Everton Youth Teams Thread

[mightymoyes]

People get very bogged down in power, physique etc. I know I have been. I'd have said Gordon was just a bit too small and slight. What youve seen from the last 2-3 months is if you have special ability that translates through age groups. Gordons ability to carry the ball and go past people shines through.

I think Dobbin has that special ability too. Great skill, speed and ease to go past people, as well as being a good finisher. I see him currently as a better prospect tha Onyango,whi's main attribute is his size (but other than that is really just quite solid to me.

I woudn't be surrpised if Dobbin misses out the under 23's and starts training with the first team.

Gordon isn't even small or slight, if you see his training videos he's ripped like a light middleweight boxer and he's still growing.

 

[catcherintherye]

Gordon isn't even small or slight, if you see his training videos he's ripped like a light middleweight boxer and he's still growing.

He's got a lot bigger hasn't he? And thats great credit to him, but he was quite slight. I think the muscle will help him a lot, but the key think he has to me is an uncanny ability to change speed and direction at great speeds. If you can do things like that, at 17 or 27 you will cause defenders a whole manner of problems. I think Dobbin has siilar abilities.

 

[mightymoyes]

He's got a lot bigger hasn't he? And thats great credit to him, but he was quite slight. I think the muscle will help him a lot, but the key think he has to me is an uncanny ability to change speed and direction at great speeds. If you can do things like that, at 17 or 27 you will cause defenders a whole manner of problems. I think Dobbin has siilar abilities.

Yeh I think the whole thing about judging a players physique when they're still so young is mad

 

[catcherintherye]

Yeh I think the whole thing about judging a players physique when they're still so young is mad

You're probably right, its hard not too though. You see Onyango, and you;re very wowed. I was when I saw Brainthwaite on the training videos and put that here.

However special players can often do tghings most players can't, and that will be apparent from quite a young age.

 

[Zatara]

It seems that is the plan and it makes some sense.

People get very bogged down in power, physique etc. I know I have been. I'd have said Gordon was just a bit too small and slight. What youve seen from the last 2-3 months is if you have special ability that translates through age groups. Gordons ability to carry the ball and go past people shines through.

I think Dobbin has that special ability too. Great skill, speed and ease to go past people, as well as being a good finisher. I see him currently as a better prospect tha Onyango,whi's main attribute is his size (but other than that is really just quite solid to me.

I woudn't be surrpised if Dobbin misses out the under 23's and starts training with the first team.

Gordon isn't even small or slight, if you see his training videos he's ripped like a light middleweight boxer and he's still growing.

He's got a lot bigger hasn't he? And thats great credit to him, but he was quite slight. I think the muscle will help him a lot, but the key think he has to me is an uncanny ability to change speed and direction at great speeds. If you can do things like that, at 17 or 27 you will cause defenders a whole manner of problems. I think Dobbin has siilar abilities.

Yeh I think the whole thing about judging a players physique when they're still so young is mad

You're probably right, its hard not too though. You see Onyango, and you;re very wowed. I was when I saw Brainthwaite on the training videos and put that here.

However special players can often do tghings most players can't, and that will be apparent from quite a young age.

Catcher: Does Dobbin play both wide and up top (as ive read)? Carbon copy (or similar) player to Gordon?

So could be one of two options on the right in 12 months time when Walcotts contract expires?

Onyango if a solid player has the physique to be in the first team squad. Looks like a strong box to box player at the youth level. With our centre midfield being so weak could he also come into the squad as a squad option?



Mighty Moyes: Gordon told how during lockdown he stayed with a mate who is a fitness trainer and poated the results. At the time i was quite shocked and hed really put the yards in.

Seeing those results would make me want to hire the fitness trainer if i was at Everton.

 

[ClausThomsen]

Our best u18s who will be able to compete against seniors are probably on international duty too. I'm sure they thought about it, but what if they are left with young players who are physically and mentally not ready for mens football yet? could easily get injuries and put their development back

It's a shame but I can see why.

Agreed. I've seen sides made up of U18's with one or two U23 lads in there playing against local non-league sides at county competition level and it's a hiding to nothing a lot of the time. A strong youth side with older U23's can generally play well and look comfortable but a very young side just gets bullied out of the game.

No real benefit to getting pummelled by a professional side.

 

[blueloon]

Gordon isn't even small or slight, if you see his training videos he's ripped like a light middleweight boxer and he's still growing.

I saw that he’s still at it in his mate’s gym prior to supposedly returning to training on Monday. The baffling thing for me is that he’s done this himself , starting during lockdown and continuing to work with i presume a talented/experienced personal trainer, when we‘ve got sports scientists , nutritionists etc coming out of our ears. It’s clearly benefited him why are we not physically developing SOME youngsters ourselves. ? Simms doesn’t need much physical development , but for example we debated Morgan Feeney‘s physical stature on here years ago , it never improved , now he’s gone. I hope the skilful , ball playing Ryan Astley doesn’t fall short on physicality too.

 

[catcherintherye]

I saw that he’s still at it in his mate’s gym prior to supposedly returning to training on Monday. The baffling thing for me is that he’s done this himself , starting during lockdown and continuing to work with i presume a talented/experienced personal trainer, when we‘ve got sports scientists , nutritionists etc coming out of our ears. It’s clearly benefited him why are we not physically developing SOME youngsters ourselves. ? Simms doesn’t need much physical development , but for example we debated Morgan Feeney‘s physical stature on here years ago , it never improved , now he’s gone. I hope the skilful , ball playing Ryan Astley doesn’t fall short on physicality too.

There is certainly a question about whether the club have the best people. I do think there are a couple of wider issues though. Firstly, the 1-1 work you get with a PT is obviously a different relationship than what you get with say a handful of PT type guys who work at the club and handle everyone. I know it's in vogue to criticise Unsworth, but I remember him saying 3 or 4 years agom they wee working hard to get Nathan Broadhead to gain muscle and get stronger, so it's obviously something the club take seriously. You also have to look at someone like DCL, who is in fantastich shape and takes it very seriously.

The other point is that it has to come down to the player themselves. I think having such muscle is often quite limited. When I was at university we had lads who played rugby and football and piled muscle on, and actually it didn't help much. In Gordons position you want to be lean so you don't want to overdo it (for me he has the balance right). However phsycologically I do think it makes a big difference- perhaps a placebo vut every edge you can get matters.

I do think, for a lad like Tom Davies (and I know he's an easy target) but he's one who to me really hasnt benefitted from getting bigger and stronger. I mean even if you omit DCL< it's really helped Mason Holgate.

 

[catcherintherye]

Catcher: Does Dobbin play both wide and up top (as ive read)? Carbon copy (or similar) player to Gordon?

So could be one of two options on the right in 12 months time when Walcotts contract expires?

Onyango if a solid player has the physique to be in the first team squad. Looks like a strong box to box player at the youth level. With our centre midfield being so weak could he also come into the squad as a squad option?

From the its I've seen of the 18's they've played a lot with a front 3 and he has tended to play in one of the two wide positions. As a comparison to Gordon I would say he is a bit stronger, probably going to be a little taller (I'd say Dobbin was around 5ft 10 currently but still growing) and more of a classic winger. Gordon used to play in the 10 more, and would go past people, but was more of an allrounder- woud arrive in the box late etc. That you saw Gordon at Tottenham just drop into a two man midfield and look comfortable is testament to his versatility and skill set, whereas I think Dobbin is more of a specialist attacking winger.

Both have good goal records at under 18 and exposure ton higher age levels.

 

[granter79]

Gordon isn't even small or slight, if you see his training videos he's ripped like a light middleweight boxer and he's still growing.

Video on twitter this morning of Gordon working out in his mates gym. Serious hard work put in. Lad is ripped and not to the point it will affect is speed

 

[blueloon]

There is certainly a question about whether the club have the best people. I do think there are a couple of wider issues though. Firstly, the 1-1 work you get with a PT is obviously a different relationship than what you get with say a handful of PT type guys who work at the club and handle everyone. I know it's in vogue to criticise Unsworth, but I remember him saying 3 or 4 years agom they wee working hard to get Nathan Broadhead to gain muscle and get stronger, so it's obviously something the club take seriously. You also have to look at someone like DCL, who is in fantastich shape and takes it very seriously.

The other point is that it has to come down to the player themselves. I think having such muscle is often quite limited. When I was at university we had lads who played rugby and football and piled muscle on, and actually it didn't help much. In Gordons position you want to be lean so you don't want to overdo it (for me he has the balance right). However phsycologically I do think it makes a big difference- perhaps a placebo vut every edge you can get matters.

I do think, for a lad like Tom Davies (and I know he's an easy target) but he's one who to me really hasnt benefitted from getting bigger and stronger. I mean even if you omit DCL< it's really helped Mason Holgate.

Indeed. Two of your points caught my eye. 3 years ago Nathan Broadhead was one of brightest prospect , yet for two seasons at U23s he only got a handful of games, then in the year we won PL2 he played regularly and was one of the best players. For me he had two wasted seasons , maybe as you say Unsworth thought he didn’t have the physicality I dont know, just feel something different should have happened with him earlier.

Your rugby point is interesting and a comparison I’ve made before . I’ve watched a lot of u18/U20 international rugby over the years. At 18 and 19 the talented outside halfs and backs are also quite muscular and well developed but in proportion to their bodies and retain their speed. If Gordon had been born in Llanelli he’d likely have been a No10 with his brain , speed and kicking and he’d probably been as muscular as he now is earlier! . Sorry , wandered away of track there!

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

There is certainly a question about whether the club have the best people. I do think there are a couple of wider issues though. Firstly, the 1-1 work you get with a PT is obviously a different relationship than what you get with say a handful of PT type guys who work at the club and handle everyone. I know it's in vogue to criticise Unsworth, but I remember him saying 3 or 4 years agom they wee working hard to get Nathan Broadhead to gain muscle and get stronger, so it's obviously something the club take seriously. You also have to look at someone like DCL, who is in fantastich shape and takes it very seriously.

The other point is that it has to come down to the player themselves. I think having such muscle is often quite limited. When I was at university we had lads who played rugby and football and piled muscle on, and actually it didn't help much. In Gordons position you want to be lean so you don't want to overdo it (for me he has the balance right). However phsycologically I do think it makes a big difference- perhaps a placebo vut every edge you can get matters.

I do think, for a lad like Tom Davies (and I know he's an easy target) but he's one who to me really hasnt benefitted from getting bigger and stronger. I mean even if you omit DCL< it's really helped Mason Holgate.

I know a couple of young aspiring footy players who have taken on a few PT's themselves off their own back to do something similar to young Gordon.

Ex efc left back moved into this field and is doing plenty of work with footy players.

Its good some younger players now understand the need to invest in themselves, rather then the rubbish they flutter money on. I would love for most of our youth team to have the same outlook as Gordon, head down, work hard and if you have talent let it run wild, if you haven't show everyone you'll work harder then the rest.

 

[Tin-Tin]

Video on twitter this morning of Gordon working out in his mates gym. Serious hard work put in. Lad is ripped and not to the point it will affect is speed

This is the point, its muscle but in a proper way, not the type of muscle Lukaku was asked to put on at Utd which made him heavier and therefore he struggled a bit more.

Good on him for doing it himself though as looking previously he was lean but no muscle really. Makes you wonder why others dont do it, or the clubs dont employ a few of them to work with small groups. To bulk the players up in the right way

The likes of Ronaldo does not have that body due to his clubs, its because he does a lot of work himself.

 

[Tin-Tin]

That P.T Gordon is with has bagged himself a few more players too out of it.

 

[granter79]

This is the point, its muscle but in a proper way, not the type of muscle Lukaku was asked to put on at Utd which made him heavier and therefore he struggled a bit more.

Good on him for doing it himself though as looking previously he was lean but no muscle really. Makes you wonder why others dont do it, or the clubs dont employ a few of them to work with small groups. To bulk the players up in the right way

The likes of Ronaldo does not have that body due to his clubs, its because he does a lot of work himself.

What would Rooney have been like if he looked after himself like that