Usmanov

[ForeverBlue92]

Why are people still arguing the toss with Kev, 51, unemployed from the Kop.

 

[mahermi1]

No it was to stop the effect that another City or Chelsea has on the whole of Football.

Look at the effect PSG's ridiculous purchase of Neymar had on the market. Prices near enough doubled over night.

It should have stopped a lot earlier though, years ago Liverpool were taken over or had cash injections pumped in, Granada bought 20% of them I think. United were taken over, Spurs, Arsenal. This is why these clubs were allowed to get so far ahead, nothing stopped their spending and they had carte Blanche on all the trophies.

 

[blulouie]

It was basically Manchester United having a tantrum when City came into money.

Noisy neighbours.

 

[Catfish Blues]

It doesn't add up though. Take the £30m announced at the AGM that has been ring fenced for the Stadium so doesn't help with a push for top 4. The other thing that was announced was that the sponsorship for Finch Farm had increased by £6m to £12m. Sounds good until you look at the accounts and see that the £6m was more than wiped out by paying £7m in interest charges. Why is a billionaire with supposed pretty unlimited wealth allowing £7m that could of been used on pushing for top 4 to flow out of the Club.

If you look at the accounts properly, roughly half of the interest charges is just down to how FRS 102 insists on dealing with the sales ( and purchases ) of players, and most of that half is balanced by interest received on the sales of player, so the 7 million figure, while accurate in accountancy terms, isn't accurate in real world terms


Looking at the current debt situation, you'll see we owe substantially less than we did twelve months ago, and our debt has reduced by just under 40 million, from 75 to 36 million, so, even you, with your unique view on the world, would presumably agree that things are moving in the right direction.

Obviously you'll now move the goalposts somewhere else, because that's what you do, and I can only admire your technique.

 

[gwladysnight]

lollol

I mean... He's not just some little bookkeeper who sits at his tiny little desk capturing supplier invoices into a crappy little accounting system.

The Mosh is a qualified Charted Accountant who did his articles at Deliottes, and probably has experience auditing some of the biggest listed companies in the country, not to mention his time spent in Usmanov's multi-billion pound companies, probably as a CFO. The dude knows his stuff, FFS!

I think people need to make up their mind. Do they want Moshiri to act as a financially prudent accountant or do they want him to act as an unhinged maverick who doesn't care how much dough he blows. You can't have both.

 

[mahermi1]

No it was to stop the effect that another City or Chelsea has on the whole of Football.

Look at the effect PSG's ridiculous purchase of Neymar had on the market. Prices near enough doubled over night.

Isn't that the same thing, it's like flogging a dead horse with you mate, pointless.

 

[Brisan123]

I think people need to make up their mind. Do they want Moshiri to act as a financially prudent accountant or do they want him to act as an unhinged maverick who doesn't care how much dough he blows. You can't have both.

I want Moshiri to act as a prudent accountant as that is what he does

However I want Usmanov to keep on spending like an unhinged maverick

 

[Tommy Chong]

I think people need to make up their mind. Do they want Moshiri to act as a financially prudent accountant or do they want him to act as an unhinged maverick who doesn't care how much dough he blows. You can't have both.

Mate, at the end of the day, to me it doesn't matter what other people think. A qualified CA with as much experience as the Mosh will have done his homework.

By that, I mean he would have done costing exercises, budgeting forecasts ect... And I'm pretty sure he would ensure that the finance department at Everton Football Club Company Ltd is filled with more than competent finance staff. He'll know when we can spend big and when we need to be prudent.

 

[catcherintherye]

City didn't get away with it.

In 2014 they were fined £49m, had a spending cap introduced had their squad for the Champions League reduced by one player and had to agree not to increase their wage bill.

They have been charged for a second time and are awaiting the decision of the CFCB after an appeal to the CAS was thrown out.

Ah ok, well I stand corrected on that then. Was that for the stadium sponsorship at the level of 80 million?

I am right in saying that if it's being appealed, it hasn't yet been upheld?

 

[gwladysnight]

If you look at the accounts properly, roughly half of the interest charges is just down to how FRS 102 insists on dealing with the sales ( and purchases ) of players, and most of that half is balanced by interest received on the sales of player, so the 7 million figure, while accurate in accountancy terms, isn't accurate in real world terms


Looking at the current debt situation, you'll see we owe substantially less than we did twelve months ago, and our debt has reduced by just under 40 million, from 75 to 36 million, so, even you, with your unique view on the world, would presumably agree that things are moving in the right direction.


View attachment 76812

Obviously you'll now move the goalposts somewhere else, because that's what you do, and I can only admire your technique.

Please explain why a couple of billionaires are paying an interest rate of 3.5% when they have supposedly unlimited funds.

Please explain why we have gone back to taking loans from Rights and Media Funding Limited. A company that changed it's name from JG.

Here is what Elstone said about JG.

At Everton’s AGM in November 2015, the CEO Robert Elstone castigated shareholders who asked questions about Green’s potential involvement before revealing that the club’s net debt had increased from £28.1m in 2013–14 to £31.3m in 2014–15, despite announcing a record turnover and bumper new TV deal.“We have three sources of lending,” he said. “We have a long-term loan with the Prudential that expires in 2026, an overdraft with Barclays that is not enough to manage the day-to-day cash flow of the football club and, to address that, we borrow from JG Funding (a private company) against the TV money. It is all fully disclosed in our accounts, is approved by the Premier League and paid back at the end of the year.”

In effect taking a pay day loan secured against the TV money until the end of the season. That really sounds like a club in rude health.

 

[Toffeelover]

Mandelson was never foreign sec. Mingle or get so wasted at a private party with Russian oligarchs that you're pictured visably wrecked the next day? Keep on telling yourself that's fine.

Mate what the F does it matter? history.

 

[gwladysnight]

Ah ok, well I stand corrected on that then. Was that for the stadium sponsorship at the level of 80 million?

I am right in saying that if it's being appealed, it hasn't yet been upheld?

The first breach regarded payments to players signed pre 2010, the £350m stadium naming rights deal and a dispute over £47m of IP rights.

The second charge relates to issues uncovered from the email leaks. In essence that City have misled UEFA over the sources of Sponsorship.

Bizarrely City put in an appeal before the CFCB an independent panel of judges and lawyers had even reached a verdict. Unpredictably CAS immediately through out the appeal.

 

[PeregrineT]

Please explain why a couple of billionaires are paying an interest rate of 3.5% when they have supposedly unlimited funds.

You really dont understand even the basics of finances. Why in the world would someone sit 500 million of their money on an asset, when they could borrow 500 million at 3.5%, and use their 500 million in investments getting them a 5-6% return. Saving 3.5% is a terrible rate of return for their money. You start with 500 million:

Option A: You put all 500 million into asset. 500 million loan over 10 years at 3.5% means paying 93 million in interest, so you save 93 million. At the end of 10 years, you have 500 million in cash plus asset.

Option B: You get 500 million loan at 3.5%, and at the end of 10 years have paid 93 million in interest. You invest 500 million in another asset, and get a 5% return. At the end of 10 years you have 814 million. Minus the 93 million in interest, at the end of 10 years you have 722 million in cash plus asset.

722 million > 500 million.

 

[Catfish Blues]

Obviously you'll now move the goalposts somewhere else, because that's what you do, and I can only admire your technique.

As predicted !

Please explain why a couple of billionaires are paying an interest rate of 3.5% when they have supposedly unlimited funds.

Please explain why we have gone back to taking loans from Rights and Media Funding Limited. A company that changed it's name from JG.

Here is what Elstone said about JG.

At Everton’s AGM in November 2015, the CEO Robert Elstone castigated shareholders who asked questions about Green’s potential involvement before revealing that the club’s net debt had increased from £28.1m in 2013–14 to £31.3m in 2014–15, despite announcing a record turnover and bumper new TV deal.“We have three sources of lending,” he said. “We have a long-term loan with the Prudential that expires in 2026, an overdraft with Barclays that is not enough to manage the day-to-day cash flow of the football club and, to address that, we borrow from JG Funding (a private company) against the TV money. It is all fully disclosed in our accounts, is approved by the Premier League and paid back at the end of the year.”

In effect taking a pay day loan secured against the TV money until the end of the season. That really sounds like a club in rude health.

Cashflow - which, at 3.5% will equate to about 1.2 million.

While we're on "Please Explains"

Please explain why Moshiri has provided interest free loans of 350 million so far.
Please explain why, up to the end of June, we've accrued costs of just under 19 million, and counting, towards buying a new stadium
Please explain why we've bothered to submit an application for Planning Permission
Please explain why we're looking to fund a stadium build
Please explain why we've recruited Carlo Ancelotti

Actually, don't bother, you're pretty much a waste of time and effort.

 

[street end]

You really dont understand even the basics of finances. Why in the world would someone sit 500 million of their money on an asset, when they could borrow 500 million at 3.5%, and use their 500 million in investments getting them a 5-6% return. Saving 3.5% is a terrible rate of return for their money. You start with 500 million:

Option A: You put all 500 million into asset. 500 million loan over 10 years at 3.5% means paying 93 million in interest, so you save 93 million. At the end of 10 years, you have 500 million in cash plus asset.

Option B: You get 500 million loan at 3.5%, and at the end of 10 years have paid 93 million in interest. You invest 500 million in another asset, and get a 5% return. At the end of 10 years you have 814 million. Minus the 93 million in interest, at the end of 10 years you have 722 million in cash plus asset.

722 million > 500 million.

If you do option A and put all 500 million in to the asset, at the end of it you don’t have 500 million and the asset, you have the value of the asset. Unless we are talking about having a 1bn investment ?