Really ...no Barry or Lennon ?
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They dont fit my system.
Would have Barry ahead of McCarthy in any system. Much better right in front of the centre backs.
mkrudden
Player Valuation: £40m
Keeper an 11th outfield player.
Split CBs
CBs bringing the ball out.
A pivot system.
Wide strikers
False number 9
Starting attacks with the goalkeeper passing short
We've seen all of the above at various times. Yes, as I said, it is nowhere near Barcelona standard, but it's quite clear that RM's vision, whether you believe in it or not, is to be a Barca-lite.
And Barca don't rely on their full backs going foward? they sure as hell don't rely on Dani Alves and Jordi Alba to be rigid, defensive rocks do they mate?
Come on now.
bluestevon
Player Valuation: £80m
would argue about having seen the keeper as a 11th outfield player mate, Howard is always rooted to his line and Robles not much better really, as for the other stuff, seena little of it soemtimes and some of it a lot more obviously
But...
where is the 5 second rule - getting the ball back within 5 seconds of losing it that barca made their mantra almost, we press probably the least of any team in this league?
where is the constant triangles that players are supposed to create with movement to give options always to the man in possession - isntead we are probably one of the most static teams in possession of the ball?
where is the rapid support and overlaps that the system thrives on?
where is the players covering positions for players when they go forwards - we dont see any of that?
where is the tempo?
In my system Stones replaces Barry, in terms of hes the 1 who brings the ball out, Jamos job is just to mop up.
sageyefc
Player Valuation: £90m
Ginger catermole should be nowhere near our starting 11
Friend?
sageyefc
Player Valuation: £90m
Sorry, bit of a slight on catermole that, at least he gets stuck in
mkrudden
Player Valuation: £40m
At the moment, absolutely agree with you. I remember against Newcastle in his first season though we were all of the above. Especially without the ball.
We aren't anywhere near our best and haven't been for a while yet.
Walsall Blue
Player Valuation: £6m
I'd take as many one nils as we could get from now till the end of season.
bluestevon
Player Valuation: £80m
Players do not have the fitness levels to press in a game mate anymore, when we've even tried it we have wilted badly the last 30 minutes, - even without pressing we looked goosed the last 15 most games.
Problem is, Martinez has his way of playing and he may deviate from it for a game or two, but he always goes back to what he feels comfortable with, much like Moyes could play attacking football at times but in the end we ended up going for the safe option
Not in the same way as we do, as they actually go back or go half-way into the opposition field when they are looking for the ball, and are much quicker in actually coming back, whereas if Coleman doesn't join the attacks on the right if Del's not playing - the crosser of the ball is gonna be Lukaku, and it's a shame he can't cross it to himself, as we need him to be finishing those crosses as well. We rely on overloading the wings (which doesn't work when you have only one winger and Cleverley... being around the left wing I guess) and getting the ball back into the middle, usually either cut back across the box or whipped in for Lukaku to finish/tap in/head in, depending on situation.
A pivot system implies 1 pivot in it - we have 2, on identical duty, which is nonsensical on so many levels with what we apparently want to achieve. Remember when Busquest and Mascherano both started at defensive mid for Barca, and they only played Xavi as a centre mid, relying on him to create everything every single attack? Yeah, it didn't happen, for a reason. We do it because it should, on theory, help the full backs bomb forward and stay there without worrying too much about the counter, as the DM's can cover the position left out by them should they need to, but it's just not working going forward AT ALL. Barca achieved it by having only one full back absolutely go for it if he should and the other staying half-way inside the opposition's box (as I said above), but that requires excellent chemistry and tactical preparation, which we seem to lack quite a lot right now to be honest.
We've removed the false number 9 thing ever since that Burnley (I think?) game where Lukaku came back deep to get it, and played it straight to the opposition and they scored - now he sits upfront, which is to our detriment, as we have only one other player to support him through the middle - Barkley, and on rare occasions one of the wingers who came infield because our full backs are overlapping.
Keeper being an 11th outfield player I can't recall ever happening for us, unless you mean Howard going out and tackling Jagielka a few weeks/months back as a sweeper keeper, or that one time he did a starfish for the second time after his Newcastle episode. Joel doesn't do it as well; and as far as keepers starting the attacks with a short pass - then I suppose literally every team ever tries to pretend they're Barcelona, who apparently invented the short pass? And as of this season it mostly starts with a kick upfield or a throw further out - in Martinez' first season we did go for the short pass to Baines/Coleman/any CB's. All keepers do it when it's safe anyway, and the sweeper keeper in England doesn't seem to be a thing, but Lloris is the closest to that at Tottenham, and even he is absolutely nowhere near Neuer, who is hands down the best sweeper keeper in Europe right now.
CB's bringing the ball out I can give you, as it's nothing to argue there, we try to do it, but with the 2 DM's mentioned already, unless Barkley ALSO comes deep for the ball what happens is: they pass it to (say) McCarthy, who doesn't find anyone, gives it back to them, they're forced to hoof it out, or repeat the same thing. It happens very often if you watch it carefully tbh... (not trying to say you don't watch the games or nothing here btw, but just watch out for that to see that it happens quite often).
Wide strikers is a really wrong term to use here, as we play one of them, and a winger on the opposite side, and that is stupidly unbalanced, as it leaves one wing just empty for Baines/Oviedo/Galloway to be there on their own - Kone was no help to the left back, Cleverley is a figurative ghost, Naismith was a literal ghost, Niasse is just... er, unproven, let's say, and it seems to be unthinkable to play with 2 wingers/inside forwards... despite the fact Barcelona, for example, do exactly that, and they're finding success I'd say. Oh and so does every successful team that's built on balance. Moyes managed to break the habit with Bainaar back in the day, but that meant our right wing was a wasteland where attacks went to die, and also that if teams had one of them sussed out or they didn't have a game - we were in for a treat of a performance!
mkrudden
Player Valuation: £40m
Genuinely appreciate the obvious time it took to reply there but nipping out and want yo answer fully.
Will do so later
Tis alright, I'll probably read it tomorrow to be honest, really knackered here at any rate. Always up for a debate of tactics/analysis though! lolGenuinely appreciate the obvious time it took to reply there but nipping out and want yo answer fully.
Will do so later
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