2021/22 Rafael Benitez

[BirkenheadBlue]

Like Ferguson as I’m sure you’ll know he was afforded some poor league positions early on - but ultimately both managers benefitted from stability and the platforms they were able to build

Moyes steered us away from relegation in his first season, and then finished 7th in his second season (our highest finish in 7 years).

By the time he had a bad run (nowhere near as bad as this one) he’d earned leeway.

 

[Marius57]

But when we lose because of individual moments that’s on the manager? Convenient argument that the wins aren’t down to him but the losses are, very convenient.

But that's literally what we are being told to excuse the losses.

"The players are making mistakes" but when we win "it's benitez tactics".

 

[Efcjake]

The saving us from relegation when he first joined and then taking us to 7th in the next season earnt him the time.

He's on course for the worst start to a season since Mike Walker.

Context is everything. Had Moyes or any other manager got off to a start like this I would expect fans to get on their backs too. It isn't good enough.

The other Everton managers earned the time they were given.

 

[BigDuncTributeBand]

Personally not really looking to shoot holes in any managers in the early stages of their tenure - after a decent period perhaps if they haven’t delivered

My question was more who might you find who we could attract and you wouldn’t shoot holes in?

I suspect it could be a short list, if not a blank sheet of paper?

Hardly a fair question. None of us are responsible for hiring and firing managers. That being the case, we don’t keep a little black book of up and coming managers for succession planning or give it much thought. It’s the owner directors job so your question is one for them.

What we know is this utter tool is making a bad situation worse. His personality is toxic, it’s killed the spirit in the squad - he thrives on conflict and is dividing the team. They don’t have faith in him or his tactics and they don’t want to play for him. Someone who thrives on conflict never stays anywhere for a long time, get him out now before he does more damage.

 

[BirkenheadBlue]

Are we in Trump land?

You tell me, you’re the one lying to make your point.

 

[Efcjake]

But when we lose because of individual moments that’s on the manager? Convenient argument that the wins aren’t down to him but the losses are, very convenient.

When the wins outnumber the losses so that they aren't complete outliers over a 3 month period maybe then he will get some credit for them.

 

[Saint Domingo]

Wow, we will finish ahead of Brighton? That's great!

You have named a bunch of average managers to prove your point but lets just say you are right, your handpicked manager list means nothing anyway! (Who the hell has said Hassenhuttl???) Your point reinforces nothing at all!

None of it is a reason to stick with a manager who is doomed anyway. And he is doomed, he always was.

They’re not average managers, they’re all fairly decent managers who are dealing with what every coach ends up dealing with if they’re outside the top 6, crap players, poor refereeing decisions, and a lack of real budget. My point is that there’s no miracle manager waiting in the wings to suddenly turn players who have been awful if we give managers to world beaters.

I’m not sure why Brighton are being besmirched when people have admitted that without our few best players we’re pretty much a bottom half side. I’d love us to be able to say ‘we should be pushing for Europe’ but anyone with a brain cell can take a look at some of the players here and realise that we don’t ‘deserve’ any position in the league, let alone assume we’ll fi sub ahead of the likes of Brighton just because we’re called Everton.

We’ve got rubbish players, and what decent players we have get injured all the time. They’re the realities. We have no divine right to finish anywhere.

 

[Nymzee]

Load of sleeper agents been activated in here this season.

 

[Legend Barry Horne]

Hardly a fair question. None of us are responsible for hiring and firing managers. That being the case, we don’t keep a little black book of up and coming managers for succession planning or give it much thought. It’s the owner directors job so your question is one for them.

What we know is this utter tool is making a bad situation worse. His personality is toxic, it’s killed the spirit in the squad - he thrives on conflict and is dividing the team. They don’t have faith in him or his tactics and they don’t want to play for him. Someone who thrives on conflict never stays anywhere for a long time, get him out now before he does more damage.

Come on - you can’t take zero responsibility and take pot shots from the sidelines at those in there doing it…

 

[Marius57]

Come on - you can’t take zero responsibility and take pot shots from the sidelines at those in there doing it…

Of course we can. We pay a lot of money into the club and are emotionally invested so when bad decisions are being made, then we have every right to call it out.

 

[Efcjake]

Come on - you can’t take zero responsibility and take pot shots from the sidelines at those in there doing it…

What do you think a supporter's forum is mate?

What responsibility do we have exactly?

 

[MACCA75]

A matter of opinion I guess - he came 15th, 7th and 17th in his first 3 seasons - so presumably the 7th earnt him the patience with the 17th?

But the fact was expectations were lower when he joined as previous few years we’d been bottom half

He raised expectations by delivering decent league positions on limited resources

But these days not many managers would be afforded coming as close to relegation as that 17th

The 15th was when he took over in March when we were sinking like a stone toward relegation like!

 

[BirkenheadBlue]

Load of sleeper agents been activated in here this season.

Does seem that way, doesn’t it?

 

[Legend Barry Horne]

You tell me, you’re the one lying to make your point.

Really? Seems the denial of fact and bullying is coming more from other quarters - which isn’t unusual when it comes to tribalism…

 

[Saint Domingo]

But that's literally what we are being told to excuse the losses.

"The players are making mistakes" but when we win "it's benitez tactics".

I’m not sure anyone has put any win down to Benitez’s tactics. Honestly most of these exchanges are people making up wild accusations like:

‘He’s lost all the players’

‘He’s forcing our best players out’

‘We’re getting relegated’

‘I can’t see where the next win is coming from’


When you point out that these things are either unlikely or just factually incorrect you then get accused of massively fan boying Benitez. I’m not sure I’ve read a single post that has praised his tactics or credited them for getting a win. It’s not irrational to point out the logical fallacy of crediting the fans and players for every win but blaming the manager for every loss.