Martinez: Everton players fear Goodison Crowd

[PhilM]

I think the system we play puts undue pressure on them.

Ball and Carragher are quite correct. Teams must now love coming to Goodison as our approach under Martinez is unbelievably predictable.

Unless it's a team who'll come at us (the likes of Arsenal or City), we play a rigid style of slow, laborious and utterly turgid style of football.

A team knows that if they sit back with fixed ranks that we'll merely play the ball across with no tempo, trying to intrinsically walk through them.

There's very little cutting edge: Barkley tries to waltz through; our wide players are reluctant to run and beat a man often hesitating further up.

Only Besic seems to offer any tempo! Then at the back, knowing Howard's distribution is awful, that with correct pressure we will make mistakes.

Either up the tempo when we have the ball or let teams have more freedom so that we can counter where we look our strongest.

As right now the system is putting pressure on our players to succeed in a way which is either unnatural to them, or they can't capitalise on.

 

[davek]

Well, last season we were 12th after 23 games.

We're now 12th, after 23 games.

We weren't playing the football we are now last season; we weren't 90 minutes away from a cup final either.

 

[Minimeister]

The Villa and Sunderland games we played with a much higher tempo and some of the football was unbelievable. Thought we'd cracked it in knowing how to play at home to the teams who sit back, but turns out both those teams were just rubbish.

 

[davek]

If he gets another summer to make a few changes, Prob goal keeper and striker, and we find ourselves in this position again at this time would you say enoughs enough

It depends what we do in that period. If we won a cup, or two cups, and we were midtable would you be unhappy?

I wouldn't, not by a long chalk. Too many years of pats on the head as a 'good league finishing position' team.

 

[Darth Vader]

If this season continues going as it is I can't imagine that Lukaku and Stones will still be here at the beginning of next season, and who would blame them? Champions League teams be all over them like a rash as soon as their respective agents give them, if they haven't already, the slightest sniff! As for the others we'll see but it's not beyond the realms of possibility that good performances in the Euros would see interest in one or two of them!

Lukaku and Stones won't be a shock but not for one minute would we sell anymore first team players than that

 

[Darth Vader]

It depends what we do in that period. If we won a cup, or two cups, and we were midtable would you be unhappy?

I wouldn't, not by a long chalk. Too many years of pats on the head as a 'good league finishing position' team.

No cups

Just same league position

Would you say time to change

 

[PhilM]

Yes, it does. His record speaks for itself as you point out.

I dont think people realise the difficulty of stepping in at United after the team had been destroyed.

Without being too obtuse, history is history. What happens in the present (the here are now) is what is most important. That and future prospects.

van Gaal has had fantastic success and that obviously shows the ability he has had, but that doesn't automatically assure future success.

Gamelin was a fantastic military commander for the French in their colonial hay-day and during WWI. He had all the credentials to bring success!

However that was all in the past! The real fact was that he was no longer capable to manager the French to success at the out break of WWII.

He was a failure... I'd say the same regarding LVG and equally I no longer believe Martinez has the capability to reproduce that 5th place finish.

With regards to the state of the Manure squad, I think with £250m to spend he should be doing much better than he is. Just look Leicester...

 

[TheHumbleEgg]

Try 'consistent'.

I cant take seriously fickle people. Not one bit. They lack substance. No apologies for what I said. It's a ridiculous attitude to have...and self defeating.

Ok mate. 'Consistently' obsessional it is then.

So basically anyone who disagrees with your increasingly flawed support of RM is fickle, lacking in substance, ridiculous & self defeating?

That would now cover a growing amount of the fanbase mate, you're aware of that, yes?

 

[GrandOldTeam]

We weren't playing the football we are now last season; we weren't 90 minutes away from a cup final either.

It's a results business dave.

We're in the same position vs last season.

Yes, we've done well to get past Barnsley, Reading, Norwich and Middlesbrough. Hopefully we can go on and win it - then he can talk about that result.

 

[PhilM]

Ok mate. 'Consistently' obsessional it is then.

So basically anyone who disagrees with your increasingly flawed support of RM is fickle, lacking in substance, ridiculous & self defeating?

That would now cover a growing amount of the fanbase mate, you're aware of that, yes?

Of course he is. Dave just enjoys winding people up!

 

[oldblue]

fans pay money to see a combination of winning, entertainment and/or passion.

Do they? You're generally getting entertainment and I reckon passion. As for winning, well I think we should be hoping rather than expecting. This is really my main worry. The entertainment is pretty much impossible if fans turn up expecting to win.
Everyone wants to see this side winning more but turning up believing we've a right to win because we have a decent young side is a huge problem and an unnecessary pressure

 

[davek]

No cups

Just same league position

Would you say time to change

The thing is we dont know where we're finishing this season. You're saying another midtable place when it's only happened once. We still have loads of games to get nicely up into the top half.

I've said it before loads though: i;m NEA about chasing 7th rather tan settling for midtable. It doesn't mean anything at al. It's all nothingness. If we won a trophy it;d be the biggest boost we could have as a club. No 7th place no mark berth can be compared to that.

I think rather than quizzing me, you have to ask yourself what realistically is good as an objective.

 

[Blues Harp]

Try 'consistent'.

I cant take seriously fickle people. Not one bit. They lack substance. No apologies for what I said. It's a ridiculous attitude to have...and self defeating.

You be there on Wednesday ? Where you there on Sunday - I think not - just keep digging your hole and stop blaming your fellow Evertonians for the managers inadequacies - but you won't of course.

 

[oldblue]

Ball and Carragher are quite correct. Teams must now love coming to Goodison as our approach under Martinez is unbelievably predictable.

Unless it's a team who'll come at us (the likes of Arsenal or City), we play a rigid style of slow, laborious and utterly turgid style of football.

A team knows that if they sit back with fixed ranks that we'll merely play the ball across with no tempo, trying to intrinsically walk through them.

There's very little cutting edge: Barkley tries to waltz through; our wide players are reluctant to run and beat a man often hesitating further up.

Only Besic seems to offer any tempo! Then at the back, knowing Howard's distribution is awful, that with correct pressure we will make mistakes.

Either up the tempo when we have the ball or let teams have more freedom so that we can counter where we look our strongest.

As right now the system is putting pressure on our players to succeed in a way which is either unnatural to them, or they can't capitalise on.

That's practically rewriting history. Martinez is under pressure to turn it round and I'm not convinced by many things, but some stuff is bordering on hysteria.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

Try 'consistent'.

I cant take seriously fickle people. Not one bit. They lack substance. No apologies for what I said. It's a ridiculous attitude to have...and self defeating.

And to think - You're (allegedly) one of the respected 'elder statesmen' of posters on here.

And that (above) is what you think of fellow Evertonians who don't buy your incessantly feeble ramblings about martinez? Ones who see a totally different side of the coin...

According to you, they're all of the above. You're right, and anyone who disagrees will be pigeonholed. Any other risible accusations you want to dole out?

...Go on, why not get them off your chest!?

For shame. Carry on...deluding yourself that you're comfortably batting allcomers away, and from all angles, with your arbitrary scenarios and moribund excuses.

I haven't seen an example of one poster (who disagrees with you) that you've convinced in this thread. I'm sure you see yourself as some sort of modern-day Copernicus - Except you're just not. You're rapidly becoming a parody of yourself. Stop it.