Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[orly]

@davek @sageyefc @paulbefc @Prevenger17 @MoutsGoat @ilikecheese @Roberto's Dream

In the words of Bjorge Lillelien,

''Your boys took one hell of a beating''

It's been savage Ian.

You've crushed them once again with sound logic.

Go easy on Goat though, he has seen the light but had a mid-season wobble.

 

[AJC5]

I have no idea whether Moshiri's presence is going to take things in a different direction than before, but when before have Everton managers been sacked for getting midtable and to two cup SFs (and possibly more to come)?

The football this season and the amount of goals and wins in all competitions we've had shows progress of sorts. It's simply not the case to present this as a collapse.

Our past history re sacking managers is irrelevant. We didn't have any cause to sack a manager while Moyes was in charge.

When was the last time Everton finished bottom half two years on the trot?

No one is questioning our ability to beat lower leagues teams in the cup. If Martinez stay in place we could be playing teams like Middlesborough on a much more regular basis.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

I'd like to point out that I've been banging the "get a new defensive coach" drum for over a year now

Check the vaults if you wish, it's all there

This is hardly a knee-jerk reaction from me based off one bad result. This is something I've saying for a very long time

I even said it after we smashed Sunderland 6-2 in fact

Again, check the vaults if you think I'm being dishonest

 

[The Esk]

...so, in the space of 7 days you've gone from a position that 'yes, Martinez will no doubt get next season to get things right' (or a position close to that) to one where it's time to go after one more 90 minutes of football.

I'm amazed.

I have no idea whether Moshiri's presence is going to take things in a different direction than before, but when before have Everton managers been sacked for getting midtable and to two cup SFs (and possibly more to come)?

The football this season and the amount of goals and wins in all competitions we've had shows progress of sorts. It's simply not the case to present this as a collapse.

I think you've succumbed to forum fever here mate. It's mass hysteria that has the horrible look about it of children stamping their expectant feet.

It's not only about 90 minutes of football Dave, it's also about what happens in the week between games.

What sort of preparation went into sending a team onto the pitch that was in such a mentally fragile state that they could not perform to any acceptable standard. What sort of tactical preparation went into this weekend's game?

If ever there was an opportunity to provide momentum going into the rest of the season it was yesterday, yet there was the exact opposite.

I've had enough, I was verging on the same opinion at the end of last season, yet gave him the benefit of the doubt, and again on several occasions this season.

With all the goodwill in the world, and I know he operates with the best of intent, but I will put it plainly, Martinez does not have the skill set to get the best out of this group of players nor build a club capable of competing in the top 4 or 6 of this league.

That's not mass hysteria, nor am I stamping my feet in the frustration of false expectation. It is the cold truth: Martinez is not good enough, he does not have the necessary skills.

 

[hktoffee]

Is five wins from 13 away games good form?

Looks like about 30% again...

21 wins out of 67 = 31.3% no wonder most people want him gone. What if he is still managing the club this time next year. It won't be 31.3% it will be even lowered?

 

[matty1878]

Well, alternatively we could all set our hair on fire.

What's that got to do with the excuses wavering on thin ice? Do tell.....

 

[Goat]

so that in short is you saying no he didnt give him the full season then before sacking him - after a ringing endorsement - thanks.

Here's the thing Dave - you have put one man ahead of the good of the club you've supported all your life now, you cannot see past your blinkered view, i honestly couldn't say if you are just being a WUM now or truly believe what your typing, i don't myself support Martinez, or any manager or player i support Everton dave - i think you need to get back to that yourself as right now you seem to have put one man above the club

as for saying that people are now following the herd - grow up, stating people like esk are doing that makes you look incredibly petulant and very silly.

Comparisions between Smith and Martinez are flawed no doubt, one manager took us over when we where really poor and struggling and kept us really poor and struggling even more
One manager took us over when we where about level with spurs and 5-8th nearly every season with an occasional cup run thrown in, and now has us as a lower half of the table who are fodder for any team that turns up at Goodison but he has thrown us a cup run

So Kenwright tells the truth now does he Dave? Or do you still believe the man is fundamentally a liar? be interesting to see how you manage to spin that answer

And theres the crux.

When Martinez came in, Spurs were our rivals, we pushed them for most of the season, now Spurs are challenging for the title, have CL football under their belt and we are challenging Villa and no mark French teams for the worst home record in the world.

Theres no progress, no level of improvement, only decline, a descent into darkness and theres only 1 man to blame currently, Bill did all he could, the utter fraud was given more money than ANY Everton manager in history and instead of improving us, hes actually made us worse.

No more Fortress Goodison, God I bet teams look forward to visiting Goodison and have it pencilled in as an away banker these days.

Its not good enough, not in a season when Leicester will win the Title with a worse squad than us, not in a season when the worst liverpool team in history will finish above us.

NSNO, we can ignore it for 1 season, in the search for progress, but when progress isnt made, changes have to happen.

 

[Fresh Prince of Belle Val]

It's understandable that those who want Martinez out are striking while the iron is hot after another home defeat. They have a bizarre vested interest.

But it's sheer lunacy for others to think the terrain has changed for Martinez and his position here. He's under no more or less pressure for his job than in the past 18 months.

We've progressed very well in cups; away form is good; home form terrible. Standard of play very high for the bulk of the season and scoring more than we ever have in previous seasons. Wembley appearance on the way and possible cup final and trophy. Shorn of all the "I've given him a chance and I've had enough" posts from people who should know better, that's what those in control are coolly looking at.

The management crisis was there before the Chelsea game...then it was a thing of the past...now it's back after the Arsenal game. It cannot be taken seriously.

J'accuse those of a usually more temperate nature of being railroaded by the latest hysterical wave of over reaction.

Over reaction? It's soon to be 4 home league wins in 12 months. That's about £150 per win for a season ticket holder.

 

[sageyefc]

@davek @sageyefc @paulbefc @Prevenger17 @MoutsGoat @ilikecheese @Roberto's Dream

In the words of Bjorge Lillelien,

''Your boys took one hell of a beating''

You'll all see the light when we win the cup


*goes back into bunker

 

[davek]

so that in short is you saying no he didnt give him the full season then before sacking him - after a ringing endorsement - thanks.

Eh? He had the CHANCE given to him and only sacked him when he had us dancing on the trapdoor again in March that following season. Lol. Mate, whatever point you thought you wee making in that original cut and paste job it hasn't worked out. I'd disown it now if I were you.

Here's the thing Dave - you have put one man ahead of the good of the club you've supported all your life now, you cannot see past your blinkered view, i honestly couldn't say if you are just being a WUM now or truly believe what your typing, i don't myself support Martinez, or any manager or player i support Everton dave - i think you need to get back to that yourself as right now you seem to have put one man above the club

as for saying that people are now following the herd - grow up, stating people like esk are doing that makes you look incredibly petulant and very silly.

Comparisions between Smith and Martinez are flawed no doubt, one manager took us over when we where really poor and struggling and kept us really poor and struggling even more
One manager took us over when we where about level with spurs and 5-8th nearly every season with an occasional cup run thrown in, and now has us as a lower half of the table who are fodder for any team that turns up at Goodison but he has thrown us a cup run

So Kenwright tells the truth now does he Dave? Or do you still believe the man is fundamentally a liar? be interesting to see how you manage to spin that answer

...and then the insults are trundled out because you have your 'point' rebuffed.

Why cant people just deal in the evidence?

Here that evidence is, btw (this is me "putting one man above the club"):

• He's assembled a great group of young players who can play with breathtaking attacking intent
• For the season as a whole we've competed well, more especially away from home in the PL and in the cups
• We are in absolutely no danger of anything other than picking up a shiny cup
• As much as anyone can tell the manager is supported by the man running the club

Again, I'm sorry if these points are inconvenient, but they just happen to be about the only meaningful way of assessing the issue.

Maybe you want me to just STFU and join your lynch mob?

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

That alone should have you thinking why are we even thinking of sticking with a manager when yourself think that unless he has a defensive coach and a world class striker we are screwed mate, think about it for a minute - what other club would think like that?

He brings a lot of good to the table to be fair to him

It's honestly just the defence that let's him down

We attack well, he gives youth a chance for the most part and he gets stuff out of veterans like Barry that I didn't think possible

It's for that reason that I'm prepared to stick with him, but he HAS to sort that defence

I live in hope that he'll get that defensive coach, and if he doesn't after a certain point I probably will join the "Out" brigade, but I'm not ready yet.

 

[ianefc]

It's been savage Ian.

You've crushed them once again with sound logic.

Go easy on Goat though, he has seen the light but had a mid-season wobble.

Mid season?????


This was last Tuesday.

Theres no more game in here, they banned Ian and the rest went missing like the utter rats they are.

The battle is over, a swift victory was claimed.

 

[Brahford]

Our past history re sacking managers is irrelevant. We didn't have any cause to sack a manager while Moyes was in charge.

When was the last time Everton finished bottom half two years on the trot?

No one is questioning our ability to beat lower leagues teams in the cup. If Martinez stay in place we could be playing teams like Middlesborough on a much more regular basis.

There is a very strong chance we'll be playing Boro next season

 

[Gwladys St. Glory]

Percentage Posting©

Learn the secrets for only £19.99

 

[Goat]

It's been savage Ian.

You've crushed them once again with sound logic.

Go easy on Goat though, he has seen the light but had a mid-season wobble.

I held on, in blind hope, I wanted to believe so much, I think it stems mostly from how vocal I was prior to him taking over, I foretold all that is happening and I honestly never wanted to be right, ive never wanted to be more wrong in my whole life.

His first season, im convinced it was a different manager, the football we played, the tactics employed, I dont see it from this man, this man just chats utter pony and loses football games meekly, this isnt a man I can support, this isnt a man that gets to ride with me, this is a man I will destroy.