ECHO Comment: "Fears of Witch-hunt Against Liverpool FC"

[catcherintherye]

I find that I must regularly rein my thoughts in and proverbially hold my tongue, when discussing "them".

I have quite a few LFC friends and work colleagues, and find them to a man, decent folk, some being privately embarrassed by the antics of their club and wider support.

The holier-than-thou attitude that is widespread, and the fawning over every other league clubs efforts for the Hillsborough memorial every year, are nauseating in the context of their own history. No attempt is made to commemorate other disasters, including Heysel, and so the hierarchy of victimhood is very firmly maintained.

Worse still however, is the media co-opting of this strategy to such a degree that they have an army of cheerleaders and apologists in every organisation.

I accept banter and rivalry, but their jibes and digs are often quite hard to stomach, given the absolute and deserved support we have given them for JFT96. They are the big brother that can't stand us getting any attention or credit. I actually thought that "Merry Christmas, Everton" was quite amusing though, I wish the more creative and imaginative of our fans could come up with a fitting response. All in jest, of course.

I agree with this almost entirely. The only thing I'd say would be around the Hillsborough stuff. The families have always been fantastic around that. It's shady the way some involved with Liverpool have tried to use the disaster to score points though. Making out the "murderers" song, however distasteful they may feel it is, is clearly not about Hillsborough but Heysel. The attempts to draw the two together, and liken the behaviour of the whoppers in Brussels to the poor victims at Hillsborough is not very becoming. When they mis appropriate songs that is exactly what they do.

However I am not willing to surrender the ground of Hillsborough to them. However much a layer of LFC fans (often not from the City) want to claim hegemony over the disaster we know it affected our City, our brothers, our friends and sisters, sons, daughters. But for the roll of a ball it would have been us. I'll always stand up for Hillsborough and that is true irrespective of m feeling for Heysel or LFC.

 

[B17BLG]

It seems I'm having my credentials of being a Blue questioned again as I'm going against the majority. Please, if people disagree with me, say so and give a reason instead of questioning my loyalty. Be constructive. It's very easy to just throw insults around and ignore the subject matter. If people disagree with me, fine. But don't ever question my loyalty to this Club. I'm off now. I won't be posting on here again as, it seems, some of you don't like fans having an alternative argument. I'm obviously not fitting in with the narrative.

The post above, if it's not a generation thing, why has the hatred intensified in the last 10-15 years? I'd say that's a more recent phenomena. Generational, if you will.

Are you kidding? You referred to Liverpool as us and our club. I'm guessing your Norwegian?

 

[Ernie]

What did they do?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...Liverpool-fans-branded-worst-Europe-UEFA.html

 

[Ernie]

Regarding Athens

Before the final check, we were told to put our tickets above our heads before being herded like cattle towards the stewards' final checking zone. "This is just as bad as going to watch a match in Vietnam," said a friend of mine who had been to a few matches out there last year. Once more, many fans held up forged tickets that weren't checked.

At the final checkpoint a steward quickly flashed an ultra-violet stick over the ticket. There was no turnstile and I doubt very much whether the ticket was checked properly. Even if it was shown to be fake, a five-yard dash into the ground with no barriers or turnstile to negotiate was an almost irresistible temptation for fans who had made it this far.

 

[Goat]

It seems I'm having my credentials of being a Blue questioned again as I'm going against the majority. Please, if people disagree with me, say so and give a reason instead of questioning my loyalty. Be constructive. It's very easy to just throw insults around and ignore the subject matter. If people disagree with me, fine. But don't ever question my loyalty to this Club. I'm off now. I won't be posting on here again as, it seems, some of you don't like fans having an alternative argument. I'm obviously not fitting in with the narrative.

The post above, if it's not a generation thing, why has the hatred intensified in the last 10-15 years? I'd say that's a more recent phenomena. Generational, if you will.

 

[Kurt.]

It seems I'm having my credentials of being a Blue questioned again as I'm going against the majority. Please, if people disagree with me, say so and give a reason instead of questioning my loyalty. Be constructive. It's very easy to just throw insults around and ignore the subject matter. If people disagree with me, fine. But don't ever question my loyalty to this Club. I'm off now. I won't be posting on here again as, it seems, some of you don't like fans having an alternative argument. I'm obviously not fitting in with the narrative.

The post above, if it's not a generation thing, why has the hatred intensified in the last 10-15 years? I'd say that's a more recent phenomena. Generational, if you will.

It is very easy to throw insults around as you're pm to me which I have posted above proves.

 

[PITA]

Couple of things here which might interest you based on a google search. http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/heysel-disaster---30-years-9350754

"The disaster saw Liverpool FC announce a self-imposed European ban, while, at Thatcher’s behest, the FA banned the five English clubs who had qualified for European competition, including Everton, who had qualified for the European Cup after winning the league."

Acceptance of responsibility?

"Seven were given three year prison terms and the other seven suspended three-year sentences."

Convictions because of responsibility?

"It would take 20 years from the disaster until the clubs met again in the Champions League.

In 2005 the Liverpool ECHO printed the names of the victims on its front page, above a banner headline which read: “We’re Sorry”

The match programme featured a two-page apology by Liverpool fan Terry Wilson, who was jailed for his part in the rioting, while Reds fans held a banner spelling out the Italian word ‘amicizia’ (friendship)."

Apology in the clubs official publication, accepting responsibility?

I've never met a red in real life who defends Heysel. I've never met a red in real life who says that it was any other fans fault. I've never met a red who says it was caused by anything other than a charge of the fans. I've never met a red who was there who has anything other than deep shame and regret over it.

I honestly die a little inside when I see our (mostly young) lads do the wall pushing motion, or reference it in any way. People died and Everton are the worst off? Nope, not for me. Anyone who uses the death of people to score points in football (regardless of who they support) is an absolute cretin in the eyes of the vast, vast majority of decent human beings.

I've never met a RS fan who doesn't claim that Shields is innocent. They never say that they don't know. They say he didn't do it. That must have been a big bed.

 

[canuckblue]

I've never met a RS fan who doesn't claim that Shields is innocent. They never say that they don't know. They say he didn't do it. That must have been a big bed.

Nah, they just pave over the subject.

 

[wilfjacko]

It seems I'm having my credentials of being a Blue questioned again as I'm going against the majority. Please, if people disagree with me, say so and give a reason instead of questioning my loyalty. Be constructive. It's very easy to just throw insults around and ignore the subject matter. If people disagree with me, fine. But don't ever question my loyalty to this Club. I'm off now. I won't be posting on here again as, it seems, some of you don't like fans having an alternative argument. I'm obviously not fitting in with the narrative.

The post above, if it's not a generation thing, why has the hatred intensified in the last 10-15 years? I'd say that's a more recent phenomena. Generational, if you will.

Some things are unforgivable...work It out

 

[paulbefc]

Good post and thanks for replying as opposed to chucking insults. Agree with a lot of it but some points I feel need addressing.

The bold I'm not sure the song you mean, they sing the "five times" when they play Plymouth or Stoke so I'm not sure it's directed at us and a subtle nod to our European ban (don't think anyone who would want to do that would be clever enough). The rest of the examples you've given there bring me back to a point I've made before about the internet age making everything a sweeping statement, one person wearing a Bucharest scarf becomes "fans in scarfs and shirts" one Fanta scruff becomes fans goading Everton, a few dickheads scrapping becomes the whole fanbase bringing shame on a city, just like a couple of idiots singing "always the victim" becomes a whole away end. Its contributed directly to the horrible bitter stink in football since the Premier league kicked off. Twitter is the main culprit, with all this talk of "fake news" i think a lot of the accusations that fly round about football fans in general can fall into that category.

Are you suggesting that a self imposed 20 year ban should start today or that it should've taken place in 1985?

I'd just like to also point out that no real Evertonian would make the (deliberate) mistake of suggesting that when Evertonians sing always the victims, it's about Hillsborough.

 

[bluestevon]

I've only met one that fits that bracket tbh. More disturbingly perhaps, I have met many many more who have never even heard of it.

Because the club have tried there best to airbrush the entire thing out of the history of the club, they lost all right to moan about the abuse they get over heysel the moment they brought the steau banner out and there nice good fans who never do anything wrong creamed their keks over the great bantz basically to a last man of them.

You try score points over a tradgedy your clubs fans caused, then expect to get the abuse you deserve for it, any one of them who liked that banner for example or who brings up any excuses like Chelsea fans, torino ones, or juve started it, the police's fault, or that times where different back then deserves those chants thoroughly.

And it hurts them to hear it cos it reminds them of something they want everyone to forget about.

 

[TheCount]

It seems I'm having my credentials of being a Blue questioned again as I'm going against the majority. Please, if people disagree with me, say so and give a reason instead of questioning my loyalty. Be constructive. It's very easy to just throw insults around and ignore the subject matter. If people disagree with me, fine. But don't ever question my loyalty to this Club. I'm off now. I won't be posting on here again as, it seems, some of you don't like fans having an alternative argument. I'm obviously not fitting in with the narrative.

The post above, if it's not a generation thing, why has the hatred intensified in the last 10-15 years? I'd say that's a more recent phenomena. Generational, if you will.

Always the victim

 

[Prevenger17]

Just gonna post the pm you sent me here mate..

You got a problem? Are you questioning my credentials of being a Blue? How dare you. I'd be very surprised if anyone on here has spent as much as me following this Club. Now &@££ off you blert. If you don't agree with what I posted, at least tell me where you think I'm wrong instead of posting sh1te like that. You nob

I got a couple of those PMs too.

 

[dandydan]

Just gonna post the pm you sent me here mate..

You got a problem? Are you questioning my credentials of being a Blue? How dare you. I'd be very surprised if anyone on here has spent as much as me following this Club. Now &@££ off you blert. If you don't agree with what I posted, at least tell me where you think I'm wrong instead of posting sh1te like that. You nob

I think you're well in there mate.

 

[Khalekan]

That's just it, it's not 'a few'... it's every single time they play. Whether they are tipping over Ambulances, stealing tickets, beating bystanders up, pushing walls over, throwing excrement at opposing fans, forcing their way through turnstiles, singing songs about the dead, waving banners to goad the opposition...

Quite sure I've missed plenty out - I'd say all of that makes them fair game.

One glaring omission is their reaction Alan Smith was carried off with a serious injury at The Pit.

And that was thousands of the buggers.


http://metro.co.uk/2015/04/02/manchester-uniteds-alan-smith-was-abused-by-liverpool-fans-5131660/