Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

Martinez in or out?

  • In

  • Out

  • Getting splinters eating cheese on toast on the fence

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davek said:
Spot on that. The landscape has dramatically changed. I still think the massive spenders like City, United and Chelsea will remain there or thereabouts, but the shake up for the European spots will intensify.
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DualityNSNO said:
The problem for me with that is that we're not even competing for the "more open" top 4/5 spots, and we don't even look able to most the time.

See the examples you gave - all of those teams (and Stoke) are now pushing and competing for said top spots, while we're the #entertainers sitting below 10th again. What does that say about us, considering everyone and their nan knows we have better players than most those teams?
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So you don't think in this open league environment we should be competing?

And since when is it a god-given fact that the time given to a manager is 5 years, or did you just make that up?
 
chazzle_dazzle said:
I mentioned this recently @The Esk, some managers have the knack of getting players to run through walls for them - the team look like they have very little fight in them at the moment, Saturday was a disgrace, but it wasn't the first time thats happened under Martinez.
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It wasn't the first time we've been that bad. Fair enough. I don't remember that many games we haven't dominated though. And in fact that's been the main stick people have beaten him with. Good performances not getting the results they deserve. Then we put in a poor performance and somehow it's typical. But the Chelsea game was clearly a one off?
There were plenty similar performances to last Saturday under Moyes. In fact I'd argue there were a lot more games on average per season when we looked lost and outclassed. Plenty more where we showed a more pragmatic approach that got us points against the odds too. Loads of ammunition already not to go searching for reasons every game. If any individual negative element in a game is indicative of a massive pattern and any good point is happening despite the manager, then it's a witchhunt. Same is true in reverse obviously.
 
davek said:
And that time is five seasons. Time should only be called sooner if the club is in danger. This isn't Man City or Chelsea...I think some people are running away with the idea that things have changed with Moshiri being here. Well, might I remind you that he's put nothing into this squad as yet.
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Not according to the man himself

From May 2014

“There is a feeling in the squad we are ready to get into the top-four places, which is very important,” said Martinez.

“At the beginning of this season, it is fair to say we didn’t know if we could compete for those places.

“Even though we have just missed out on the top four, there is a real feeling, if we work well and push ourselves, we can have a proper challenge for it next season.”
 
All well and good saying the landscape at the top of the league has changed and Top 4 is up for grabs.

When in reality we're scraping to finish in the Top 10
 

No other team in the league would have accepted even 2 years of underachievement, let alone 5. If you seriously think any manager deserves that long to get it somewhat close to being right then you don't live in the reality of the premier league, we're about as generous as giving managers time as it gets.
 
davek said:
And that time is five seasons. Time should only be called sooner if the club is in danger. This isn't Man City or Chelsea...I think some people are running away with the idea that things have changed with Moshiri being here. Well, might I remind you that he's put nothing into this squad as yet.
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Also as an added point, I'm not one of those said people there, as I couldn't care less if we still had Kenwright or not, I want Everton to win games, and they're not doing it with the supposed best squad.
 
oldblue said:
It wasn't the first time we've been that bad. Fair enough. I don't remember that many games we haven't dominated though. And in fact that's been the main stick people have beaten him with. Good performances not getting the results they deserve. Then we put in a poor performance and somehow it's typical. But the Chelsea game was clearly a one off?
There were plenty similar performances to last Saturday under Moyes. In fact I'd argue there were a lot more games on average per season when we looked lost and outclassed. Plenty more where we showed a more pragmatic approach that got us points against the odds too. Loads of ammunition already not to go searching for reasons every game. If any individual negative element in a game is indicative of a massive pattern and any good point is happening despite the manager, then it's a witchhunt. Same is true in reverse obviously.
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No i agree - i wouldn't say its been the norm and we are consistently looking like we haven't got an ounce of fight in us - Saturdays game just seemed, different. Coupled with player remarks and things you hear around the ground - true or not, make you think if the players are giving up on him a bit.

Not saying thats the case - but i just felt something was different with how bad we were Saturday.
 
davek said:
Bill Kenwright in 2014:

"In many commentators’ eyes, Roberto Martinez is the best young manager in Europe. We agree. He took on an unfamiliar challenge for most managers, to take something really good and make it even better. In his debut season he broke our Premier League record points haul, got us back into Europe and developed some of the most exciting young footballers in the game. He conducts himself off the pitch in the same way. He undertakes his business with great style, confidence, positivity and class. He is an Everton man."

Bill Kenwright 2 weeks ago:

"We have a great manager. He is an extraordinary man and extraordinary manager”

Spot the difference?

No, me neither.

Stand down lads. Get into single file and march back to the bunker.
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Hmmmmm difference now is Moshiri is at the helm.... just a matter of time ..
 

chazzle_dazzle said:
No i agree - i wouldn't say its been the norm and we are consistently looking like we haven't got an ounce of fight in us - Saturdays game just seemed, different. Coupled with player remarks and things you hear around the ground - true or not, make you think if the players are giving up on him a bit.

Not saying thats the case - but i just felt something was different with how bad we were Saturday.
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Maybe but there's plenty of other feasible explanations too. The most obvious one was a comedown from the quarter final. Sometimes though it only takes three or four key players and you look a totally different side.
 
davek said:
And that time is five seasons. Time should only be called sooner if the club is in danger. This isn't Man City or Chelsea...I think some people are running away with the idea that things have changed with Moshiri being here. Well, might I remind you that he's put nothing into this squad as yet.
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Five seasons, won't take him that long to get us relegated.

You don't think things have changed with Moshiri? So in other words you think there was no point in selling shares to him and we should of stayed as we were?

Of course things have changed, not just because of the sale but the TV money as well, the Premier League next season will be as far away from 3 or 4 years ago as what we are now from the first division days, and having to wait for highlights on midweak sports special after Ice Skating from Northampton and the speedway.
 

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