Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[chazzle_dazzle]

I think we have two very good attacking full backs in Coleman and Baines.....perfect for how we were setup under Moyes with them charging forward.

Now with a possession based game it seems they should be able to pass the ball and the team keep the ball rather than them naturally charging forward (which is fun to watch but not when they cant get back into position like baines last game).

Coleman and Baines i think cant play this system...Coleman cant play with Deulofeu but can play with Lennon....why is that? Baines also does better with Cleverley in front of him rather than an attacking player.....

We have a system where the wide players should be attacking yet are caught short as we dont have the full backs to defend behind them.

Did you think that when coleman was taking the piss out of Cazorla?

 

[bluestevon]

Our most resolute performances have come with Jags at the back. You have some mad obsession with players under 25. If Martinez gets his way and replaces all of Moyes back 4 we will likely flirting with relegation. If Mori cuts out basic errors, if Stones cuts out basic errors. Do you honestly think he can coach a decent defence? I will conceed that Jagielka's distribution is poor, and doesn't fit into 'the system' but I have no faith in Martinez’s system.
Edit: v Arsenal we were caught cold twice due to Mori being out of position. Jags the Moyes fanboy elderly coward captain didn't shout at him *tongue in cheek*

Jagielka and Baines where two players who actually showed a bit of heart the other day, wasn't for jags they'd have scored at elast another 1 or 2

 

[BlueToff]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...inez-insists-Bramble-deserves-England-up.html
Read that and tell me lunch doesn't creep up your oesophagus..
Also..

Martinez is battling to hold on to Cattermole, 21 – a £6million target for former Latics manager Steve Bruce at Sunderland.

But he thinks the midfielder can achieve his dream if he stays at the DW Stadium.

He added: “He is trying to get into England’s World Cup squad and I’ve never seen anyone as focused as him.

“Lee is a leader – you don’t get many players like him.

“In my eyes he deserves to be close to the World Cup squad and he is focused on the role he has at Wigan.”

Cattermole was highly touted at that time...

but yeh, his praise of players is ridiculous but their his players and I'd rather he big them up than shoot them down.

In fact, he's now been criticised for blaming the players...

 

[BlueToff]

Jagielka and Baines where two players who actually showed a bit of heart the other day, wasn't for jags they'd have scored at elast another 1 or 2

They were both utter tosh.

Sorry but they were.

Showed nothing more than anybody else on the pitch. Though Jagielka did shout a lot in an attempt to organise.

 

[DrEFC]

Cattermole was highly touted at that time...

but yeh, his praise of players is ridiculous but their his players and I'd rather he big them up than shoot them down.

In fact, he's now been criticised for blaming the players...

There's a time and the place. He's only critisicing the players as it was the last place to hide. That's cowardly I feel. That may be a bit strong, but he's not a leader of men. A coach, a teacher, but not a top manager. But so bloody likeable the little bald scamp x

 

[AndyC]

I am willing to bet money on "he won't change a thing unless we get a horrific run of injuries and he HAS to", and we'll still play the exact same formation.

Doesn't matter who he gets mate, and I'm largely unarsed about his unsuccessful Wigan run (but won the cup before getting relegated, woopee). Fact is, he has no idea how to coach and organise a defence - we can get Costacurta and Nesta in their prime and they'd still look like they're new to the game. At this rate, he's getting himself sacked, so I'd rather he doesn't get time and money to get "his own" players in, just to get sacked and for the next manager to have to get his own players in and so on.

Knowing our luck, we'd probably end up with Costa Coffee and Netto

 

[bluestevon]

I have the opposite view...

To be successful with this style every player needs to be able to keep the ball and pass it to a team mate. The only players who are weak at passing are Jagielka, Coleman and McCarthy (Baines notably has gone downhill head also).

However McCarthys job is to pass it simply to keep the ball...hes no busquets but i doubt he gives the ball away and can pass to Barry or Stones/Mori to rebuild attacks.

If we keep the ball well and are able to play it from the back then we wont be giving the ball away so much and can plah a higher defensive line....NONE of the defenders other than Stones and Mori (possibly also Oviedo and Galloway) can keep the ball at a level which is needed = sitting too deep in defence.

As per the centre backs especially, Mori and Stones are "on paper" the best partnership. However Mori is adapting in his first season and Stones has gone through his first bad patch as a 21 year old....Jagielka is a good defender but doesnt fit the style of play. In your EDIT you mentioned Jags saving Mori....i also saw Mori save Jags 2ce against arsenal.

What Martinez needs to do in the summer is bring in HIS OWN players....he hasnt done too badly with his signings for the first eleven so far.

I think we need defenders who can defend but also who can pass the ball from the back....if we had a Marcel Desailly type (Kalidou Koulibaly'Napoli') then he would tick the boxes for me.....as would a pair of full backs who defend first and dont get caught out of position so much.

These crosses coming in should be stopped at source and were cut down when oviedo was in for baines....i wonder if coleman had competition from a more defensive right back if these crosses wouldnt also stop from the right.

Arsenal and Barca dont have pure defensive players who cant distribute effectively (Jagielka) nor do they have full backs caught out of position so much as they have been playing so long as attacking full backs which we dont really need anymore.

Lad your sounding mental, Baines is probably the best player we have in terms of passing and keeping the ball, can crticise him on some thigns but trying to make out that Mori, oviedo and Galloway are better on the ball just stinks of you having an agenda against him

 

[DrEFC]

They were both utter tosh.

Sorry but they were.

Showed nothing more than anybody else on the pitch. Though Jagielka did shout a lot in an attempt to organise.

Everyone was Tosh but I didn't think Mori or Stones were better than Jags. But we all see different things from the match.

 

[BlueToff]

Everyone was Tosh but I didn't think Mori or Stones were better than Jags. But we all see different things from the match.

Stones looked at least normal when he came on (bar that shaky mistake with the clearance). At least showed some drive to get us forward.

Barkley and Rom hid and Del was turd when he came on.

Ah well.

 

[eddy]

I think they would of all played better if they knew what they were supposed to be doing. Clear instructions from the manager stood in the technical area. Following a plan worked on during the week prior to the game, obviously lacking

 

[squonk]

still 488 tortured souls who haven't seen the light yet

open your eyes

 

[BlueToff]

I think they would of all played better if they knew what they were supposed to be doing. Clear instructions from the manager stood in the technical area. Following a plan worked on during the week prior to the game, obviously lacking

They definitely worked on a plan.

It was just completely wrong

 

[bluestevon]

Wth Baines and Coleman what else to tell them to do? Sit back and defend and pass forward etc....thats not their game...see the difference with Oviedo (to a point).

I honestly think he (and we) need to see martinez own players in there, he was after Sergi Roberto before and hes done an incredible job at RB from being a DM this season by all accounts...perhaps its a simple as needing his own players there who suit his system.

Hes done we everywhere else and with mori and galloway...now time for the defence.

he must be sick of all the defensive issues and surely will make changes now.

3 players that Martinez has signed have played at the back for us, Galloway - played well but had 2-3 games he got absolutely brutalised in and hung out to dry by the manager - most notably the stoke game, been banished back the udner 21's now - probably as his confidence must be on the floor, Mori - who makes 1-2 mistakes a game, frequently is out of position and has a habit of charging into cm leaving massive gaps - less said about his silky passing skills the better, Alcaraz - single handedly got us hammered in the derby and single handedly got us battered in Kiev - worst cb i have EVER seen at Everton.

Yeah i am super confident should martinez get his way and totally turn this defence into his own style, wigan mark 2 will be complete then

 

[DrEFC]

Stones looked at least normal when he came on (bar that shaky mistake with the clearance). At least showed some drive to get us forward.

Barkley and Rom hid and Del was turd when he came on.

Ah well.

Trying my best to blank it out. Absolute horror show of a game. Least in other games you could attempt to garner some positives.

 

[eddy]

Maybe senior players who realise that Martinez hasn't a clue what he is doing mate

agreed, or they may be dissapointed with the way Martinez has treated Distin and Piennarr