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Moyes to Sunderland

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harris78 said:
I think they appreciate how much his hands are tied mate to be honest. Short wants rid and gave him nothing to work with in the transfer window other than scraps. I'm not a fan of Moyes but he is doing the 'best' with what he has got. Pickford is a good young keeper but its his first season and Kone seems to have a few good games a season in him. I have a sneaky feeling he will keep them up by hook or by crook and then see where they/he is after Short sells them or provides some funds.
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Alardyce did ok with the same players.

Moyes can't go for it. Doesn't know how to. You have to go for three points and Moyes has them set up not to get beat and they're nowhere near good enough to hang on to points.

He's a dinosaur. The game has passed his sort by.
 
davek said:
Alardyce did ok with the same players.

Moyes can't go for it. Doesn't know how to. You have to go for three points and Moyes has them set up not to get beat and they're nowhere near good enough to hang on to points.

He's a dinosaur. The game has passed his sort by.
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To a certain extent I agree, if he took the proverbial handbrake off they may get a few more points. On the other hand they could get smashed a few weeks in a row and all confidence has gone for the run in. I just think they have something in them to get out of it once again. Moyes won't do pretty but I think it will work. Then next season comes and can he reinvent himself......I'm not so sure
 
harris78 said:
I think they appreciate how much his hands are tied mate to be honest. Short wants rid and gave him nothing to work with in the transfer window other than scraps. I'm not a fan of Moyes but he is doing the 'best' with what he has got. Pickford is a good young keeper but its his first season and Kone seems to have a few good games a season in him. I have a sneaky feeling he will keep them up by hook or by crook and then see where they/he is after Short sells them or provides some funds.
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Moyes doesn't have the imagination to change what's happening, we all know this. They don't have the time for his 'ways'.
 
harris78 said:
To a certain extent I agree, if he took the proverbial handbrake off they may get a few more points. On the other hand they could get smashed a few weeks in a row and all confidence has gone for the run in. I just think they have something in them to get out of it once again. Moyes won't do pretty but I think it will work. Then next season comes and can he reinvent himself......I'm not so sure
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It looks impossible to me. I can't even think who they get wins against.
 
the only thing is, they have a lot of winnable fixtures in the run-in
Boro A
Burnley A
Watford A
Leicester A
Man United H
West Ham H
Arsenal A
Bournemouth H
Hull A
Swansea H
Chelsea A
 

They're down all bar a miracle...how much of this will because or despite Moyes, is and will be debateable.
He's had all season to get them in some sort of shape, but didn't have much to work with, signing all his old boys did him no favours on or off the pitch.

He'll get most of the blame, but in the strange ways of football he might still be there next season...where else will he go
 
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Gwladysstreetlad said:
Still better them loads of manager's in or around the premier league.
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He isn't though! About ten years ago he was.

Time moves on. It's like when Howard Wilkinson was still getting jobs ten years after he won the league.

He had a nice run. It's over for him now, the main problem is that he is (somewhat harshly) cast as a joke now. No club with ambition will give him a go which leaves him with the lower end teams.
 
Papa Shango said:
He isn't though! About ten years ago he was.

Time moves on. It's like when Howard Wilkinson was still getting jobs ten years after he won the league.

He had a nice run. It's over for him now, the main problem is that he is (somewhat harshly) cast as a joke now. No club with ambition will give him a go which leaves him with the lower end teams.
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Yep, hes done, hes not the manager he was for us, despite his many faults he did a superb job with us, but football moves on, his time is over, the great managers adapt their games, hes not a great manager.
 

Papa Shango said:
He isn't though! About ten years ago he was.

Time moves on. It's like when Howard Wilkinson was still getting jobs ten years after he won the league.

He had a nice run. It's over for him now, the main problem is that he is (somewhat harshly) cast as a joke now. No club with ambition will give him a go which leaves him with the lower end teams.
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So you think Moyes is worse then Aitor Karanka, Sam Allardyce, Mark Hughes, Tony Pulis, Slaven Bilic and a few more all because they're having a slightly better season then Moyes who is stuck with that dogs##t awful sunderland side. You must have the memory of a goldfish. Give Moyes a club in the right position (just not as horrible as sunderland's position would be a start) and that doesn't have that vipers nest of players and he'd do a better job then half the managers in this league.
 
Gwladysstreetlad said:
So you think Moyes is worse then Aitor Karanka, Sam Allardyce, Mark Hughes, Tony Pulis, Slaven Bilic and a few more all because they're having a slightly better season then Moyes who is stuck with that dogs##t awful sunderland side. You must have the memory of a goldfish. Give Moyes a club in the right position (just not as horrible as sunderland's position would be a start) and that doesn't have that vipers nest of players and he'd do a better job then half the managers in this league.
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Yes of course I do. It's 2017.

You say I have the memory of a Goldfish but I don't think you have even read what I said. He was a good manager a good few years ago, time has moved on and he has not.

Allardyce did a better job with the same club in the same position, Pulis is actually really good at what he does.

He is "stuck" with an awful Sunderland because he has failed at his past two jobs, he has had clubs in the right position as you put it and he didn't do the job then either. It probably didn't help that he came into Sunderland and basically said they were doomed anyway either.

He will never recover because for Moyes to have "success" he needs to have a similar deal to what he has with us. Loads of time and faith to change the whole mentality of a club so he can mould it into his image. You just don't get that these days.

He did well for us, no doubt about it, for what we needed at the time. Then he hit a wall and he was not able to get over it.

Facts are he has been a manager for nigh on 20 years and all he has won is the third division with PNE.

Decent manager but lets not pretend he is some downtrodden genius or something. In 2017 a team like Sunderland is about his level.
 
Papa Shango said:
Yes of course I do. It's 2017.

You say I have the memory of a Goldfish but I don't think you have even read what I said. He was a good manager a good few years ago, time has moved on and he has not.

Allardyce did a better job with the same club in the same position, Pulis is actually really good at what he does.

He is "stuck" with an awful Sunderland because he has failed at his past two jobs, he has had clubs in the right position as you put it and he didn't do the job then either. It probably didn't help that he came into Sunderland and basically said they were doomed anyway either.

He will never recover because for Moyes to have "success" he needs to have a similar deal to what he has with us. Loads of time and faith to change the whole mentality of a club so he can mould it into his image. You just don't get that these days.

He did well for us, no doubt about it, for what we needed at the time. Then he hit a wall and he was not able to get over it.

Facts are he has been a manager for nigh on 20 years and all he has won is the third division with PNE.

Decent manager but lets not pretend he is some downtrodden genius or something. In 2017 a team like Sunderland is about his level.
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whatever mate, your obviously entitled to your opinion. No point in discussing it further because nither of us are going to change our minds.
 
davek said:
Alardyce did ok with the same players.

Moyes can't go for it. Doesn't know how to. You have to go for three points and Moyes has them set up not to get beat and they're nowhere near good enough to hang on to points.

He's a dinosaur. The game has passed his sort by.
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Hard to argue with this.
 

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