Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[hktoffee]

He wouldn't have bought Lukaku cause he couldn't hold the ball up. Yes he was OK in the transfer market I won't argue with that. Pointless comparing the two anyway as its not about that.

Moyes was not ok he was great. He did wonder given he had literally no money to spend.

 

[Little Ralphy]

He wouldn't have bought Lukaku cause he couldn't hold the ball up. Yes he was OK in the transfer market I won't argue with that. Pointless comparing the two anyway as its not about that.

Neither could Andy Johnson..

 

[stdomingo1878]

Comparisons between Martinez and Ferguson/Kendall are disgraceful. By that logic Mike Walker deserved more time. Ferguson had been a multiple trophy winner and Kendall had showed his ability at Blackburn and also showed he could learn from initial errors. His success was built on great recruitment and great team spirit, a team knowing exactly what they were doing who could dominate physically or with their football. Both managers put winning above anything and both had a picture in their mind of how to do it. Yes they might have taken a bit of time but they knew what it took and were ruthless when they needed to be.

Martinez is none of these things. He seems to have changed his 'philosophy' so many times that no one knows how we're supposed to play, three different seasons have thrown out three different ways of playing. He does not value winning above all else, and does not even value defensive solidity, for him it's not about consistency but an ideological road trip. He has also shown himself to be weak, inconsistent and unfair with selection, and at times a pathological liar who has an annoying trait of blaming everyone and everything before himself. If ever questioned, him and his squad refuse to accept fair criticism and have gone as far to blame the fans.

So please can someone point out any genuine parallels between Martinez and two of Britain's greatest ever managers before throwing about this lazy comparison to have a go at concerned fans.

Absolutely spot on. Great managers learn from their mistakes. Martinez is simply too arrogant to do so - he lost me when he blamed the crowd. His defensive shortcomings have been the same throughout his whole career - that's how Wigan got relegated. How can anyone think he could sort that aspect out even if he showed signs of actually wanting to?

 

[PeterEFC]

Moyes was not ok he was great. He did wonder given he had literally no money to spend.

Arteta, Cahill , Martyn, lescott. That's all I can think off at moment but what buys they was!! I will bet my life on it we will never ever finish top 4 with someone who took Wigan down, and also brought the striker, defender and goalkeeper. Not forgetting cleverley and McCarthy

 

[Prevenger17]

It will actually be three years at the end of this season, Prev.

Aye, but I'm speaking only in the timeframe where his results could be called into question.

 

[nsno-chris]

Arteta, Cahill , Martyn, lescott. That's all I can think off at moment but what buys they was!! I will bet my life on it we will never ever finish top 4 with someone who took Wigan down, and also brought the striker, defender and goalkeeper. Not forgetting cleverley and McCarthy

Coleman, pienaar, stones, felliani, yakubu (for that 1 season), baines, jags. With the money he had he bought some really good players. He had them playing for the team and him, he just couldn't pick a striker (bar the yak)

 

[Dymak]

I can't stand this insistent delusion that we are the poorest club in the country, especially when every other club in the Premier League is having a party due to how stinking rich they are. Everton have never, ever, been as cash rich as they are right now, and we are due to get even more stinking rich in the future.

The idea that we 'cannot afford to sack Martinez' is BS, pure BS. As is the idea that we could not afford a top manager. Moyes was being paid 4 million POUND per year at a time when money actually was tight and we were making annual losses. We could offer double what Moyes was paid these days if we wanted to. Honestly, people accuse the players of having a weak, loser mentality, and yet it is endemic right throughout our fan base. Please stop acting like we are Bolton Wanderers.

With the money at our disposal, we should be headhunting the very best managers, and we should not be settling for a bottom half manager like Martinez.

 

[nsno-chris]

I can't stand this insistent delusion that we are the poorest club in the country, especially when every other club in the Premier League is having a party due to how stinking rich they are. Everton have never, ever, been as cash rich as they are right now, and we are due to get even more stinking rich in the future.

The idea that we 'cannot afford to sack Martinez' is BS, pure BS. As is the idea that we could not afford a top manager. Moyes was being paid 4 million POUND per year at a time when money actually was tight and we were making annual losses. We could offer double what Moyes was paid these days if we wanted to. Honestly, people accuse the players of having a weak, loser mentality, and yet it is endemic right throughout our fan base. Please stop acting like we are Bolton Wanderers.

With the money at our disposal, we should be headhunting the very best managers, and we should not be settling for a bottom half manager like Martinez.

Excellent post

 

[DrEFC]

Arteta, Cahill , Martyn, lescott. That's all I can think off at moment but what buys they was!! I will bet my life on it we will never ever finish top 4 with someone who took Wigan down, and also brought the striker, defender and goalkeeper. Not forgetting cleverley and McCarthy

Jagielka, Stones, Mirallas. Would kill for a young Martyn and Arteta now.

 

[Allezfan]

I can't stand this insistent delusion that we are the poorest club in the country, especially when every other club in the Premier League is having a party due to how stinking rich they are. Everton have never, ever, been as cash rich as they are right now, and we are due to get even more stinking rich in the future.

The idea that we 'cannot afford to sack Martinez' is BS, pure BS. As is the idea that we could not afford a top manager. Moyes was being paid 4 million POUND per year at a time when money actually was tight and we were making annual losses. We could offer double what Moyes was paid these days if we wanted to. Honestly, people accuse the players of having a weak, loser mentality, and yet it is endemic right throughout our fan base. Please stop acting like we are Bolton Wanderers.

With the money at our disposal, we should be headhunting the very best managers, and we should not be settling for a bottom half manager like Martinez.

Spot on, we are one of the 20 richest clubs in the world. There are very few non english clubs that can match the wages and trnasfer fees that we can pay, very few.

If you are a manager there is maybe 12 clubs worldwide that are more attractive than everton but not any more than that. We could get anyone bar jose and pep.

 

[Prevenger17]

On the cusp of something great when we've actually slipped from where he took over from

3 league wins at home all season
157 goals conceded since he arrived
No fight on the park
A willingness not to accept defence is important
20+ goals concedes at home this season alone
18 wins out of 61 in the league since start of last season
Mind boggling post match interviews refusing to accept problems
Blaming fans on 2 separate occasion in 2 separate seasons due to his failure
An unwillingness to bench certain underperforming players

It's close lads, so so so close

It sure is. Even his detractors can admit that he has improved our personnel and playing style markedly over the course of his tenure. The only thing that can be reasonably levelled at him, and it's a fairly outstanding complaint, is that he hasn't been able to stamp the sort of character that grinds out results on a consistent basis. If he gets the boot, it will be for that and that alone, in every other respect he has improved EFC significantly.

 

[RFUS]

I can't stand this insistent delusion that we are the poorest club in the country, especially when every other club in the Premier League is having a party due to how stinking rich they are. Everton have never, ever, been as cash rich as they are right now, and we are due to get even more stinking rich in the future.

The idea that we 'cannot afford to sack Martinez' is BS, pure BS. As is the idea that we could not afford a top manager. Moyes was being paid 4 million POUND per year at a time when money actually was tight and we were making annual losses. We could offer double what Moyes was paid these days if we wanted to. Honestly, people accuse the players of having a weak, loser mentality, and yet it is endemic right throughout our fan base. Please stop acting like we are Bolton Wanderers.

With the money at our disposal, we should be headhunting the very best managers, and we should not be settling for a bottom half manager like Martinez.

Good point. Moyes was always one of the highest paid managers in the league. In fact, Martinez was on a lot less than Moyes. In his first season at least. If there's one person you should pay the big bucks for it's the manager.

 

[Khalekan]

Aye, but I'm speaking only in the timeframe where his results could be called into question.

Oh....right.....

 

[Saint Domingo]

Moyes was not ok he was great. He did wonder given he had literally no money to spend.

Martinez is really putting into context what Moyes did. Best of the rest used to be sneered at when the top 4 was almost impregnable (although Moyes did crack it once). If we got 5th now Davek would be proclaiming the second coming and that's with the league wide open.

No one has done a similar job in the prem (take a relegation threatened side and entrench them in the top 7 on a negative net spend selling your best players each year). Hughes is being lauded for effectively taking Stoke from lower midtable to midtable. O'Neill used to get praised to the hilt for that Villa side that routinely finished behind Moyes' Everton. Pardew has one fifth placed finish at Newcastle and dined out on it for years. Outside of the mega managers at mega clubs (and seemingly Ranieri this season) none come close to the job Moyes did here despite having a lot more money and resources to attempt it.

 

[Prevenger17]

The reason we're snatching defeat from the jaws of victory so often is down to the poor defensive organisation of the team as a whole and gung ho game management.

I don't entirely agree. It's weird, we defend really well up to a point. But when we score we fall apart like wet bread, give people acres in midfield and make heinous errors. It's mentality rather than organisation imo, and I certainly believe Roberto can shoulder a share of that blame.