Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[bluewally]

It sure is. Even his detractors can admit that he has improved our personnel and playing style markedly over the course of his tenure. The only thing that can be reasonably levelled at him, and it's a fairly outstanding complaint, is that he hasn't been able to stamp the sort of character that grinds out results on a consistent basis. If he gets the boot, it will be for that and that alone, in every other respect he has improved EFC significantly.

I've said it before, he'd make a great director of football, great ideas for the club, good eye for players, the media like him. If Everton went down that route he'd be great but on the pitch his teams seem to lack tactics, cohesiveness, defensive ability and in some cases basic fitness.

 

[Allezfan]

Good point. Moyes was always one of the highest paid managers in the league. In fact, Martinez was on a lot less than Moyes. In his first season at least. If there's one person you should pay the big bucks for it's the manager.

He was one of the highest paid managers in europe. He was only about the 7th best paid in the league because the prem is daft. Redknapp at qpr was on the same.

But I've always thought that we're a bigger draw to anyone not managing in england then we allow ourselevs to believe.

 

[Allezfan]

Martinez is the 14th best paid manager in the world according to this.

1 Pep Guardiola Bayern Munich £14.8m
2 Jose Mourinho Chelsea £10.5m
3 Arsene Wenger Arsenal £8.30m
4 Louis Van Gaal Manchester United £7.3m
5 Jurgen Klopp Liverpool £7m
6 Jose Enrique FC Barcelona £7m
7 Rafael Benitez Real Madrid £5.60m
8 Roberto Mancini Inter Milan £4.30m
9 Antonio Conte Italy £3.95m
10 Manuel Pellegrini Manchester City £4.2m
11 Massimiliano Allegri Juventus £3.50m
12 Laurent Blanc PSG £3.45m
13 Jorge Jesus Benfica £3.34m
14 Roberto Martinez Everton £3m
15 Slaven Bilic West Ham United £2.95m
16 Roy Hodgson England £2.95m
17 Joachim Low Germany £2.80m
18 Dunga Brazil £2.50m
19 Ronald Koeman Southampton FC £2.30m

6th best in the league. Is he doing the 6th best job in the league?

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

Martinez is the 14th best paid manager in the world according to this.

1 Pep Guardiola Bayern Munich £14.8m
2 Jose Mourinho Chelsea £10.5m
3 Arsene Wenger Arsenal £8.30m
4 Louis Van Gaal Manchester United £7.3m
5 Jurgen Klopp Liverpool £7m
6 Jose Enrique FC Barcelona £7m
7 Rafael Benitez Real Madrid £5.60m
8 Roberto Mancini Inter Milan £4.30m
9 Antonio Conte Italy £3.95m
10 Manuel Pellegrini Manchester City £4.2m
11 Massimiliano Allegri Juventus £3.50m
12 Laurent Blanc PSG £3.45m
13 Jorge Jesus Benfica £3.34m
14 Roberto Martinez Everton £3m
15 Slaven Bilic West Ham United £2.95m
16 Roy Hodgson England £2.95m
17 Joachim Low Germany £2.80m
18 Dunga Brazil £2.50m
19 Ronald Koeman Southampton FC £2.30m

6th best in the league. Is he doing the 6th best job in the league?

ooooooof I would love to see someone argue the point that he is!!!! that would be borderline delusional!!

The worst thing is we used to pay Moyes more - barring the top 5 we could pay a manager more then we are, if he does go and its a big if - i don't want to go down the route of an up and comer. been there done that - pay the money for someone we should be able to attract.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

I don't entirely agree. It's weird, we defend really well up to a point. But when we score we fall apart like wet bread, give people acres in midfield and make heinous errors. It's mentality rather than organisation imo, and I certainly believe Roberto can shoulder a share of that blame.

Don't agree mate.

Defensively solidity is built on the training ground. Drills and repetition, day after day after day....

We've shipped goals at 0-0, when winning, when losing, 1st minute to the 98th minute, there's no real pattern, we're just gash defensively. Howard has played a major part in that, but the rest is down to the complete lack of focus on defensive drills combined with the midfield / attack not being tasked with closing down the opposition with pace and purpose.

If you allow the opposition to come on to you then they're going to create opportunities to score........

 

[nsno-chris]

It sure is. Even his detractors can admit that he has improved our personnel and playing style markedly over the course of his tenure. The only thing that can be reasonably levelled at him, and it's a fairly outstanding complaint, is that he hasn't been able to stamp the sort of character that grinds out results on a consistent basis. If he gets the boot, it will be for that and that alone, in every other respect he has improved EFC significantly.

Haha you can't even see the irony. With all these improvements he's made we're slipping further down the table; how does that work

Look we've got boss players and play ace togger, but we've still only won 3 games at home all season.

Yaaay all hail martinez. As I said before, plaudits don't get you points

 

[Dymak]

The idea that Martinez eclipses Moyes when it comes to player recruitment is also BS. The truth is that bothof them have done well in this regard, and part of this reason is because they have been the manager at EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB.

Yakubu, Arteta, Fellaini, Baines, Jagielka, Mirallas, Stones, Coleman, Cahill and Lescott were all brought in by Moyes. Our first choice back five are still all Moyes players. Moyes brought through Rodwell and Rooney as young teenagers and then flogged them for big money when the time was right, so I don't believe he stifled youth either, as he is often accused of doing.

Anyway, it's time everyone, including myself, stopped with the Moyes and Martinez comparisons. Neither of them are what Everton need right now. We need a top, top manager.

 

[CahillsCornerFlag]

I can't stand this insistent delusion that we are the poorest club in the country, especially when every other club in the Premier League is having a party due to how stinking rich they are. Everton have never, ever, been as cash rich as they are right now, and we are due to get even more stinking rich in the future.

The idea that we 'cannot afford to sack Martinez' is BS, pure BS. As is the idea that we could not afford a top manager. Moyes was being paid 4 million POUND per year at a time when money actually was tight and we were making annual losses. We could offer double what Moyes was paid these days if we wanted to. Honestly, people accuse the players of having a weak, loser mentality, and yet it is endemic right throughout our fan base. Please stop acting like we are Bolton Wanderers.

With the money at our disposal, we should be headhunting the very best managers, and we should not be settling for a bottom half manager like Martinez.

Top post. Money talks and we pay our managers top dollar. Neither of the last 2 particularly deserved it either. If we do indeed get taken over, ive no doubt they'll be infinitely more ambitious and less sentimental than Bill.

 

[4737carlin]

Martinez is really putting into context what Moyes did. Best of the rest used to be sneered at when the top 4 was almost impregnable (although Moyes did crack it once). If we got 5th now Davek would be proclaiming the second coming and that's with the league wide open.

No one has done a similar job in the prem (take a relegation threatened side and entrench them in the top 7 on a negative net spend selling your best players each year). Hughes is being lauded for effectively taking Stoke from lower midtable to midtable. O'Neill used to get praised to the hilt for that Villa side that routinely finished behind Moyes' Everton. Pardew has one fifth placed finish at Newcastle and dined out on it for years. Outside of the mega managers at mega clubs (and seemingly Ranieri this season) none come close to the job Moyes did here despite having a lot more money and resources to attempt it.

True this, i was made up when he went, for years i was hoping he would be off, classic case of careful what you wish for. Martinez seemed great at first, for me that away win at Swansea was when i really started to think we have hit on something good, some people even joked United went for the wrong guy, then when we won at Old Trafford it was fantastic.... then reality set it.

We had to put up with Moyes because back then we had financial constraints, now we don't.

 

[smileychap]

The idea that Martinez eclipses Moyes when it comes to player recruitment is also BS. The truth is that bothof them have done well in this regard, and part of this reason is because they have been the manager at EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB.

Yakubu, Arteta, Fellaini, Baines, Jagielka, Mirallas, Stones, Coleman, Cahill and Lescott were all brought in by Moyes. Our first choice back five are still all Moyes players. Moyes brought through Rodwell and Rooney as young teenagers and then flogged them for big money when the time was right, so I don't believe he stifled youth either, as he is often accused of doing.

Anyway, it's time everyone, including myself, stopped with the Moyes and Martinez comparisons. Neither of them are what Everton need right now. We need a top, top manager.

Very good post that.

So who are we after? Koeman? The fella at Bournemouth. I'd prefer a Brit if I'm honest and ideally an ex-Evertonian. Unsworth?

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

Very good post that.

So who are we after? Koeman? The fella at Bournemouth. I'd prefer a Brit if I'm honest and ideally an ex-Evertonian. Unsworth?

I like Eddie Howe, nice fella - but there is nothing to suggest he is the top manager we need. We have done up and coming managers and its been great, but now we need to look at a top manager (obviously this is all a big IF martinez goes or is sacked).

I can't even think of who at the moment my head is battered - but one thing is for sure we shouldn't be afraid of going for a top class manager and paying him the money to come.

 

[willo30]

Moyes out of 10
Defending = 8
Attacking = 4

Martinez out of 10
Defending = 4
Attacking = 8

Now what would be great is a combination of the 2 which was possibly proved in his first season where it was said it was still a Moyes defence but with the Martinez attacking style added which got us 72 points.

Not saying get Moyes but we need someone with the same mentality for defending to be put in as his number 2. He should be put under pressure to shake up his backroom staff as the current one isn't working.

 

[Dymak]

Very good post that.

So who are we after? Koeman? The fella at Bournemouth. I'd prefer a Brit if I'm honest and ideally an ex-Evertonian. Unsworth?

Unsworth? lol Come on, mate. I think we should be looking at a top manager, someone like Emery who is out of contract in the summer.

 

[smileychap]

110 goals conceded since the start of last season.

Its awful.

It relegated Wigan, it will cost him his job here.

Yeah - I hope so.

The Martinez 'cup or nothing' gamble has failed - let's move on with the what winnings there are in the squad.

Coz interestingly, his transfer record (thanks to Lukaku) is not all that bad. Alcaraz and Kone stand out as a waste of money, the latter owing to a nasty injury. Del and Barry are solid, Fumes Mori could be. Clev on a free has potenital ( I'mled to believe) and we made cash on Naismith (albeit I liked him). Osman, Pienaar and Gibson about to shortly make way to free squad places. Galloway coming through nicely with Garbutt etc.

The makings of a decent squad on paper which I think a number of top managers would fancy with or without Lukaku.

 

[Mrk]

There's no way he'll get fired midseason, so hopefully he'll get the boot in the summer and we can get in a real manager.