Next manager discussion (poll reset 21/05/2016)

[bluestevon]

Spot on RM has not really given our Academy players a look in really apart from Galloway who has now disappeared.

and Galloway was bought in mate the same season he featured in the first team in the league, so IMO even including him as an academy product is like spurs including Ali as one of theirs

 

[davek]

Thing is though mate, a lot pof people and a lot of managers talk up the imprtance of the youth setup etc and bringing players through, but most of it is just hot air as they know the fans lap it up

Moyes for example had thi scarefully crafted image to the general footy fan as someone who brought youth through and was great with them etc - and by and large it was utter bollox and just clever PR - based on him lucking out by having Rooney at a young age and then Barkley nicely coming in at the end of his time here, but good with youth - not a chance on earth

Martinez - the young players he has been given a huge amount of credit for bringing along, Deulofeu, Lukaku, Galloway, Stones - all bought in, the only academy players he has brought in was Browning and that was out of an injury crisis prompting it, few appearances last season then banished back the udner 21's, a few this season then back the under 21's before getting injured. Barkley would have broken through no matter who the manager was - the way Rooney did - he is just that good.

But the rest of this great group of young academy players are being either released - like Ledson and a few others, or farmed out and bounced around on short term loans, brought back for a month then shipped off again, basically exactly the same way that young players are treated at the likes of Chelsea etc

Would Stones, Barkley, Lukaku and Deulofeu all get similar game time udner Mourinho - i'd say they would do actually, would the younger under 21 players have less chance of breaking through to the first team - i honestly don't know, if Martinez is given decent money to spend on the team and stays obviously he is going to be spending it on bringing players in who will make it harder for the young lads to bring in, thats just the reality of managing at this level

The teams and coaches who get reputations for bringing youth through often get that rep because they have to not because they choose too

take us for example, arguably two of our best young udner 21 players are Kenney and Dowell, Martinez tried to get in Byram a 21yo who would basically push Kenney firther away from ever getting a chance, he also brought in that Brazillian we loaned out hoping hed stay fit etc and that again would push keney firther away from ever getting a chance.

Dowell - we bought the young swizz lad who will push him further away from ever getting a chance in the team, we have also been after a established fiurst team player who would play the same position a sthe lad - meaning he would be pushed even further away from ever getting a chance to play for us.

You give Martinez say 100m to spend then he will spend it and he won't give a flying f about how it harms the chances of our academy lads developing.

That's about the worst reading of the cash/manager options as I can imagine. Anyone observing Martinez's time here can easily see that he'd blend decent money signings with blooding younger players.

As for not knowing if Mourinho would use academy players - the mind boggles how you could be hesitant about that scenario. He'd spend money like it were confetti before ever turning to a club's academy.


I'm sorry mate. I think you're exhibiting all the signs of forum fever: delirium and excitable outbursts.

Sad to see. You know your eastern European footy like, I'll give you that. I'd stick to that instead of critiquing a manager your objectivity went west on, though.

 

[MartSlinger]

Pellegrini all day long for me!
Proven in the prem and has some clout to get some top players at our club

I like De Boer but dutch football isnt that strong so anything less than winning the league... bit like celtic and we don't want another Walter smith do we!!!!

The same Pellegrini that has unlimited money and one of the best squads in the League, a squad that should be winning the League with ease, but hasn't because they fella doesnt have a clue?!

 

[jceverton]

Thing is though mate, a lot pof people and a lot of managers talk up the imprtance of the youth setup etc and bringing players through, but most of it is just hot air as they know the fans lap it up

Moyes for example had thi scarefully crafted image to the general footy fan as someone who brought youth through and was great with them etc - and by and large it was utter bollox and just clever PR - based on him lucking out by having Rooney at a young age and then Barkley nicely coming in at the end of his time here, but good with youth - not a chance on earth

Martinez - the young players he has been given a huge amount of credit for bringing along, Deulofeu, Lukaku, Galloway, Stones - all bought in, the only academy players he has brought in was Browning and that was out of an injury crisis prompting it, few appearances last season then banished back the udner 21's, a few this season then back the under 21's before getting injured. Barkley would have broken through no matter who the manager was - the way Rooney did - he is just that good.

But the rest of this great group of young academy players are being either released - like Ledson and a few others, or farmed out and bounced around on short term loans, brought back for a month then shipped off again, basically exactly the same way that young players are treated at the likes of Chelsea etc

Would Stones, Barkley, Lukaku and Deulofeu all get similar game time udner Mourinho - i'd say they would do actually, would the younger under 21 players have less chance of breaking through to the first team - i honestly don't know, if Martinez is given decent money to spend on the team and stays obviously he is going to be spending it on bringing players in who will make it harder for the young lads to bring in, thats just the reality of managing at this level

The teams and coaches who get reputations for bringing youth through often get that rep because they have to not because they choose too

take us for example, arguably two of our best young udner 21 players are Kenney and Dowell, Martinez tried to get in Byram a 21yo who would basically push Kenney firther away from ever getting a chance, he also brought in that Brazillian we loaned out hoping hed stay fit etc and that again would push keney firther away from ever getting a chance.

Dowell - we bought the young swizz lad who will push him further away from ever getting a chance in the team, we have also been after a established fiurst team player who would play the same position a sthe lad - meaning he would be pushed even further away from ever getting a chance to play for us.

You give Martinez say 100m to spend then he will spend it and he won't give a flying f about how it harms the chances of our academy lads developing.

The best one in the league at the minute for promoting young players is Pochettino so it can be done but the manager needs to have a strong belief in bringing through young players. I'm not convinced Martinez has, Mourinho definitely doesn't and neither did Moyes.

 

[orly]

The same Pellegrini that has unlimited money and one of the best squads in the League, a squad that should be winning the League with ease, but hasn't because they fella doesnt have a clue?!

Wouldn't say two league cups and a Premier League title is a disaster like.

Also, if you look at his Malaga / Villareal sides that would be an ace thing for Everton to replicate.

 

[Grfirestorm]

City are critised a lot for defensive frailty, especially when Kompany is injured, I'm not sure why Pellegrini is that good a shout, he's had a lot of money and I'd say hit and miss with signings. Diego Simeone would be much better for us, however the likelihood.....

 

[DualityNSNO]

City are critised a lot for defensive frailty, especially when Kompany is injured, I'm not sure why Pellegrini is that good a shout, he's had a lot of money and I'd say hit and miss with signings. Diego Simeone would be much better for us, however the likelihood.....

The likelihood of that is the same as getting Pep in right now.

 

[TheFinnFan]

Did that Turkey sites story reach british media?

 

[orly]

Did that Turkey sites story reach british media?

It's been embargoed by the club over here Finners.

It's on *taps nose with all 10 fingers

 

[TheFinnFan]

It's been embargoed by the club over here Finners.

It's on *taps nose with all 10 fingers

Yerrrsss

 

[Eric Djemba-Djemba]

Look at his record at Swansea - from Wikipedia.

On 24 February 2007, he returned to Swansea City as manager on a two-year contract, replacing Kenny Jackett, who had let him go at the end of the previous season. This appointment was mostly met positively from the fans, despite him not having any managerial experience.

With Martínez in charge, Swansea lost just once in 11 games, giving them a chance of clinching a play-off place on the final day of the 2006–07 season, but missed out following a 6–3 defeat at home against Blackpool. Martínez won his first League One Manager of the Month Award for October 2007 by leading his team to four straight wins in four in the league, including a 5–0 win and a 4–1 win over Leyton Orient and Bournemouth, respectively, away from home.

He went on to win the Award consecutively, in December after a thrilling 3–2 win over Leeds United at the Swans' Liberty Stadium, and in January after a second 4–0 win away from home against Doncaster Rovers. He was also nominated for the February prize but lost out to John Ward, manager of Carlisle United. In April 2008, Martínez signed a new contract with Swansea as the club became League One Champions, securing promotion to the Championship, and in May 2008, he was awarded the League One Manager of the Year Award for leading Swansea to the title.

The 2008–09 season saw Martínez preside over Swansea's first game in England's second-tier division in 24 years, which began poorly with a 2–0 defeat away at Charlton Athletic. Subsequently, Swansea's form improved and they lost only four games out of the next 30, including a number of key league victories against opponents such as Reading and Wolverhampton Wanderers. Martínez also guided his team to a 2–0 FA Cup win against Premier League side Portsmouth, who were the defending cup holders.

Looks like he found his level in League 1.

 

[bluestevon]

That's about the worst reading of the cash/manager options as I can imagine. Anyone observing Martinez's time here can easily see that he'd blend decent money signings with blooding younger players.

As for not knowing if Mourinho would use academy players - the mind boggles how you could be hesitant about that scenario. He'd spend money like it were confetti before ever turning to a club's academy.


I'm sorry mate. I think you're exhibiting all the signs of forum fever: delirium and excitable outbursts.

Sad to see. You know your eastern European footy like, I'll give you that. I'd stick to that instead of critiquing a manager your objectivity went west on, though.

Yeah Dave, today was a absolutely ringing endorsement of Martinez by the new owner, some may say right at the bottom as an afterthought almost LOL

As for Martinez and the academy, warms my heart to see all those born and bred academy players he has been starting of late, is it Browning the only one he has in three years given a league start to btw?

 

[orly]

Yeah Dave, today was a absolutely ringing endorsement of Martinez by the new owner, some may say right at the bottom as an afterthought almost LOL

As for Martinez and the academy, warms my heart to see all those born and bred academy players he has been starting of late, is it Browning the only one he has in three years given a league start to btw?

It's brutal isn't it - and the worst thing about it, it's been ghost written by the Club!

Change is afoot methinks

 

[davek]

Yeah Dave, today was a absolutely ringing endorsement of Martinez by the new owner, some may say right at the bottom as an afterthought almost LOL

As for Martinez and the academy, warms my heart to see all those born and bred academy players he has been starting of late, is it Browning the only one he has in three years given a league start to btw?

He's made no secret of the fact he'd wanted Dowell in the full team set up. He had a terrible injury and that scuppered that. The thing is you cant throw loads in at the one time and you have to do this in games where there is a bit of breathing space - for example, the LC early rounds we saw youngsters used, but PL games are more exacting and they'll have to come through at a more even pace. Another thing to consider is RMs long stated view that players between 18-20 should be able to stay within the fold at the club AND get good experience. Obviously that would require a situation where PL 'B teams' could compete in lower divisions. Not something happening.

I just cant get my head around your view on Mourinho though: he's from the David Moyes endorsed King Herod school of football thought. He'll never play younger players if he can help it and he'll always go for the expensive, finished article. He'd look at Everton and say "yeah, that £100M will be ok for a couple of players and their wages and entourage, then I want some more." He's a complete non-starter for us.

 

[davek]

It's brutal isn't it - and the worst thing about it, it's been ghost written by the Club!

Change is afoot methinks

Lol.

I bet your little heart was racing when you read that press release...then you read the final sentence and it turned to ashes.

"Roberto and the boys". FFS, they sound like bezzies.