a higher level as soon as possible at their Premier League clubs.

Oxlade-Chamberlain is 19; Arsenal fans would riot if Wenger sent him on loan to the Championship. Key player at 19.

Aaron Ramsey had 16 games at that level, Arsenal took him on and introduced him into the first team. Never looked back.

Bale was signed by Spurs at age 17 after just one season in the Championship, introduced into the side slowly but surely, never looked back.

Walcott, handful of appearances for Southampton off the bench, Arsenal developed him properly, never looked back.

The point is, none of these players were loaned out to develop. They don't need it. They had proper man management and were introduced into the first team properly.

Moyes has mismanaged Barkley dramatically. He's kicking the confidence out of the lad. He doesn't need this loan; he needs Premier League football time at Everton.

 

[Tommy.]

He is. He really is.

I'd agree with you if we were talking about Vellios, as I think he'd benefit from learning more about the hustle and bustle of English football and he's a strong lad who'd gain confidence from learning how to ruffle up a defender.

But Barkley (without accusing him of explosive knees etc.) is such an overwhelming talent that you don't expose him to that. You nurture him, boost his confidence and make sure he knows he's very much a part of the first team picture. You don't give him 8 minutes at the end of every third game like he's a bit part player and always will be.

He's a scouse lad; he doesn't need toughening up. What he needs is minutes at a high level to learn the tactical part of the game, not the physical. Leon Osman went on loan in the lower leagues for physical reasons to recover from his injury and benefited immensely from it, but Ross needs an entirely different program in my view.

You don't learn tactics and professional nous in the Championship! You learn it from playing with good players.

He's a top talent we should hold onto, play, and nurture. Rooney was wasted for the year we had him in the squad....Moyes was too cautious.....the scottish get put him in from game one. He's too good to be playing with the lower league jokers.

Mate, you're doing the Championship a major disservice there, there's some very good people a young lad like him can learn from. Wednesday played some decent stuff last season, he won't stagnate there, no way no how.
Don't get me wrong, I'd rather see him at a Prem side but there doesn't appear to be any willing, so what's wrong with letting him go to a side which will definitely play at a level above our reserves?

 

[chrismanduk]

All of those players played a handful of games in the lower leagues before it was obvious they stuck out like a sore thumb and the bigger clubs grabbed hold of them.

You know what else is consistent with all those examples? They played regular football at a higher level as soon as possible at their Premier League clubs.

Oxlade-Chamberlain is 19; Arsenal fans would riot if Wenger sent him on loan to the Championship. Key player at 19.

Aaron Ramsey had 16 games at that level, Arsenal took him on and introduced him into the first team. Never looked back.

Bale was signed by Spurs at age 17 after just one season in the Championship, introduced into the side slowly but surely, never looked back.

Walcott, handful of appearances for Southampton off the bench, Arsenal developed him properly, never looked back.

The point is, none of these players were loaned out to develop. They don't need it. They had proper man management and were introduced into the first team properly.

Moyes has mismanaged Barkley dramatically. He's kicking the confidence out of the lad. He doesn't need this loan; he needs Premier League football time at Everton.

The fact remains that they were nurtured through championship academies,
Premiership clubs have bought them because they were better than the kids they were developing.
Imo that makes the ****ty championships cloggers better at producing players.
If Ross Barkley has the ability to succeed he won't lose it by playing championship football.
Remember Swansea and Norwich played some of the best footy in the premier last season fresh from several years in the cloggers league.