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Is there a level of corruption in the league right now?

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Is there corruption in football ? Almost certainly yes

Do I believe the refs are in on the corruption and ordered to purposely favour certain sides ? Almost certainly no

A sizeable amount of football fans are just inherently irrational cryarses who think officials and the media are against them, literally every club has fans with this mindset, Liverpool fans convinced refs favour United, United fans convinced refs favour Liverpool etc. It’s all paranoid bollocks for the most part.
 
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If there was corruption it would’ve 100% have been uncovered, I don’t think there is corruption at all.
There may be bias or influence but that’s not the same.
I don’t agree with VAR but it’s definitely stopped the influence the players had over the referee, you don’t see crowds of players around the ref anymore because they know it will get looked at.
 
Good point, but not sure about whether thryre paying officials off, however there is definate corruption. Two things stick with me. Firstly, Last season when Brighton got that terrible penalty decision against us after it being reviewed by VAR 13 times, when only one look would tell you what we needed to know, I read an article in the Independent. That weekend and up to that point there had been several blantantly incorrect VAR decisions. The article was saying that in Italy where players, coaches, Owners and officaials had been jailed for corruption for many years since the 80's we would be niave to not consider the possibility of VAR being used corruptively in the premier league. Secondly Richard Scudamure who was a high ranking official in the FA at one point said in an interview on sky sports last year that the Premier Leagues objective is to make it the most competitive competiotion in the world and as a result the powers that be would like the winners to be rotated to make it more interesting. There is also the TV money. It is obvious something is not fair.
I though this with Leicester, once the “story” was established it felt like officials did their best to deliver the narrative.

one step away from sports entertainment not sport.
 
I think some of our midfield, well one in particular, must be doped before the game to slow him down and reduce his passing ability.
Doesn’t affect his pointing though so it must be only the bottom half that’s doped
 

But my question is how do these professional best of the best refs get it wrong nearly every week benefiting the same few teams consistently, there must be some level of corruption.
The simple answer to this is that they're human. I mean footballers get stuff wrong every week don't they, and they're the best of the best in a much, much more competitive field, and are being paid an awful lot more. One of the biggest things with refereeing that always gets overlooked is that for the most part it's subjective. We try to pretend that the laws of the game are objective and absolute but they aren't, it's a subjective call as to whether there's enough contact for someone to go down or a hand is an unnatural position or whatever. That's why when people say 'yeah but look at this thing that happened in another game where a different decision was reached' it's pointless, because it will always be a subjective call.
 
The simple answer to this is that they're human. I mean footballers get stuff wrong every week don't they, and they're the best of the best in a much, much more competitive field, and are being paid an awful lot more. One of the biggest things with refereeing that always gets overlooked is that for the most part it's subjective. We try to pretend that the laws of the game are objective and absolute but they aren't, it's a subjective call as to whether there's enough contact for someone to go down or a hand is an unnatural position or whatever. That's why when people say 'yeah but look at this thing that happened in another game where a different decision was reached' it's pointless, because it will always be a subjective call.

Yes. I have reffed games and you realise how hard it is. If you make a bad call, or don't see something you've got 4 or 5 people at you. As a defender, if you make a cock up, nobody is on you that quickly.

That being said, I do think the governance of football, including refs is appalling. It sort of exlains why, even with VAR they still make cock ups. The fact they don't have to come out and explain any decision publicly, under any scrutiny allows them to often get away scott free, builds resentment and crafts a narrative that they are not human.

It would be hard at first, answering some questions to the media, but actually over time it would be a big win. I think if most people could hear the explanation and rational behind a decision, it would help. I don't think this almost Pravda like attitude helps anyone.

It seems to me to be a very particular form of Englishness, that we are always right and about accountability that should have long since gone now.
 
The simple answer to this is that they're human. I mean footballers get stuff wrong every week don't they, and they're the best of the best in a much, much more competitive field, and are being paid an awful lot more. One of the biggest things with refereeing that always gets overlooked is that for the most part it's subjective. We try to pretend that the laws of the game are objective and absolute but they aren't, it's a subjective call as to whether there's enough contact for someone to go down or a hand is an unnatural position or whatever. That's why when people say 'yeah but look at this thing that happened in another game where a different decision was reached' it's pointless, because it will always be a subjective call.

Always?

Sometimes maybe, but a foul and a dive are, generally speaking, pretty easy to determine with the aid of an instant replay of the event. Even opposition supporters -who are infamously biased- will often times admit these days that a VAR call got it completely and totally wrong.

There are always influencing factors that could sway a person towards making a decision that he wouldn't otherwise have made, even if that does not mean outright brown envelopes.

Corruption can operate on a subconcious or subliminal level. For example if you were a games reviewer on youtube, and one company started sending you boat loads of free stuff or giving you exclusive interviews, the next time you reviewed their product, even if you were not actually bribed or corrupt yourself, you might still find yourself being swayed and giving them favorable reviews, or even convincing yourself that it was the best game you ever played!

This happens all the time, and I don't think it is out and out corruption as it doesn't need to be, just manipulation. I think the same kind of thing applies in football or anywhere where there are stack loads of cash riding on one mans decision making. Refs who have careers will probably know on some level how best to stay onside (pardon the pun) their very powerful bosses.

So while I don't think refs are outright bribed, I do think when it comes to certain teams and certain narratives they can be influenced consciously or unconsciously to vote in a certain way.

Everton are terrible in how they deal with the refs, but Man U who have Ole (who knows all about dealing with refs from Fergies era) are known for getting the calls. How many pens have they had this season compared to us (actually asking)? Former united players though have admitted that they knew how to influence and deal with them. We just meekly slink away!

Truth is none of us really know (right?) but some of the decisions I have to say have nothing to do with subjectivity, and are just straight up wrong! No matter who one supports. This subjectivity argument is something I see alot in the media but to me its a fox news tactic. Nothing is true and therefore pretty much anything they like can be true or permissible!

Most of the time (not always I agree) I can see with my own eyes if a player was fouled, offside or if he dived.
 
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Always?

Sometimes maybe, but a foul and a dive are, generally speaking, pretty easy to determine with the aid of an instant replay of the event. Even opposition supporters -who are infamously biased- will often times admit these days that a VAR call got it completely and totally wrong.

There are always influencing factors that could sway a person towards making a decision that he wouldn't otherwise have made, even if that does not mean outright brown envelopes.

Corruption can operate on a subconcious or subliminal level. For example if you were a games reviewer on youtube, and one company started sending you boat loads of free stuff or giving you exclusive interviews, the next time you reviewed their product, even if you were not actually bribed or corrupt yourself, you might still find yourself being swayed and giving them favorable reviews, or even convincing yourself that it was the best game you ever played!

This happens all the time, and I don't think it is out and out corruption as it doesn't need to be, just manipulation. I think the same kind of thing applies in football or anywhere where there is stack loads of cash riding on one mans decision making. Refs who have careers will probably know how best to stay onside (pardon the pun) with their very powerful bosses.

So while I don't think refs are outright bribed, I do think when it comes to certain teams and certain narratives they can be influenced consciously or unconsciously to vote in a certain way.

Everton are terrible in how they deal with the refs, but Man U who have Ole (who knows all about dealing with refs from Fergies era) probably get so many calls going their way. Former united players have admitted that they knew how to influence them.

Truth is none of us really know (right?) but some of the decisions I have to say have nothing to do with subjectivity, and are just straight up wrong! No matter who one supports. This subjectivity argument is something I see alot in the media but to me its a fox news tactic. Nothing is true and therefore pretty much anything they like can be true!

Most of the time (not always I agree) I can see with my own eyes if a player was fouled, offside or if he dived.
Well there's a couple of things there. Firstly I didn't mean always as in 'every single time', I meant always as in 'it will never change'. There will always be challenges where the referee has to make a subjective call as to whether it's a foul or not. Secondly, the last line; I think this is just plain wrong. Of course you think you can tell whether it's a foul or not, because you're making up your own mind. That doesn't mean you're objectively 'right' though, or that everyone would agree with you. Of course there are clear-cut cases where everyone can see that it/is isn't a foul, and in 99% of cases the referees call these too, but there are instances in every single game where the call is borderline, sometimes you get them sometimes you don't. It's why you get terms like 'soft', the inference being that the decision wasn't wrong as such, but then it wasn't necessarily right either, it just comes down to your viewpoint.
 
This is just after the Man Utd 9-0 Southampton game and again Manchester United get away with a few decisions, one handball, another offside, that was clearly not, and a penalty, also clearly not but it’s looking so repetitive for united, every other game they get decisions against them, if feels like they are paying the officials, it feels corrupt, what are your thoughts?
They deserve it after their manager tried to play mind game with Carlo.
 

Happens everywhere though, how have City or PSG not won the CL yet? They have one final between them despite being two of Europe’s top sides for about ten years now. They just get managed out of the competition most years if they look threatening. UEFA just want one of their cash cows like Madrid Barcelona Liverpool Bayern or Juve to win it. In the early days of the CL you saw some shock teams in the finals and even winning it, Marseille, Valencia, Porto, Monaco, Ajax, Dortmund, Leverkusen. In the last 15 years though Chelsea are the only team outside of Europe’s favoured cartel to win it (and even that was highly fortuitous with Chelsea surviving unbelievable refereeing in the semi final and final).
Thats a top post mate. Never looked at it in depth before but like you say the smaller teams used to do well, and now its the total oppisite.
 
Sorry if this is something that has been said already, but it depends on what you define "corruption" as.

If you mean envelopes stuffed with tenners placed in the ref's changing room, then probably not. However if you mean sustaining a system that is anti-competitive to protect a small number of clubs at the expense of everyone else, then absolutely.
 

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