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Is Sam that bad?

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EFC78 said:
Something Martinez and Koeman both failed to do. Since Palace came back up we hadn't beaten them at Goodison until Saturday, so it's clearly not been an easy fixture for us.

April 2014: Lost 3-2 (Martinez)
September 2014: Lost 3-2 (Martinez)
December 2015: Drew 1-1 (Martinez)
September 2016: Drew 1-1 (Koeman)
Click to expand...
Jesus, have we actually sunk so low that we adjudge a manager a success because we actually beat Crystal Palace at home.?
Truly our cup runneth over!
 
EFC78 said:
I'd say that getting a club like Bolton promoted and within 3 seasons achieving 4 consecutive top 8 finishes is better than 'a good season'. The last time Bolton had achieved a top 6 finish in the top flight before that was in 1960. Just have a look how big an achievement those 4 consecutive seasons were by looking at the context of Bolton's league finishes here:

http://www.european-football-statistics.co.uk/england.htm

Between 1960 and 2004 when he got them 8th, Bolton had been regulars in the 3rd tier, and even dropped as low as the 4th tier in 1988.

You're right in that it was a while ago, and I accept that. I personally don't think he has more than a season left in him but some people never even gave him a chance and loads are pretty much twisting the reality to make out like he's doing a poor job when he blatantly isn't.
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It was a good job at the time, but that was an age ago in football terms now.

There is no twisting from me, I didn't want him when we got him - he was the clear sign there was panic at the top and Walsh was pushing it, I don't want him now, and I still say he isnt the answer to any question at our club.

My issue is, and am not saying you here mate - is the fact that there seems to be an air of "best we can get because he has premiership experience"... its such insular thinking its unreal, yes he has prem experience, but he has never won a trophy, never really been part to a club looking to move forward, besides staying in the league.

I dont like the man, I think his management tactics are from a football day gone, and even though he has made massive strides in his sports psychology and physics department, what he does as a manager just doesn't cut it for me. If he has half as good as he thinks he is, he would be managing a TOP TOP club.

He has come in and done what any competent manager would have done... made us harder to break down. Any manager coming in would have seen this, Koeman lost the players it wasn't going to happen with him, Unsworth was too pally pally.

Put Sam's CV against plenty of managers and it doesnt stack up, besides kept XYZ in the premier league and has premier league experience.

Is that what we aspire to now? Prem experience and survival.
 
Eggsyblueskin said:
Jesus, have we actually sunk so low that we adjudge a manager a success because we actually beat Crystal Palace at home.?
Truly our cup runneth over!
Click to expand...

So pointing out facts means that I am celebrating a win against Crystal Palace as a Cup win? lol.

The poster said we should be beating Palace at home. I merely pointed out that in our previous 4 fixtures against them at Goodison, we've been unable to do so and it's a tougher game for us than say a Newcastle who we seem to be able to beat quite regularly both home and away.
 

chazzle_dazzle said:
I dont like the man, I think his management tactics are from a football day gone, and even though he has made massive strides in his sports psychology and physics department, what he does as a manager just doesn't cut it for me. If he has half as good as he thinks he is, he would be managing a TOP TOP club.
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But he was good enough to manage England.

Ah! I see what you mean.
 
Excellent for relegated teams but not suit for iur future plan.
He can help to buildup the confidence of players but too weak on tactics and team building.
I would like to see we finish at 11th and say goodbye to him rather than at 7th and keep him in next season...
 
Sam was appointed to keep us clear of relegation and if possible to move us up the table.
Barring a complete meltdown we should be able to stay up and we are in a three way fight for seventh. That is the highest we can finish, but we can finish a lot lower. People have short memories, when he was appointed relegation was a very real threat which was partially allayed by the result at home to West Ham. But, we were awful and it was difficult to see where points were going to come from.

I read the criticism of Sam on here and frankly most of it is just stupid and in my opinion lacking in reality.
Sam is not a long term solution at Everton , his age alone will prevent that. I am not even convinced absolutely that when the season is over that he will have the enthusiasm to keep going. I think that if he wants to stay at Everton then it will be facilitated either as manager or in some more senior capacity for next season but probably not beyond. We have gone from being relegation contenders to not only wanting to win.. but win playing well in about eight weeks... with the same players which most people on here have relatively little confidence in.

We have wasted a lot of money on both managers and players and now I see repeated calls for Fonseca or Silva... even bigger risks. Are we going to give them another 100m to spend as well ?

The money being made available for transfers and the money being paid to our managers means that we must be interesting some quality managers. I want the next manager to be the right one... I think the club needs the next manager to be the right one to prevent us falling away completely as a club. I am prepared to wait until such a manager can be found.
Getting rid of Sam Allyrdyce to replace him with greater uncertainty makes no sense to me.
 

blueblue said:
Sam was appointed to keep us clear of relegation and if possible to move us up the table.
Barring a complete meltdown we should be able to stay up and we are in a three way fight for seventh. That is the highest we can finish, but we can finish a lot lower. People have short memories, when he was appointed relegation was a very real threat which was partially allayed by the result at home to West Ham. But, we were awful and it was difficult to see where points were going to come from.

I read the criticism of Sam on here and frankly most of it is just stupid and in my opinion lacking in reality.
Sam is not a long term solution at Everton , his age alone will prevent that. I am not even convinced absolutely that when the season is over that he will have the enthusiasm to keep going. I think that if he wants to stay at Everton then it will be facilitated either as manager or in some more senior capacity for next season but probably not beyond. We have gone from being relegation contenders to not only wanting to win.. but win playing well in about eight weeks... with the same players which most people on here have relatively little confidence in.

We have wasted a lot of money on both managers and players and now I see repeated calls for Fonseca or Silva... even bigger risks. Are we going to give them another 100m to spend as well ?

The money being made available for transfers and the money being paid to our managers means that we must be interesting some quality managers. I want the next manager to be the right one... I think the club needs the next manager to be the right one to prevent us falling away completely as a club. I am prepared to wait until such a manager can be found.
Getting rid of Sam Allyrdyce to replace him with greater uncertainty makes no sense to me.
Click to expand...
In the last 3 seasons 38/35/36 points was enough to stay up
In the last 21 years 37 points on average has been enough to stay up.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.sk...ation-battle-do-you-need-40-points-to-stay-up
There was no way we were ever in a relegation fight
That was just the justification for getting the Gravy and urine drinkers in so the could say we got Everton out of the shoight.
FSA plays dreadful football , is petrified of the top six and deserves to go
 
I'm not going to lie, I thought he'd be able to show that he isn't just an escape artist and I still think he is better than he is showing, I can't shift blame away from that group of players, they're just not performing consistently or to a high enough level, any manager in world football would struggle with the lack of confidence this lot are portraying currently.

Having said that, I am now undecided whether I want him next season. All I can see is another spending spree leaving us with a load of players trying to get used to each other(gel) again, I think next season will be a struggle no matter what so maybe give him the chance to stabilise the squad. Oh i don't know, just trying to think of more positive things about him.
 

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