Everton v Stoke City. 28th Dec at 1500.

[D410]

The manner in which we lost that game was a defining moment for brown shoes in his time at this club. Many around me at the game looked like they had accepted as the norm what transpired before there eyes as the team collapsed.

The hard core Brown shoes fans would rather turn up at a game be entertained and accept loosing. Personally I think that type of thinking has crept into the fan base thought process due to a lack of winners on and off the pitch at the club.

 

[Jxg]

Live in Aus.... What did he say?

He said that we're becoming a better version of Wigan Athletic. The exact same problems are there. Martinez can't defend and sets his teams out to say "alright well we'll just score more than you".

 

[blue76]

Watching Everton is like watching a desperate team on the Crystal Maze at the end in the dome. Sod strategy, just grab as many bits of paper that you can. Just hope blind luck gives more gold than silver.

I understand that for most on here this will make no sense at all. Richard O' Brien for the win!

 

[harry]

Just seen the goals again, goals 1 & 2 young galloway loses his man. Goal three, if howard doesnt push it into play the ball is cleared or goes out for a goal kick. Goal four, no wonder the the stoke player hugs the ref (i cant bring myself to say his name).

Things will never change until these referees are made accountable for the desicions they make. They are paid alot of money to do this job and should be made to answer questions.

 

[Shagster]

Personally, I don't think spending money in January by itself to help improve the back line is a vital component of fixing our problems.

Instead, it's how we play which is the problem. Jagielka, Baines and Coleman were all imperious under Moyes so the ability to defend is there.

I'm not saying go back to the days of Moyes as if they're some glorious era, but there are aspects there which could be utilised; a fair balance.

First, I'd start with being slightly more cautious in the short term to secure results and be smarter on the pitch with when and how we defend.

I'd get the defenders closer to their men, tell them to not back off as we do and practice working as unit - banks of four etc. Set pieces too as well.

Yes it may be to the disadvantage of our attacking forays, but in the short term that's a sacrifice worth making simply to find a working balance.

I am certain that Jags will help with this an awful lot, yet he isn't the magic bullet which will fix all. There were problems there prior to his injury.

His departure has just exacerbated our problems. I'd also look at what Koné and others offer defensively as their routines need sharpening.

The problem is regardless of what I would do, I'm pretty confident Martinez will not address them or at least to an acceptable level.

Personally, I would love someone like Shawcross who is gritty and nasty to toughen up our defence working alongside the charismatic Stones.

But again, Martinez would never consider such an option so it is just pointless analysis.

Yes this should be second nature, but the fact that they are drilled to move into space in order to receive possession to suit his whole team in possession game plan results in them not being close enough to the opposition when we lose possession. By definition them finding space means they are not close to opposition attackers. CBs at Palace, Leicester.Stoke are not expected to form a part of the possession game plan for those teams, but they are solid and close to the opposition forwards - they only have that element to think about. RM expects both.

The transition between 'with ball' and without is shockingly bad. This really is the systemic failing in the team at present in my view. The top European sides do this very very well.

 

[Ashtonluke]

When we got to 3-2 yesterday, our inability to actually see the game out was quite startling. You could see the likes of Lukaku talking and telling players to try and keep the ball. Then there were others still playing 50/50 balls up to the forwards instead of just retaining possession. There was one point where Coleman was stood in the striker's position. I would have thought we would have a plan for seeing out a game and you would think such plan would be asking our right full back to stay in defence. It was just bizarre. Last year all we did was pass the ball around for the sake of it and if we'd done that for 10 mins yesterday, we'd have seen the game out. Instead, we were all over the place with players just not knowing what they were supposed to be doing. You just would not back us to see a game out at the moment even if we had a 2 goal lead. We look utterly clueless as a team in defending. This is then leading to individual errors as players at the back are under pressure. Opposition teams must enjoy playing against us as they will always feel that if they keep in touching distance of us they will have a chance of taking at least a point, especially at Goodison. There is no fear factor at GP any more.

 

[Professor Toffee]

Watching Everton is like watching a desperate team on the Crystal Maze at the end in the dome. Sod strategy, just grab as many bits of paper that you can. Just hope blind luck gives more gold than silver.

I understand that for most on here this will make no sense at all. Richard O' Brien for the win!

We are Aztec World

 

[Big Fat Sam]

Watching Everton is like watching a desperate team on the Crystal Maze at the end in the dome. Sod strategy, just grab as many bits of paper that you can. Just hope blind luck gives more gold than silver.

I understand that for most on here this will make no sense at all. Richard O' Brien for the win!

I'd honestly rather have him as our manager right now over Bobby Brainless. What an absolutely knob of a manager he is turning out to be, and that with so many players who'd get into most other teams in the division. I genuinely believe Moyes would be doing a much better job right now with the players as his disposal.

 

[njligernj]

Einsteins theory of madness is someone who does the same thing over and over again but expects different results. Koff Bobby ( for now ).

Einstein never said that FWIW. It's also not the definition of madness. Nothing about "Einstein's definition of madness" is accurate -- it's quite ironic given how smart he was and the many impressive things he actually did that for many people the thing they mention most often about him is some made-up bollocks he never said.

Sounds good though I must admit.

Good luck for the rest of the season, I don't think a top 6 spot is beyond either team if they address their weaknesses in the New Year as attacking wise they're both a match for anyone in the league.....

Leicester, Spurs, Palace, West Ham or Watford fans should be happy to discuss how the league is SO different now and the last six months are the new normal and the crushing desperate failures of the last 15-20 years are a distant memory never to return. How it's going to be so much easier to win now there are 12 good teams instead of 6.

We did this ten years ago mate. The writing is on the wall. Enjoy it while it lasts. Protect your candle; protect your flame of hope -- Tim Howard pissed all over my flame and put it out a few weeks back.

I'd honestly rather have him as our manager right now over Bobby Brainless. What an absolutely knob of a manager he is turning out to be, and that with so many players who'd get into most other teams in the division. I genuinely believe Moyes would be doing a much better job right now with the players as his disposal.

It's hard to imagine many managers with top level experience doing worse with this squad. Doesn't mean he can't turn it around but this has to be fairly close to the lowest rung of the ladder this squad could reasonably achieve.

 

[Ring master]

we should all be happy anyway,now that all the easy games are out the way,we might start winning some, now we have the hard games lol,
still annoyed,almost feel like someone has died the way everton are making me feel,as some said it should get easier the older you get when we lose, but i go more mad/frustrated the more time the game has ended

 

[Alanbileysfeathercut]

You have a much more likeable side than in the dark days of pulis. Played very well at times yesterday. Make sure and knock that lot out of the cup please.

The dark days ,surely you mean cementing the club( in this case Stoke)in the premier league,then going to.the next level ,which in this case is Mark Hughes.Remember Hughes served his apprenticeship at other clubs.Also their chairman a likeable character wasn't shy putting is hands in his pockets.The next club in that bracket Palace.Scary isn't it?

 

[Eggs]

....we'd be great in a 5 a side league.

 

[Minimeister]

When we went 3-2 up it is his plan to keep the ball which includes tapping it about in our own half, which nearly resulted in Naismith playing one of their lads through. If you're going to keep the ball then what's the point in having Naismith and Kone up top when you can bring Besic on and try and control it with more bodies. I used to think Moyes was more reactive than pro-active with his subs but this blokes the king at it.

 

[prestwichpotter]

The dark days ,surely you mean cementing the club( in this case Stoke)in the premier league,then going to.the next level ,which in this case is Mark Hughes.Remember Hughes served his apprenticeship at other clubs.Also their chairman a likeable character wasn't shy putting is hands in his pockets.The next club in that bracket Palace.Scary isn't it?

Agree, our dark days weren't under Pulis they were under managers such as Alan Ball and Brian Little, standing on the grass bank at Springfield Park getting spanked 4-0 by Wigan, getting turned over regularly at home to the likes of Cambridge Utd, Chester City and Shrewsbury Town. For those Evertonians in their late 30's like me or younger Stoke are an over achieving side, but for those who are 40+ they will know us a top flight team (albeit one that generally struggled apart from the odd purple patch in the 50's/60's and 70's) so I see no reason why we can't push on from here. Our chairman is Stoke born and bred and his company Bet365 are getting bigger and bigger each year so hopefully there is a next level round the corner. But I certainly won't be counting my chickens as I've seen plenty of teams come and go......

 

[Alanbileysfeathercut]

Agree, our dark days weren't under Pulis they were under managers such as Alan Ball and Brian Little, standing on the grass bank at Springfield Park getting spanked 4-0 by Wigan, getting turned over regularly at home to the likes of Cambridge Utd, Chester City and Shrewsbury Town. For those Evertonians in their late 30's like me or younger Stoke are an over achieving side, but for those who are 40+ they will know us a top flight team (albeit one that generally struggled apart from the odd purple patch in the 50's/60's and 70's) so I see no reason why we can't push on from here. Our chairman is Stoke born and bred and his company Bet365 are getting bigger and bigger each year so hopefully there is a next level round the corner. But I certainly won't be counting my chickens as I've seen plenty of teams come and go......

Maybe ,but enjoy it while it lasts,beat the sh!te next week and the following game and hopefully we'll meet again in the final,hostilities can resume from then.