Howard Kendall Or Harry Catterick

Who Is Our Greatest Manager?

  • Total voters
    101
  • Poll closed .
adi dassler said:
I think that's harsh. I see it more as 69/70 was the culmination of a young team who had come close in previous seasons, going one better and winning the league in style. You've got to remember that this was the second great team Catterick produced, replacing the likes of Vernon and Young from the early-mid 60s with lots of home grown talent. We should have won the cup in 68 and by all accounts the football from 67-70 was as good as anything we've ever played.

It's certainly disappointing how it panned out after 1970, however 2 different results in March 1971 against the RS and panathanikos and things could have panned out so differently. Small margins.
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But that's sport. Sport is about fine margins. I don't think it remotely harsh to say that the 1970 side was not as great as the 1980s side. It won far less. Greatness is defined by achievement. The "what ifs" for the 1970 side also apply to the 1980s side. What if they had won the double in 1986 - which was eminently achievable but for injuries and Gary Lineker's boots falling apart? What if they had been allowed to take part in the European Cup?

In the final analysis, the great side of 1970 had a number of "what ifs". But the great side of the 1980s had its own - as well as a groaning trophy cabinet. Therein lies the difference.
 
Drico said:
But that's sport. Sport is about fine margins. I don't think it remotely harsh to say that the 1970 side was not as great as the 1980s side. It won far less. Greatness is defined by achievement. The "what ifs" for the 1970 side also apply to the 1980s side. What if they had won the double in 1986 - which was eminently achievable but for injuries and Gary Lineker's boots falling apart? What if they had been allowed to take part in the European Cup?

In the final analysis, the great side of 1970 had a number of "what ifs". But the great side of the 1980s had its own - as well as a groaning trophy cabinet. Therein lies the difference.
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HK had 3 spells with us, one great, the other two disastrous - The Catt was burnt out by 1971 - on paper on trophies HK wins it ....

Best team IMO was the 1970s team, different era, but so entertaining with only 3 midfielders & one no 9... plus harder teams to beat back then ...
 
Joey66 said:
HK had 3 spells with us, one great, the other two disastrous - The Catt was burnt out by 1971 - on paper on trophies HK wins it ....

Best team IMO was the 1970s team, different era, but so entertaining with only 3 midfielders & one no 9... plus harder teams to beat back then ...
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"Best" is definitely debatable and arguable either way. It's a subjective judgement based on preference. Either choice is valid. "Greater" is less debatable as it can be measured in achievements. I'm just pleased we had two superb sides in the television age, and a little sad that we have been rationed to just those two...
 
Drico said:
But that's sport. Sport is about fine margins. I don't think it remotely harsh to say that the 1970 side was not as great as the 1980s side. It won far less. Greatness is defined by achievement. The "what ifs" for the 1970 side also apply to the 1980s side. What if they had won the double in 1986 - which was eminently achievable but for injuries and Gary Lineker's boots falling apart? What if they had been allowed to take part in the European Cup?

In the final analysis, the great side of 1970 had a number of "what ifs". But the great side of the 1980s had its own - as well as a groaning trophy cabinet. Therein lies the difference.
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Gary Lineker left his boots behind - Sharpy stated it was nonsense as he & other players also missed sitters that would have given us the league title ...
 

Drico said:
"Best" is definitely debatable and arguable either way. It's a subjective judgement based on preference. Either choice is valid. "Greater" is less debatable as it can be measured in achievements. I'm just pleased we had two superb sides in the television age, and a little sad that we have been rationed to just those two...
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The Catt banned the TV cameras .... we were hardly on TV in that era ....
 
Howard wins IMO but only just. The Cat and Howard differentiated monetary wise. The Cat built 2 great teams during his tenure with ample moneybut Howard was slightly more restricted monetary wise. In the 90's Howard had no chance the way the club was and calling it disastrous is a bit of a disservice to him. You have to look at 2 main points...........time and money. The Cat had both and Howard didn't.

Two great managers that have become legends
 
Drico said:
But that's sport. Sport is about fine margins. I don't think it remotely harsh to say that the 1970 side was not as great as the 1980s side. It won far less. Greatness is defined by achievement. The "what ifs" for the 1970 side also apply to the 1980s side. What if they had won the double in 1986 - which was eminently achievable but for injuries and Gary Lineker's boots falling apart? What if they had been allowed to take part in the European Cup?

In the final analysis, the great side of 1970 had a number of "what ifs". But the great side of the 1980s had its own - as well as a groaning trophy cabinet. Therein lies the difference.
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I said I thought you were harsh because you called the 1970 side one season wonders, not because I think they were better than the mid-80s side. Fact is they were not one season wonders, for the reasons noted in my post - 1970 was the culmination of 3-4 years of consistent, brilliant football at a time when we were up against some of the toughest competition you will see in any era.
 
Black Belt Jones said:
HK to Bilbao is baffling to this day - hard to believe there isn't some story behind this, but afaik he always described it in humdrum terms. New challenges, European ban, Bilbao a grand old club etc.

What is not hard to understand is that EFC off the pitch have been bad for decades, and HK built that side out of thin air and totally against expectation. So it is quite believable that he had a fk this am oot moment.
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There was a story going round that Kendall was an 'In' for the Barca job which is why Lineker was sold there.
But for whatever reason(s) If fell through, El Tel got the job and maybe Kendall had burned his bridges...or is it boats...and 'had' to leave.
We'll never really know.
 

Catterick gave his all for us, Kendall moved for what thought we're greener Pasteur's (given the circumstances at the time but still left)
 
adi dassler said:
I said I thought you were harsh because you called the 1970 side one season wonders, not because I think they were better than the mid-80s side. Fact is they were not one season wonders, for the reasons noted in my post - 1970 was the culmination of 3-4 years of consistent, brilliant football at a time when we were up against some of the toughest competition you will see in any era.
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That's fair enough.

When put that way, I think it's harsh to call them one-season wonders.
 
Drico said:
That's fair enough.

When put that way, I think it's harsh to call them one-season wonders.
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The sad truth here is that both myself and yourself will probably be long dead, before an Everton team worthy of comparison to those two great teams emerges again!

The events of 1971 crushed that 1970 team. The 80's side lost both the league title and FA Cup to the neighbours in devastating circumstances in 1986. They bounced back though and set the record straight the following year.
 

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