Martinez new Belgium head coach

[Papa Shango]

Of course they can improve, especially when as young as he is.

You can argue the toss either way over Martinez as far as I am concerned. I for one was very impressed with him after his first season and didn't actually start calling for his head until the 3rd season when it was clear he was just spouting crap and we were going backwards and at that point looked a very bad manager.

As of yet though, he still has to prove he is a good manager. Stevie Wonder could manage this Belgium side to the latter stages of a tournament.

What I will debate though and put a counter response to is all this, "72 point best ever PL season" garbage. Our best season was 4th under Moyes, who also gained 3 x 5th place finishes which Martinez managed to equal once.

Its not a fair debate that though. In his first 3 (full) seasons he came 7th, 17th and 4th. The 3 x 5th placed finishes are nice (ish) but that was over 11 seasons. Martinez only got 3 (and rightfully so, it was time for him to go) but could he have done it over 11 seasons? Possibly.

 

[Thomasc]

Its not a fair debate that though. In his first 3 (full) seasons he came 7th, 17th and 4th. The 3 x 5th placed finishes are nice (ish) but that was over 11 seasons. Martinez only got 3 (and rightfully so, it was time for him to go) but could he have done it over 11 seasons? Possibly.

I really don't know what you are trying to defend or what point you are trying to make. You are saying he could have done better over a longer period, yet at the same time agreeing it was the right time for him to go.

All I know is what I saw with my own eyes - he had 100% lost the team and players and they were not even trying for him. Our worst home record since 1930 something, with some regular drubbings thrown in. He has not done anything in the period that has followed to make anybody believe he might be a good manager.

He clearly interviews well and has a charm about him, which is what we all liked about him at Everton. But as a manger, the jury is firmly still out. I just don't understand Dave's infatuation with him, so challenge the garbage he spouts about him as I am an intelligent adult and my brain cannot compute such tosh.

 

[Carl O'Ancelotti]

lollollollol

Comedy gold.

 

[nsno-chris]

£45m James McCarthy bid incoming from the Geordie biffs.

Another nail in the coffin for those horrible inbred, Ant & Dec meffs

 

[davek]

We're not going backwards and forwards with this all night mate. You're just wrong.
I'll bid you a fond farewell.
Goodnight.

I accept your defeat.

 

[davek]

Leicester were a bit of a fluke

It's the same principle as the Moyes 4th place season, I suppose: 81 points was a fluke to win the league. But it doesn't make the season a fluke. How can oiling up 81 points in this league make it flukey? They were consistent over 38 games. As Everton were consistent over 38 games for the first time since the 80s.

 

[4737carlin]

It's the same principle as the Moyes 4th place season, I suppose: 81 points was a fluke to win the league. But it doesn't make the season a fluke. How can oiling up 81 points in this league make it flukey? They were consistent over 38 games. As Everton were consistent over 38 games for the first time since the 80s.

Agree on this, no fluke, however the credit for the 72 points goes to Moyes since it was he that had the players so well drilled and organised, infact if he had stayed just one more season I think in the 2013/14 season we might of got 73 points under Davey

 

[TheBigIguana]

The 72 points weren't a complete fluke. We were very good that season and absolutely should have been in the European places. But at the same time how many did we win with belters out of nowhere? I remember Swansea, Villa and Norwich without even thinking that hard. That was pretty clearly not a long term strategy. But man was it fun.

 

[polish]

 

[KaiserEFC]

If he was so good, why did Everton sack him? I distinctly remember SAF and Wenger being good for a long time and neither being sacked so funny we should sack this supposedly great manager.

 

[Papa Shango]

I really don't know what you are trying to defend or what point you are trying to make. You are saying he could have done better over a longer period, yet at the same time agreeing it was the right time for him to go.

All I know is what I saw with my own eyes - he had 100% lost the team and players and they were not even trying for him. Our worst home record since 1930 something, with some regular drubbings thrown in. He has not done anything in the period that has followed to make anybody believe he might be a good manager.

He clearly interviews well and has a charm about him, which is what we all liked about him at Everton. But as a manger, the jury is firmly still out. I just don't understand Dave's infatuation with him, so challenge the garbage he spouts about him as I am an intelligent adult and my brain cannot compute such tosh.

Moyes could easily have been sacked after his second season. Thankfully he wasn't, if Martinez had the same patience shown then he may very well have got there eventually but he had to go as the fans had turned on him and seemingly the players had downed tools.

I am only making the Moyes comparisons because you brought him up. I'm not massively bothered about home record (it's not really a thing) when the away record pulled us back into mid table, and we had some regular drubbings under Moyes too, I remember a period where we were getting hammered 4-0 by all and sundry.

So its a bit unfair to say that Moyes had 3 top 5 finishes etc when he was given the time to do that. There is no real comparison to make with things like that.

Martinez failed here ultimately, but that does not make him a bad manager either. he has generally done well everywhere else. People downplay Belgium getting to the semis of the World Cup as anyone could have done that, I am sure Germany and Brazil to name too would have happily took that run to the semis.

I can't speak for Dave at all but I reckon he amps up his love for Martinez to counteract the absolute vitriol that Martinez gets from some people. personally I dont think he is a boss manager, I don't think he is a bad one either though, the main problem with him is everyone needs to be onboard with his "vision" if not it quickly falls apart.

 

[Papa Shango]

If he was so good, why did Everton sack him? I distinctly remember SAF and Wenger being good for a long time and neither being sacked so funny we should sack this supposedly great manager.

Ferguson got sacked by St Mirren at roughly the same age so...

 

[Papa Shango]

View attachment 62259

 

[Papa Shango]

Agree on this, no fluke, however the credit for the 72 points goes to Moyes since it was he that had the players so well drilled and organised, infact if he had stayed just one more season I think in the 2013/14 season we might of got 73 points under Davey

He left us with no viable strikers. He would not have signed Lukaku (There was no sign of a permanent deal at the time). The other key players that season were Barry and McCarthy, would he have signed either of them?

 

[davek]

Agree on this, no fluke, however the credit for the 72 points goes to Moyes since it was he that had the players so well drilled and organised, infact if he had stayed just one more season I think in the 2013/14 season we might of got 73 points under Davey

Ha Ha Ha.

No.