ECHO Comment: "Fears of Witch-hunt Against Liverpool FC" part 3

[catcherintherye]

Suppose its the same argument as James Rodriguez, when you have the opportunity to bring in class try to do it. But 200k a week when he is 33, is the trap Barca sleepwalked into

Yes I mean there is that. There's a few differences. I mean however good a player Thiago is, you wouldnt really put him into the same category as James, who is a cut above (which is meant as no disrespect to Thiago, but there are levels in football).

You'd also say, we are signing lads of that age because it's consistent with the manager we have and as a sign of weakness. They are- at least on the outside of it buying from a position of strength. So it's interesting they've gone down this route. You'd also have to factor that their squad is an ageing one already (top 6 for the oldest squads last season) and they don't have many in that 21-25 band coming through but lots in the 26-30 area (Alisson, VVD, Robertson, Matip, Salah, Henderson, Mane, Firmino, Wijnaldum, Fabinho etc, I'm sure I've missed a few!). He seems to add to it rather than take away from it.

You always know they pay big bonuses too. The delcared salary is often half what their salary comes too with bonuses, sometimes more so. You don't blow Chelsea and Manchetser City out of the water on wages if you're top player is only on 200k p/w. They incentivise them. In fairness it's a smart business staregy that has worked well for them. However expect Thiago's real wages with bonuses to be 400k p/w, which as you say is huge for a lad going well into his 30's, expected to play under a Klopp system in the PL.

I wonder if Klopp will switch to playing a 10?

 

[Michaelcoyb]

I think they’ve realised the risk of stagnation.

 

[catcherintherye]

we didn't have to sell anyone to fund james though, nevermind two players, especially their two main strike backups for an area they're heavily stocked in. They spent £140m on keita, fabinho and oxlade-chamberlain to play in centre mid in the last couple of years. Weird decision to buy another.

I can't think of any strikers they'll have now after firmino if they got rid of origi and brewster. Their hedging their bets they'll get no injuries again like they usually do.

They've got that Minamino who's played about 15 competitive games for them and not scored.

 

[tsubaki]

200k per week apparently. Seems a rather odd deal at £30m for a 29 year old whos best years are behind him.

Seems like Origi and Brewster will be sold to fund it. He's a good player, but a tad puzzling, seems a bit of panic has set in.

Brewster is an odd one, you’d think he would fit into that way of playing and be a replacement for one of them when they age / get sold etc.

Also I signed him for Wrexham in FM 2019 and he absolutely tears it up on there.

 

[catcherintherye]

Brewster is an odd one, you’d think he would fit into that way of playing and be a replacement for one of them when they age / get sold etc.

Also I signed him for Wrexham in FM 2019 and he absolutely tears it up on there.

Brewster does seem odd. You'd think he would just slot in over Firmino. Some talk about him having potential akin to Hudson Odoi.

He's stagnated at Liverpool as they haveb't utilised him properly.

 

[zukai12_]

Thiago is a worryingly good signing to be fair

 

[Charles Plastusz]

Thiago is a really gifted player to be fair. Absolutely hilarious the difference in coverage compared to James though. Thiago has always been quite brittle yet theirs zero mention of whether or not he can manage with physicality etc. Also changes the orc playing style as they’ll have to lose a drug frenzied headless chicken to accommodate him

 

[Blue Shoes]

They've got that Minamino who's played about 15 competitive games for them and not scored.

ah, that's what he was bought for, he'll be a new player now though. He's developed ashtma over the off season and as i said before, miraculously is now scoring in every pre-season game and the charity shield, he's managed to magically adapt to the english game without actually playing any english opposition.

 

[number4.]

we didn't have to sell anyone to fund james though, nevermind two players, especially their two main strike backups for an area they're heavily stocked in. They spent £140m on keita, fabinho and oxlade-chamberlain to play in centre mid in the last couple of years. Weird decision to buy another.

I can't think of any strikers they'll have now after firmino if they got rid of origi and brewster. Their hedging their bets they'll get no injuries again like they usually do.

Yep

Yes I mean there is that. There's a few differences. I mean however good a player Thiago is, you wouldnt really put him into the same category as James, who is a cut above (which is meant as no disrespect to Thiago, but there are levels in football).

You'd also say, we are signing lads of that age because it's consistent with the manager we have and as a sign of weakness. They are- at least on the outside of it buying from a position of strength. So it's interesting they've gone down this route. You'd also have to factor that their squad is an ageing one already (top 6 for the oldest squads last season) and they don't have many in that 21-25 band coming through but lots in the 26-30 area (Alisson, VVD, Robertson, Matip, Salah, Henderson, Mane, Firmino, Wijnaldum, Fabinho etc, I'm sure I've missed a few!). He seems to add to it rather than take away from it.

You always know they pay big bonuses too. The delcared salary is often half what their salary comes too with bonuses, sometimes more so. You don't blow Chelsea and Manchetser City out of the water on wages if you're top player is only on 200k p/w. They incentivise them. In fairness it's a smart business staregy that has worked well for them. However expect Thiago's real wages with bonuses to be 400k p/w, which as you say is huge for a lad going well into his 30's, expected to play under a Klopp system in the PL.

I wonder if Klopp will switch to playing a 10?

Really interesting catcher and agree with nearly all of it. I would guess that they have been hit hard by Covid & have taken the decision to hold what they have for one more year as now is too messy in terms of many in &outs. There is a huge advantage for any team that can hit the ground running this year & us getting our business done early & getting the three playing is massive in that context

Next year will be their true test, they will have all of their key players (thiago included) turning 30 and will essentially need to rebuild. Fully expect them to get rid of at least two of they big names and look to bring in youth.

I think thiago was just an opportunity they couldnt refuse, which probably isn't the best the transfer strategy & one we have fallen for too many times.

Re your final question of playing a 10, the one bit of real logic I see around them signing Thiago is the formation freedom he provides. They have struggled with "low block" / shutting down the FB's, I wouldnt be surprised to see them throw out a few varied formations with Thiago available. He also releases Fabinho to cover at centre half as required

 

[catcherintherye]

Really interesting catcher and agree with nearly all of it. I would guess that they have been hit hard by Covid & have taken the decision to hold what they have for one more year as now is too messy in terms of many in &outs. There is a huge advantage for any team that can hit the ground running this year & us getting our business done early & getting the three playing is massive in that context

Next year will be their true test, they will have all of their key players (thiago included) turning 30 and will essentially need to rebuild. Fully expect them to get rid of at least two of they big names and look to bring in youth.

I think thiago was just an opportunity they couldnt refuse, which probably isn't the best the transfer strategy & one we have fallen for too many times.

Re your final question of playing a 10, the one bit of real logic I see around them signing Thiago is the formation freedom he provides. They have struggled with "low block" / shutting down the FB's, I wouldnt be surprised to see them throw out a few varied formations with Thiago available. He also releases Fabinho to cover at centre half as required

Some interesting points there.

They've had a method that has worked very well for them, so it's interesting to see a shift from it. Maybe Klopp has made it clear he won;t be staying long term? Maybe they can see where United/Chelsea are at with younger players, and to a degree Arsenal and know beyond next season it will be hard to compete with them medium term so have focussed on this season. Something feels out of kilter though.

There's no doubt they've been hit very hard by covid, I've explained how multiple times. They are not the only club, but are in a sweet spot of clubs who tick a lot of boxes for difficulties. So I do think there's an acknowledgement they can't really compete for your Havertz, or even your Werners currently (never mind your Sancho's or Mbappes) and probably wont be doing so for the medium term.

Their team is hitting that time, and when you factor in very little recruitment over a 2-3 year period you tend to see decline. You did with Spurs too, who are an obvious comparitor of what happens when you don't keep freshing a team up and let it grow old together. I don't think Spurs have hit rock bottom yet either, but you can see the decline. They've lost around 35% of performance ths far. A similar decline would see Liverpool drop to around 67 points. You've seen similar with City as well too, who are probably a year ahead of Liverpool in the process.

As for where he plays, I don't think he can deputise for Fabinho. Teams will run all over him if hes the sitting midfielder. I think he would need to play in the 10 and have that free role. If their plan is to play him as a 6, it's big problems.

 

[bilyaletdinov_]

Brilliant player, would have loved to see him at City. Think he'll be good at Liverpool but maybe not quite James good haha

 

[lesbattersby]

Unfortunately that's a great signing for them. Head and shoulders above their other center mids.

 

[Arteta10]

Thiago is a really gifted player to be fair. Absolutely hilarious the difference in coverage compared to James though. Thiago has always been quite brittle yet theirs zero mention of whether or not he can manage with physicality etc. Also changes the orc playing style as they’ll have to lose a drug frenzied headless chicken to accommodate him

I had exactly the same thought.

Not read a single comment from a journalist questioning whether he will ‘adjust to the league’.

And all my RS mates are creaming their pants about signing him after trotting out all the old cliches about Rodriguez ‘lot of money for a 29 year old dat lad, not done much last few years has he’ bla bla bla

 

[Piijt]

It’s incredible how, just in a matter of hours, 29 has become a great age for a new signing...

 

[SLICKDUDE468]

brilliant signing can't see past for the league tbh, city 1st 11 still has weaknesses.