Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

Martinez in or out?

  • In

  • Out

  • Getting splinters eating cheese on toast on the fence

Results are only viewable after voting.
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Thomasc said:
The cups always have been and always will be a distraction away from the league. A chance for the minnows if you will to pit their wits against the big boys in the early rounds and see how they progress. Also a chance for the other sides in the top flight to get to Wembley, give their fans a day out and try and win a pot.

The league form always has for the top sides been the priority, this is indisputable IMO

All that is happening here in this debate, is the poster you have responded to is trying to derail from that either deliberately, or because he cannot see the woods for the trees, as it is all he has left in his locker due to the horse which he backed failing in all other areas of his points he puts across as the season has worn on.

Say for instance Martinez actually set out to have a go at the cups at the expense of league form, which I don't believe for one moment he did! That in itself is a very dangerous game to play if that was his strategy, as Wigan later went on to find out. A club who had established themselves in the PL until he rolled into town and promptly had them relegated.

He seemed like a worthy gamble at first as he had won a trophy and was as much of a candidate as any others at the time. Sadly it's all going sour, many saw it earlier than others on here and the ones that didn't see it and thought he deserved time are now making silly arguments and really making a mockery this thread with stubborn and childlike rants against the facts which have been put before them.

At Liverpool, spurs, or any other clubs we see ourselves in direct competition to normally, he would have been potted by now.
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Agree with the above. We have to be careful though as we are all blues at the end of the day
and after Martinez keeps driving this team downwards you will find that the out vote will grow
and we who spotted the limitations of Martinez last year, and said so, have to embrace the new `outers`....
and regroup behind a new manager hopefully, and behind the club
 
oldblue said:
Isn't it as much a question of whether sacking him right now would see an improvement.
I've not seen any fans denying his flaws. But I've yet to see a manager without them. Never been a question of a great manager or not but the right manager at that time for that situation.
I wouldn't have brought him in but I genuinely believe we are at a point where gambling by sacking him is more worrying for me than gambling by keeping him. Especially as one of those situations can be changed at any given point.
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A counter point to that surely is that you look at this season alone and teams outperforming us have made that decision and it has worked. An example of a club who doesn't make that decision is us, and 11 years resulted in nothing when we were happy to continue on, but this time it is a massive gamble on doing that, as the form is steadily getting worse. There is the chance it could all come together sure, but right now there is a greater chance surely of that gamble not working.
 
Ashtonian said:
A counter point to that surely is that you look at this season alone and teams outperforming us have made that decision and it has worked. An example of a club who doesn't make that decision is us, and 11 years resulted in nothing when we were happy to continue on, but this time it is a massive gamble on doing that, as the form is steadily getting worse. There is the chance it could all come together sure, but right now there is a greater chance surely of that gamble not working.
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It's a gamble either way. I just don't see irreparable damage being done either way to be honest. Unless we bring in someone who pampers to immediate demands and doesn't have a long term goal.
 

mkrudden said:
Total misrepresentation.

Let's say that we had brought in a manager of the same type of Moyes - defence first. Solid platform.

The 'Cult' would be not be in existence.

The reason 'we' believe there are mitigating circumstances for the league performance is because of the bigger picture, the mitigating circumstances. There is no point repeating them because they have been presented numerous times.

Give the manager cash (both in terms of transfer fees and wage structure) and then his performance can be analysed fairly. Once we get to that point, and league standings are consistently still 'meh' then the Cult will disband faster than an Everton counter-attack.
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As long as no one suggests that those who are fed up of Martinez don't want us to win the FA Cup (bar that one individual who would rather win the Derby! !)
 
Thomasc said:
The cups always have been and always will be a distraction away from the league. A chance for the minnows if you will to pit their wits against the big boys in the early rounds and see how they progress. Also a chance for the other sides in the top flight to get to Wembley, give their fans a day out and try and win a pot.

The league form always has for the top sides been the priority, this is indisputable IMO

All that is happening here in this debate, is the poster you have responded to is trying to derail from that either deliberately, or because he cannot see the woods for the trees, as it is all he has left in his locker due to the horse which he backed failing in all other areas of his points he puts across as the season has worn on.

Say for instance Martinez actually set out to have a go at the cups at the expense of league form, which I don't believe for one moment he did! That in itself is a very dangerous game to play if that was his strategy, as Wigan later went on to find out. A club who had established themselves in the PL until he rolled into town and promptly had them relegated.

He seemed like a worthy gamble at first as he had won a trophy and was as much of a candidate as any others at the time. Sadly it's all going sour, many saw it earlier than others on here and the ones that didn't see it and thought he deserved time are now making silly arguments and really making a mockery this thread with stubborn and childlike rants against the facts which have been put before them.

At Liverpool, spurs, or any other clubs we see ourselves in direct competition to normally, he would have been potted by now.
Click to expand...
Spot on,

More worryingly is that spurs Liverpool etc did used to be our rivals in the league. Now it is west brom stoke, palace, swansea.

Go back 3 years and west brom who are above us for example had not far under 40 points less than us. Palace just under 30, Stoke 22 and Swansea 30.

That was the gap between us and them, now potentially all but palace could be above us in 2 weeks.....
 

oldblue said:
It's a gamble either way. I just don't see irreparable damage being done either way to be honest. Unless we bring in someone who pampers to immediate demands and doesn't have a long term goal.
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not necesserally true. when moyes left he left a aging squad and yet martinez benefitted from stones / barkely among the first team players. A new manager could well turn this mid table team into a winning one just by sureing up the defence.

the best example of replacing a manager in the league currently is Koeman for sure. Poch leaving them could have relegated them, yet he has survived selling his first team off for 2 years to keep them performing. Imagine what koeman could have achieved with the original squad before additions?
 
Ashtonian said:
Spot on,

More worryingly is that spurs Liverpool etc did used to be our rivals in the league. Now it is west brom stoke, palace, swansea.

Go back 3 years and west brom who are above us for example had not far under 40 points less than us. Palace just under 30, Stoke 22 and Swansea 30.

That was the gap between us and them, now potentially all but palace could be above us in 2 weeks.....
Click to expand...
But we are going to Wembley mate don't forget ,as if we could,would laugh if it wasn't so pitiful.
 
Eric Djemba-Djemba said:
Restraint is for the weak. Hit me hard.
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brokeback_mountain_ver3.jpg
 
The year wigan went down, after they lost at arsenal to conform the relegation martinez said in his post match interview.... 'we are all still gutted, no one saw this coming' when clearly all year they were crap yet he couldn't see that coming??? I know he's positive but there is just plain blind, or could you class it as arrogance? Either way he needs to see what's going on on the pitch rather than in his head. If we play crap he needs to say it, he will at least gain more respect
 

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