2021/22 Richarlison

[TheBigIguana]

They won't but you discussing an either/or scenario of £75m Richy vs £80m Haaland is just financially redundant that's all.

Frankly the scenario could be Richarlison for 75m and Haaland for 750m and I'm picking Haaland

 

[roydo]

I don't even know why we're doing this, money is no object to City and they have their choice of about 95% of the players in the world. They won't be landing on Richarlison.

Never said they would. But Haaland to City would have massive accounting issues for them. Richy wouldnt.

 

[TheBigIguana]

….he takes up more central goalscoring positions when the team has possession, so he’s not a conventional wide player knocking crosses into the box. He’ll do his bit defensively when the opposition have the ball.

The key has been the loss of Digne who was capable of providing that creativity from the left. Crazy selling him.

There isn't a long list of wide players who play like that in highly successful teams. It is a limiting factor for a side when one side of your attack is a fullback with limited support.

 

[YoboCopter]

Richarlison will go for more than we paid for him but not as much as we want

Lets leave it at that

 

[Eggs]

There isn't a long list of wide players who play like that in highly successful teams. It is a limiting factor for a side when one side of your attack is a fullback with limited support.

…there isn’t, it suits our needs. Funny enough, whilst Haaland might be just what City need, they rarely play with a conventional striker. With his versatility, I think Richarlison would’ve been more effective for City than Grealish (and Jesus) this season.

 

[Neiler]

The issue I'd have with this regarding Richarlison specifically is that if he's a wide player he is supposed to be the creativity at least to some extent. He's not and really hasn't been even when the team functioned on the whole way better than it has this season.

Dont think I’d agree with that either mate, I think he’s more then capable of taking lads on, making yards, dribbling into the box, breaking a line with pace and movement, taking two defenders over to his side, stretching a back four, wearing defenders down and being a pest, he can come inside, test the keeper, I mean that overhaed kick - pwoar. That’s before you look at pressing from a defensive point of view. He doesn’t stand in the ball like Jamo or Gylfi, but there are many ways to be creative.

Like I said their is a variance of opinion.

You seem to like a certain type, you tend to be very critical of players like Richarlison and Doucoure who rely on an honesty of effort and other attributes to compliment their skills, but like players like Iwobi, who can do one moment of genius once every five to ten games. That’s fine we all have our likes, but you have to be aware of our own bias’s when objectively appraising. Out of curiosity did you think Tim Cahill was limited? I often liken Richarrlson and Cahill as I think they are made of the same stuff, not literally obviously as they are different players, but from a values, desire, fight etc point of view.

 

[DanB90]

Out of curiosity did you think Tim Cahill was limited? I often liken Richarrlson and Cahill as I think they are made of the same stuff, not literally obviously as they are different players, but from a values point of view.

This is actually a very good point. And kind of backs up what others are saying. Tim Cahill to us was almost priceless at his peak, we’d have been mad to sell him, but I doubt there was a queue of teams lining up to throw tens of millions at us for him either.

 

[roydo]

rely on an honesty of effort and other attributes to compliment their skills,

Quite. Peter Reid and Roy Keane were both "limited" players, in a "Wow, look at that" way .

But their places in the history of two massive clubs is never going to be rewritten.

 

[TheBigIguana]

…there isn’t, it suits our needs. Funny enough, whilst Haaland might be just what City need, they rarely play with a conventional striker. With his versatility, I think Richarlison would’ve been more effective for City than Grealish (and Jesus) this season.

They don't play with a conventional striker because they haven't had one (aside from Jesus but he's become a winger weirdly) since Aguero stopped staying fit almost three seasons ago. I know it is Pep's wet dream to play a side that is essentially 11 midfielders and that means he loves playing a false nine when he can but it doesn't mean they shouldn't look to get a real striker again.

Richarlison does not fit City's team as a wide player because he cannot reliably pass the ball to a teammate. I guarantee he'd not play there for them because that is such a non-starter.

 

[Zatara]

You seem to like a certain type, you tend to be very critical of players like Richarlison and Doucoure who rely on an honesty of effort and other attributes to compliment their skills, but like players like Iwobi, who can do one moment of genius once every five to ten games.

Almost like someone doesnt watch the 90mins, only highlights.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Dont think I’d agree with that either mate, I think he’s more then capable of taking lads on, making yards, dribbling into the box, breaking a line with pace and movement, taking two defenders over to his side, stretching a back four, wearing defenders down and being a pest, he can come inside, test the keeper, I mean that overhaed kick - pwoar. That’s before you look at pressing from a defensive point of view. He doesn’t stand in the ball like Jamo or Gylfi, but there are many ways to be creative.

Like I said their is a variance of opinion.

You seem to like a certain type, you tend to be very critical of players like Richarlison and Doucoure who rely on an honesty of effort and other attributes to compliment their skills, but like players like Iwobi, who can do one moment of genius once every five to ten games. That’s fine we all have our likes, but you have to be aware of our own bias’s when objectively appraising. Out of curiosity did you think Tim Cahill was limited? I often liken Richarrlson and Cahill as I think they are made of the same stuff, not literally obviously as they are different players, but from a values, desire, fight etc point of view.

Maybe he could start doing all these things consistently then. He hasn't been.

I don't like players who run a lot and don't contribute things that win football matches. Iwobi isn't the greatest player in the world but it isn't even the moments of genius that I like, it is that he is the single player we have now (since we sold James and Digne) that can consistently pass or dribble the ball from midfield into the final third. That's really all it is, he has one useful skill that can help us win. Richarlison for the record also has one useful skill and it is scoring goals.

That creates a problem right now because he's not really scoring goals (glad he kept his nerve on the penalties at least). One dimensional players aren't worth 75m unless they're the elite of the elite at that thing. Richarlison is not.

Fight, desire all that is great to a point. You've also got to be able to play football at a certain level and I'd say right now we've got an entire team of players who can't. No one is exempt anymore.

 

[roydo]

Fight, desire all that is great to a point.

No, its the #1 priority in any professional footballer, well, actually, any sportsman. Without it, no matter how great your skills are, you will not make it to a pro level. Thing is, some show it after they have become pro, and in their minds, "made it". And some dont.

edit. Pretty sure its @Eggs who calls it "the game matters to them" or sommet. He is right.

 

[Neiler]

Maybe he could start doing all these things consistently then. He hasn't been.

I don't like players who run a lot and don't contribute things that win football matches. Iwobi isn't the greatest player in the world but it isn't even the moments of genius that I like, it is that he is the single player we have now (since we sold James and Digne) that can consistently pass or dribble the ball from midfield into the final third. That's really all it is, he has one useful skill that can help us win. Richarlison for the record also has one useful skill and it is scoring goals.

That creates a problem right now because he's not really scoring goals (glad he kept his nerve on the penalties at least). One dimensional players aren't worth 75m unless they're the elite of the elite at that thing. Richarlison is not.

Fight, desire all that is great to a point. You've also got to be able to play football at a certain level and I'd say right now we've got an entire team of players who can't. No one is exempt anymore.

I think we hold different opinions on our assessments mate which goes back to my earlier point on differing valuations and worth, all good, agree to differ!

 

[TheBigIguana]

No, its the #1 priority in any professional footballer, well, actually, any sportsman. Without it, no matter how great your skills are, you will not make it to a pro level. Thing is, some show it after they have become pro, and in their minds, "made it". And some dont.

Sure, Evertonians imo go too far though to the point that it almost feels like we don't think skill matters. And at this level it really clearly does.

I mean it is going to happen this weekend, we're going to go to Anfield and lose and people will post on here about how we could have done better if they just cared more, fought harder, whatever. And it just isn't true. The RS have better, more skilled players and that is going to be enough for them. We have to stop expecting to move forward on just blood and sweat. We've got to find guys that can play too.

Which is ultimately why I'm perfectly fine with moving on someone like Richarlison. He puts his all into it, great, he's just not skilled enough to be the best player on a PL team that wants to do anything but sneak by getting relegated.

 

[Frenk]

Sure, Evertonians imo go too far though to the point that it almost feels like we don't think skill matters. And at this level it really clearly does.

I mean it is going to happen this weekend, we're going to go to Anfield and lose and people will post on here about how we could have done better if they just cared more, fought harder, whatever. And it just isn't true. The RS have better, more skilled players and that is going to be enough for them. We have to stop expecting to move forward on just blood and sweat. We've got to find guys that can play too.

Which is ultimately why I'm perfectly fine with moving on someone like Richarlison. He puts his all into it, great, he's just not skilled enough to be the best player on a PL team that wants to do anything but sneak by getting relegated.

They have non-bottlers too. The question is how do you make sure you are signing a non-bottler?