Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

Martinez in or out?

  • In

  • Out

  • Getting splinters eating cheese on toast on the fence

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Out of interest, in the unlikely event that we take 16-20 points for our remaining games and end up around the 60 point mark in a Europa qualifying berth, and win the FA Cup, would the 'out' vote have a rethink?
And, if we were to get just 4-10 points and go out in the semi would the 'in' vote change?

Or is it cast in stone, and more a vote on the managers persona and general ability rather than form?
 
bluestevon said:
No other club with any ambition would tolerate this seasons home record and overall league performance.

1. Do i care that he got 72 point in his first season - not at all, that gave him the grace of a terrible last season, he used that credit up in spades this season was the one he started needing to show what he was all about, in that he has done, he can manage a team in a cup environ, but in the league looks out of his depth and clueless
2. Do i care we got to two semi finals in the cup - no, one of those semi's make the situation worse, we where 3-1 up in the tie and then the manager makes a 'league like' decision, and after that we bottled it as a team, Kone out of form and with no confidence coming on and cheerio any chance of the cup final, in the FA cup - people like @davek are lauding it like we won it already (although he is careful to cover his arse by saying even if we lose its a great acheievement etc etc etc ), sorry but Villa managed by Tim Sherwood managed to reach a cup final last season - look at them this, Wigan, Birmingham, Portsmouth all won cup finals, great if we win it, but does absolutely nothing besides paper over the cracks in terms of where we are as a team and progress we are making (or lack therof)
3.Do i care that we are 'the entertainers' - nope, because that title is given almost as a pat on the head by people, yeah your crap but fun to watch as a neutral etc, stick it in the same bag as punching above ourt weight and knives to gunfights for how it means nothing but a backhand compliment.
4. Do i care that we have conceded the most goals of any team in the league at home, including Villa - yup, home form dictates where you are as a team and by and large the team tends to play to the managers 'philosophy' most at home for teams - the home everton is the real martinez style of play
5. Do i care we have lost 8 games at home and won 4 (3 of thos eagainst the bottom 3 teams this season) - yup i do because that shows that besides for the absolute terrible teams in this league that any other team has found us out at Goodison and the manager hasn't got a clue what to do about it
6. Do i care that we have lost more points from winning positions than any othe team - yup, because that shows a team lacking in character - and a team is a reflection of the manager, no character, no spine and no responsibility attached, no surprise though as how can the manager hold any player accountable when he singularly fails to either take any of the responsibility on himself or hides his head in the sand with talks about luck, refs and phenomenal performances not giving what we deserved
7. Do i think its an utter embaressment to have Stones, Deulofeu benched from this team and their development seemingly going backwards - yup, because after all one of Martinez selling points is how he develops through youth, Galloway is now back with the udner 21's, Stones looks a shell of a player in large part due to Martinez mismanagement of him, Deulofeu has become the victim of martinez being unable to organize a defense - so unless a player can 'put a shift' in then they can't play - that sounds very similar to what Moyes used to do and the reasons he wouldn't play young players doesn't it?
8. Do i think we need to change the manager - 100% yes, keeping a hold of martinez is something that no club with any real ambition of going anywhere besides the championship would do, if we keep hold of him then it's a huge red flag that 'this is ok' - players with more ambition than a semi final and 12th place will move on, yes they may move anyway but can guarantee it will be a lot faster that they leave under the current manager
9. do i think @davek will answer this post, - kind of, he will probably pick one or two points and give some slant on how it's amazing and phenomenal and the rest eh will just swerve any answer to.
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Crikey. His mind games have sent you over the edge. You've been daveked.
 
Stayed well clear yesterday, but let's be perfectly honest.

This is in no way shape or form good enough. Yesterday was pathetic and each week it's getting worse - the cup is the only thing keeping him in his job at the moment in my opinion
 

evertony said:
Out of interest, in the unlikely event that we take 16-20 points for our remaining games and end up around the 60 point mark in a Europa qualifying berth, and win the FA Cup, would the 'out' vote have a rethink?
And, if we were to get just 4-10 points and go out in the semi would the 'in' vote change?

Or is it cast in stone, and more a vote on the managers persona and general ability rather than form?
Click to expand...
Its the whole Martinez package that is a get rid for me. Stubborness, poor backroom staff selection and increasingly bizarre press conferences. Not to say inconsistent form. Does anyone else avoid his press conferences for fear of a dose of verbal diaorphea?
 
With the exception of Howard, who we nearly binned too early, I can't recall in my lifetime any managerial change that's significantly improved us positionally and playing-wise. Big Joe brought fight and an FA Cup but the general standard was poor to watch. Not sacking anyone never got us relegated....albeit we were 'skin of the teeth' on mor Ethan one occasion.

It's not difficult to see why we're all split on this. In truth, nobody really knows what's best....and that's the ball-ache.

A moment of genius, a crunching tackle, a fight-back from injustice or a galvanising performance often change the course of a season or a team. I'm clinging on to a fight back from injustice at the Pit.....a resistance to the adversity of a typical Liverpool decision going against us and us some how coming back to win the game to be our Oxford United moment.

The John Aldridge meltdown would be wholly apt too.
 

lancs blue said:
Its the whole Martinez package that is a get rid for me. Stubborness, poor backroom staff selection and increasingly bizarre press conferences. Not to say inconsistent form. Does anyone else avoid his press conferences for fear of a dose of verbal diaorphea?
Click to expand...

I'm pro-Martinez but his pressers are a 'no-go' for me....he's just too Brendan Rodgers when he lays on the positivity like thick peanut butter.
 
evertony said:
With the exception of Howard, who we nearly binned too early, I can't recall in my lifetime any managerial change that's significantly improved us positionally and playing-wise. Big Joe brought fight and an FA Cup but the general standard was poor to watch. Not sacking anyone never got us relegated....albeit we were 'skin of the teeth' on mor Ethan one occasion.

It's not difficult to see why we're all split on this. In truth, nobody really knows what's best....and that's the ball-ache.

A moment of genius, a crunching tackle, a fight-back from injustice or a galvanising performance often change the course of a season or a team. I'm clinging on to a fight back from injustice at the Pit.....a resistance to the adversity of a typical Liverpool decision going against us and us some how coming back to win the game to be our Oxford United moment.

The John Aldridge meltdown would be wholly apt too.
Click to expand...

Errrm, we sacked Smith and appointed Moyes mate, would say that it was a change that improved us positionally and playing wise
 
bluestevon said:
Errrm, we sacked Smith and appointed Moyes mate, would say that it was a change that improved us positionally and playing wise
Click to expand...

Fair point, but the overall effect was we still won jack.....unless two games against Villareal really count as a Champions League season. Granted we punched above our weight at times under Moyes, but having travelled all over the place and across Europe to watch his ultra-negative away tactics I can't bring myself to say he was such an improvement on Walter. An improvement granted, but not as good as we should have expected with a change of manager of that type. In truth, we swapped a dour Scot for, you guessed it, a dour Scot.
It would be like swapping Martinez for Rodgers.
 
evertony said:
With the exception of Howard, who we nearly binned too early, I can't recall in my lifetime any managerial change that's significantly improved us positionally and playing-wise. Big Joe brought fight and an FA Cup but the general standard was poor to watch. Not sacking anyone never got us relegated....albeit we were 'skin of the teeth' on mor Ethan one occasion.

It's not difficult to see why we're all split on this. In truth, nobody really knows what's best....and that's the ball-ache.

A moment of genius, a crunching tackle, a fight-back from injustice or a galvanising performance often change the course of a season or a team. I'm clinging on to a fight back from injustice at the Pit.....a resistance to the adversity of a typical Liverpool decision going against us and us some how coming back to win the game to be our Oxford United moment.

The John Aldridge meltdown would be wholly apt too.
Click to expand...

Whether it would improve us or not is open to question. The simple facts are though that we are going backwards and that cannot be left to continue.

His managerial record has been posted on here and it is very poor, with a win record inferior to Tony Pulis, even with approaching 3 full seasons with a club like Everton who were regular top half finishers until he rolled into town.
 

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