The Everton Board Thread (Inc. Bill Kenwright / Blue Union)

[MACCA75]

There's a bit more to it than that though. I think Lerner would have been better to stick with O'Neil. Equally Fernandes screwed up with the Warnock, Hughes, Redknapp saga. All those changes are very costly.

O'Neil resigned.

 

[Neiler]

I'll be interested to see what happens at Villa, especially if they go down. I don't think you could really say that Lerner has 'destroyed' them unless he pulls out and calls in all debts. Things aren't looking good at the moment though.

I still think they had a great opportunity but blew it through poor managerial appointments, and that it would have been different story if Lerner had bought Everton and given Moyes £200m to put together a Champions League quality team.

Many owners have been to blame for clubs getting into trouble, but I'd say the likes of Lerner and Fernandes are examples of why it's dangerous to blindly place your fortune in the hands of 'football people' and assume they know what they're doing.

TBH mate, he hasnt given anything hes lent money and charged interest on it back to him annually, if hes there for 10 years hes taken over 100mill out of Villa. The started with 0 debt they have 130 and are lossing 50 mill a season, if they go down there Pompey.

Just to clarify he hasnt given them a bean, hes lent it and charged them for it. Its like us borrowing 130 mill from the bank and getting spanked on interest hes charging interest and a fee of over 10 mill a year 15 % of what Villa make.

Regardles of on the pitch, which is pretty cat, hes run that football club into the ground of it. Hes a bad carpet bagger who will walk away with 10s of millions in his back pocket if not more and leave Villa fans to their tears and lower tier football.

 

[Carlito]

TBH mate, he hasnt given anything hes lent money and charged interest on it back to him annually, if hes there for 10 years hes taken over 100mill out of Villa. The started with 0 debt they have 130 and are lossing 50 mill a season, if they go down there Pompey.

Just to clarify he hasnt given them a bean, hes lent it and charged them for it. Its like us borrowing 130 mill from the bank and getting spanked on interest hes charging interest and a fee of over 10 mill a year 15 % of what Villa make.

Regardles of on the pitch, which is pretty cat, hes run that football club into the ground of it. Hes a bad carpet bagger who will walk away with 10s of millions in his back pocket if not more and leave Villa fans to their tears and lower tier football.

When Lerner came in Villa had just finished 16th and had no money to spend on improving their team, so despite being debt free they weren't exactly in a strong position. They gambled and it hasn't paid off, but it's highly unlikely they'd still be in the Premier League if Doug Ellis had remained in charge.

It's a bit over the top to say they're going to end up like Portsmouth if they go down. Watching the club go out of business would be of no benefit to Lerner seeing as though the debt is owed to him.

How do Everton's interest payments compare to Villa's?

 

[davek]

TBH mate, he hasnt given anything hes lent money and charged interest on it back to him annually, if hes there for 10 years hes taken over 100mill out of Villa. The started with 0 debt they have 130 and are lossing 50 mill a season, if they go down there Pompey.

Just to clarify he hasnt given them a bean, hes lent it and charged them for it. Its like us borrowing 130 mill from the bank and getting spanked on interest hes charging interest and a fee of over 10 mill a year 15 % of what Villa make.

Regardles of on the pitch, which is pretty cat, hes run that football club into the ground of it. Hes a bad carpet bagger who will walk away with 10s of millions in his back pocket if not more and leave Villa fans to their tears and lower tier football.

That sounds like another football club who has to pay back loans to 'good friends' of their club. Can you think who it is?

 

[Neiler]

When Lerner came in Villa had just finished 16th and had no money to spend on improving their team, so despite being debt free they weren't exactly in a strong position. They gambled and it hasn't paid off, but it's highly unlikely they'd still be in the Premier League if Doug Ellis had remained in charge.

It's a bit over the top to say they're going to end up like Portsmouth if they go down. Watching the club go out of business would be of no benefit to Lerner seeing as though the debt is owed to him.

How do Everton's interest payments compare to Villa's?

What was highly unlikely about it Ellis was chairman for collectively 40 years without being relegated - thats nonsence. It amazes me despite the fact you see this as a gamble that hasnt paid of, russian roulette with the clubs future and they are about to bite the bullit. Learner can walk away, with 10 of millions pocketed and still be owed his principal, interest and management fee - i dont understand why this isnt plain.

I dont see why its over the top if they go down they have exactly the same debts and more importantly wage bill, that both Pompey and Leeds did.

As for a comparrison on interest rates, its frightening that you cant make the distincition between the owner of a club, lending his own club money and taking 15% of what the club makes annually out of that club in fees and interest. Its equally simplistic to to do a comparrison, but to answer your question, quite favaroably when you look at the interest on 40 mill and compare it to 130 mill.

Im amazed anyone can view this as a gamble that went wrong.

 

[Neiler]

That sounds like another football club who has to pay back loans to 'good friends' of their club. Can you think who it is?

I dont believe it to be honest mate, but by the sounds of some opinions in this thread maybe even if your own, this is the preferred model.

 

[kenada_blue]

From the Blecher Report mate:



Now im not defending our board here, as there are clear areas we should b doing better in but can you imagine if Bill took 15% revenue out of Everton in Interest and management fees. Hence the idiocy of people lauding Learner, when hes racked up 130 mill in debt from 0 on takeover, has the club on the brink of relegation, has nearly a 100% wage to turnover ratio, is posting losses of 50mill + a season and taking 15% of whatever the club makes for himself. Its scary that people still think hes the cats pyjamas. Im certainly not against a take over, but not to someone like Learner, he will have destroyed Aston Villa by the time anyone noticed - i predicted this years ago.

But the view is, take all that debt and loss, remove relegation fights and add European nights in the champions league and maybe a trophy..... Would those figures be sustainable /workable?

If we got 4th this season, our debt would increase significantly. Elstone has said previously we wouldn't be able to cope with champions league football.

It comes with the territory. It's how you manage it.

 

[Carlito]

What was highly unlikely about it Ellis was chairman for collectively 40 years without being relegated - thats nonsence. It amazes me despite the fact you see this as a gamble that hasnt paid of, russian roulette with the clubs future and they are about to bite the bullit. Learner can walk away, with 10 of millions pocketed and still be owed his principal, interest and management fee - i dont understand why this isnt plain.

I dont see why its over the top if they go down they have exactly the same debts and more importantly wage bill, that both Pompey and Leeds did.

As for a comparrison on interest rates, its frightening that you cant make the distincition between the owner of a club, lending his own club money and taking 15% of what the club makes annually out of that club in fees and interest. Its equally simplistic to to do a comparrison, but to answer your question, quite favaroably when you look at the interest on 40 mill and compare it to 130 mill.

Im amazed anyone can view this as a gamble that went wrong.

Ellis was unable to fund a Premier League football club in the post-Abramovich era, which is why he finally stepped down and sold to Lerner. They were a team in serious decline without the money to improve.

You seem convinced that Lerner has bought Villa for the fun of watching them burn as he pockets tens of millions, when in fact they're paying him a lower interest rate than Everton are to Barclays (10%) and whoever the recipient of 'other operating costs' is. The only way Villa are going to do a Portsmouth/Leeds is if Lerner decides he wants them to.

 

[Neiler]

Ellis was unable to fund a Premier League football club in the post-Abramovich era, which is why he finally stepped down and sold to Lerner. They were a team in serious decline without the money to improve.

You seem convinced that Lerner has bought Villa for the fun of watching them burn as he pockets tens of millions, when in fact they're paying him a lower interest rate than Everton are to Barclays (10%) and whoever the recipient of 'other operating costs' is. The only way Villa are going to do a Portsmouth/Leeds is if Lerner decides he wants them to.

We will have to let the future play out disagree with just about everything you've posted and i know your figures are wrong, Barckleys are a minor part of our over all debt in fact its an overdraft facility and at 10% is pretty good, the prudential deal is widley accepted of the best value deal of this type in football, Newcastle took one out at 12%.

We will agree to differ, if your Lerner fan stick to your guns, but remember were you heard it - ive been proved and will am confident of continuing to be right, i called everything thats happened since correct since O Neill was there.

Right of out for lunch with the gfriend!

 

[Bally8]

Got my crystal ball out and this thread will be in meltdown tomorrow!

 

[Neiler]

But the view is, take all that debt and loss, remove relegation fights and add European nights in the champions league and maybe a trophy..... Would those figures be sustainable /workable?

If we got 4th this season, our debt would increase significantly. Elstone has said previously we wouldn't be able to cope with champions league football.

It comes with the territory. It's how you manage it.

I dont think its that simplistic mate, i think that what a lot of Villa fans a beleived and hoped for, away from that hes set up a complex buisness arrangement to line his pockets and heap debt on the club, for a club he paid next to nothing for with no debt, its a goose that has laid a golden egg for him, tbh i smell a big time rat with Lerner. Rather then the have a go hero you suggest for the reasons i have repeatedly stated. Hes run the club into the ground and still continues to take 15% of revenue - that inexcusable and doesnt really suggest the have a go hero picture some are painting here. I know for a fact he was furious he had to put 25mill into the club to stop it going under, hence his reluctance to do anything for the last couple of seasons.

 

[MACCA75]

We will have to let the future play out disagree with just about everything you've posted and i know your figures are wrong, Barckleys are a minor part of our over all debt in fact its an overdraft facility and at 10% is pretty good, the prudential deal is widley accepted of the best value deal of this type in football, Newcastle took one out at 12%.

We will agree to differ, if your Lerner fan stick to your guns, but remember were you heard it - ive been proved and will am confident of continuing to be right, i called everything thats happened since correct since O Neill was there.

Right of out for lunch with the gfriend!

If she orders the steak i'm sure you will convince her that it's a far more viable business model to simply have the garlic bread and a glass of water. And you are convinced you will be proven correct on this.

 

[Neiler]

If she orders the steak i'm sure you will convince her that it's a far more viable business model to simply have the garlic bread and a glass of water. And you are convinced you will be proven correct on this.

Nah mate got to speculate when it comes to quality.

 

[Carlito]

We will have to let the future play out disagree with just about everything you've posted and i know your figures are wrong, Barckleys are a minor part of our over all debt in fact its an overdraft facility and at 10% is pretty good, the prudential deal is widley accepted of the best value deal of this type in football, Newcastle took one out at 12%.

We will agree to differ, if your Lerner fan stick to your guns, but remember were you heard it - ive been proved and will am confident of continuing to be right, i called everything thats happened since correct since O Neill was there.

Right of out for lunch with the gfriend!

All I can say is that if you think Lerner is that bad, you must be truly appalled by Kenwright's antics over the last ten years.

 

[Neiler]

All I can say is that if you think Lerner is that bad, you must be truly appalled by Kenwright's antics over the last ten years.

I would be if they were anything like that Lid. Id also be all over it.