Stadium Thread - ALL Kirkby/Stadium Discussion Here

[Inner-city]

Everton cannot demonstrate a need for a 50,000-seat stadium in Kirkby; last season Everton’s average attendance was 37,000

Oh No!!! Not old one. A new stadium with top class facilities and ease of access will attract a hell of lot more than a crock like GP. Highbury was about the same size as GP and look what they get at the Emirates. They are sorry they have had a 70,000 seater now.

The transport plan is fraught with difficulty. The transport infrastructure of a town of 40,000 is ill equipped to accommodate a temporary surge in use by an additional 30,000 to 50,000 visitors. In the absence of any tangible improvements to that infrastructure, a reluctance by Knowsley Council to accommodate additional vehicles in the town and a national policy to discourage car journeys, a range of measures, that have been described by the applicants transport expert as “trailblazing” and “not used by any other football club”, will be put in place to manage visitors to the Kirkby stadium. A two-mile car exclusion zone, extending beyond Kirkby, will be in operation around the stadium on matchdays

Good point. The rapid-transit Merseyrail station needs to be diverted to the stadium, or the stadium to it, and throughput increased to 30,000 per hour. Rapid-transit should be a pre-cursor. Those noddy trams that are now not going to be built, and the club and Kirkby were lauding as answering the transport problem, would do nothing and are so slow it is a joke. They beat the bus to Liverpool centre by 5 minutes.

Kirkby is 9 miles from Liverpool City centre; the average distance for a premiership club being 2.6 miles.

Not a valid point.

The restrictions already placed upon the stadium will limit the opportunities for Everton to generate non-football revenue.

Good point.

The stadium needs to expand to 70,000 plus if need be and have a rapid-transit rail station near. With the station and expansion the project is a no-goer, people will spend hours in jams going to and from game.

I have nothing against Kirkby as a location, These three points need to there, otherwise a failure.

• Expansion to 70,000 plus
• Adjacent or integrated Rapid-transit rail station shifting 30-40,000 per hour
• Other non-football events staged

 

[DENNIS STEVENS]

Oh No!!! Not old one. A new stadium with top class facilities and ease of access will attract a hell of lot more than a crock like GP. Highbury was about the same size as GP and look what they get at the Emirates. They are sorry they have had a 70,000 seater now.



Good point. The rapid-transit Merseyrail station needs to be diverted to the stadium, or the stadium to it, and throughput increased to 30,000 per hour. Rapid-transit should be a pre-cursor. Those noddy trams that are now not going to be built, and the club and Kirkby were lauding as answering the transport problem, would do nothing and are so slow it is a joke. They beat the bus to Liverpool centre by 5 minutes.



Not a valid point.



Good point.

The stadium needs to expand to 70,000 plus if need be and have a rapid-transit rail station near. With the station and expansion the project is a no-goer, people will spend hours in jams going to and from game.

I have nothing against Kirkby as a location, These three points need to there, otherwise a failure.

• Expansion to 70,000 plus
• Adjacent or integrated Rapid-transit rail station shifting 30-40,000 per hour
• Other non-football events staged

some good points there. although i think there was a bit of a waiting list for season tickets at highbury & so they were increasing capacity to meet demand somewhat. let's also remember arsenal, when relocating from woolwich to highbury, did exactly the opposite of everton propose to do as they felt the club wouldn't thrive in a small town with limited potential to grow their attendances.

a very large capacity is not an immediate requirement but planning ahead in terms of stadium design & other relevant factors so that we can expand further in the future should be a pre-requisite for any new stadium.

 

[Inner-city]

some good points there. although i think there was a bit of a waiting list for season tickets at highbury & so they were increasing capacity to meet demand somewhat. let's also remember arsenal, when relocating from woolwich to highbury, did exactly the opposite of everton propose to do as they felt the club wouldn't thrive in a small town with limited potential to grow their attendances.

Are you serious? Kirkby is basically a suburb of Liverpool. There are no fields between.

Arsenal were winning this hence demand.

a very large capacity is not an immediate requirement but planning ahead in terms of stadium design & other relevant factors so that we can expand further in the future should be a pre-requisite for any new stadium.

60,000 minimum, for starters. To really make it work rapid transit rail needs to be there, otherwise it may be a flop. I find it amazing that of all the stuff over the years I have read on a new stadium no one have ever taken this aspect seriously. Liverpool/Merseyside has a comprehensive network, yet no one recognises its importance or if it exists.

If people can get in and out quick and in comfort they will turn up. In a freezing February, taking a Merseyrail train directly to a stadium with a roof rolled over will appeal and get them turning up.

The appeal of the club increases with a top class facility. What happens at GP, which is few plus points overall, does not follow in a new stadium.

 

[DENNIS STEVENS]

Are you serious? Kirkby is basically a suburb of Liverpool. There are no fields between.

Arsenal were winning this hence demand.


60,000 minimum, for starters. To really make it work rapid transit rail needs to be there, otherwise it may be a flop. I find it amazing that of all the stuff over the years I have read on a new stadium no one have ever taken this aspect seriously. Liverpool/Merseyside has a comprehensive network, yet no one recognises its importance or if it exists.

If people can get in and out quick and in comfort they will turn up. In a freezing February, taking a Merseyrail train directly to a stadium with a roof rolled over will appeal and get them turning up.

The appeal of the club increases with a top class facility. What happens at GP, which is few plus points overall, does not follow in a new stadium.

Are you serious? I have driven along the M57 & fields there are. However, that's of no relevance to the issue under debate. The point was that Arsenal decided into the heart of a large city from the outlying fringes & Everton are doing the opposite.

Yes Arsenal were winning - you may not have noticed but the more successful clubs often seem to attract bigger gates - therefore we will need the potential to expand if we're successful & demand increases.

Transport is one of the biggest issues regarding the stadium but the club & its "partners" in this venture seem to only pay lip service to it.

Even so, do people just want to be zipped in & out of the stadium for the match alone? For many the whole match day experience is a big part of what their support is about : the travelling, meeting up with mates, having a few jars, the match itself, the aftermatch analysis over a meal or a few more jars. Not really expecting this in Kirkby, tbh.

I'm not against a new stadium as such, but it needs to be in the right place & have the right infrastructure, social as well as transport.

 

[BlackToffee]

A London equivalent to Kirkby..

I was thinking about an issue where people were trying to equate a move in London to one from Everton to Kirkby to illustrate how disasterous the place was.

Got me thinking and the only real equivalent I can think of is Millwall's move to the New Den. They were based in the borough of Lewisham (me old manor). They've moved 3 miles down the road, but they are in the borough of Soutwark.

Both are poor boroughs, not sure which is poorer. I suppose if they'd moved further into Southwark (they're off the Old Kent Road) into Peckham, i'd begin to see the difference. Peckham in parts is a hell hole, even though its another of my manors. (know what i mean guv) I wouldn't want to go back.

If the context is the same, I can understand some people being against Kirkby on the basis of it being Kirkby. But as Dan has already pointed out, house prices are actually higher in Kirkby than Walton, but I don't have a full socio-economic profile to compare Walton with Kirkby. Sometimes these things are about feelings and opinions.

Anyway just some musings.

 

[DENNIS STEVENS]

I've got no argument with Kirkby as a place - or the fact that it's across a line on the map. My gripe is that the proposal doesn't offer enough for the club or the supporters. Tbh, even if there were no infrastructure issues, I'd be feeling the club hadn't struck a very good deal with our "partners".

 

[davek]

I've got no argument with Kirkby as a place - or the fact that it's across a line on the map. My gripe is that the proposal doesn't offer enough for the club or the supporters. Tbh, even if there were no infrastructure issues, I'd be feeling the club hadn't struck a very good deal with our "partners".

No, me neither. And yes, it is just a marking on a map. It's part of a wider 'greater Liverpool' with strong ties to the city. But some people need to understand it is a town with it's own identity, and that matters too. "Basically a suburb of Liverpool". Jesus wept.

 

[Nebbiolo]

I was thinking about an issue where people were trying to equate a move in London to one from Everton to Kirkby to illustrate how disasterous the place was.

Got me thinking and the only real equivalent I can think of is Millwall's move to the New Den. They were based in the borough of Lewisham (me old manor). They've moved 3 miles down the road, but they are in the borough of Soutwark.

Both are poor boroughs, not sure which is poorer. I suppose if they'd moved further into Southwark (they're off the Old Kent Road) into Peckham, i'd begin to see the difference. Peckham in parts is a hell hole, even though its another of my manors. (know what i mean guv) I wouldn't want to go back.

If the context is the same, I can understand some people being against Kirkby on the basis of it being Kirkby. But as Dan has already pointed out, house prices are actually higher in Kirkby than Walton, but I don't have a full socio-economic profile to compare Walton with Kirkby. Sometimes these things are about feelings and opinions.

Anyway just some musings.

The difference between Gtr London and Merseyside is vast, though. Even in the most depressed areas of London, there exist many of those facilities that a football club should be close to. I don't think Kirkby has anything to be honest, other than houses, flats and a few pubs. I don't think its about it being a poor area, so much as its a depressed area that can't thrive in any way due to its location in an already poor region of the area.

All the action in Merseyside is in the central bits. As a city, Liverpool has changed so much during the last decade. It's started to thrive again. It's cool, modern but has links to a huge and varied history. Everton can make use of that. Liverpool is an excellent brand, Kirkby isn't.

 

[Goat]

1 K in Kirby, theres only 1 K in kirby!!!

 

[Lao]

Too Ar*e in Wirral, is it you?

 

[Inner-city]

Transport is one of the biggest issues regarding the stadium but the club & its "partners" in this venture seem to only pay lip service to it.

Even so, do people just want to be zipped in & out of the stadium for the match alone? For many the whole match day experience is a big part of what their support is about :

My matchday experience is not being a 2 hour traffic jam. Stop being such a self-centred footy fan, no wonder they are not taken seriously. The local residents don't need the nuisance of a large footy stadium. Best get fans to the door by rapid-transit rail, right into the stadium is best, as Lords are considering. In Lords the fans can stay inside the place. The matchday experience is inside the stadium.

 

[Azzbot]

Kirkby town centre is an absolute dump, this stadium will be the best thing that's ever happened to it. They are going to get a brand new shopping bit and everything.

I'm still against it mind.

 

[davek]

My matchday experience is not being a 2 hour traffic jam. Stop being such a self-centred footy fan, no wonder they are not taken seriously. The local residents don't need the nuisance of a large footy stadium. Best get fans to the door by rapid-transit rail, right into the stadium is best, as Lords are considering. In Lords the fans can stay inside the place. The matchday experience is inside the stadium.

Are you in favour of a rapid transit rail?

 

[Goat]

Are you in favour of a rapid transit rail?

He loves it. Every post has said it. But I take it thats the point you are making.

 

[davek]

He loves it. Every post has said it. But I take it thats the point you are making.

It is his hobby horse like.