Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[Saint Domingo]

You're the melt mate! You wouldn't know the truth about Everton if it slapped you in the face!

On the point about Stones, Martinez, and Moyes. Ask yourself why Moyes got him and Martinez didn't. It wasn't necessarily because Moyes was better at attracting good players than Martinez (although his record suggests he was), it's because he was offering him the chance to join EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB! Which still has a massive pull, and absolutely obliterates the likes of Wigan if a player is faced with choosing one of the two teams.

Absolutely right. A change in manager would not decrease Everton's appeal to the sort of players we want to attract. Wages, playing time, and exposure to European football are three factors far more important than who the manager is.

Lukaku did not come to us because Martinez was a better manager than Steve Clarke at West Brom. He came on loan because Everton were the biggest club offering him guaranteed regular football. I'm certain that if a bigger European CL club had guaranteed this also he would have been off there instead regardless of who our manager was. At the time his talent didn't merit that sort of interest, now it does and I expect we will see any powers Martinez supposedly has being redundant in keeping him.

 

[nsno-chris]

Yeah...both finding their way early on...guess you don't have the stomach (something rarely said round here) for it.

You talk absolute guff, I mean we're you even supporting Everton when moyes took over??? Because to use the comparison of "they're finding their way" is ridiculous.

1. Moyes inherited a truly awful team (you probably don't know this). It was filled with the deadwood of the premier league
2. Moyes had never managed in top flight in his career and was thrust into one of the biggest clubs in england
3. He was lucky to get £10m a summer, for Christ sake his man leading the line was journeyman called Marcus bent
4.he dragged a team that was bottom half finishes for 4 years and potential relegation candidates to a team fighting for Europe each year on a shoestring. Cahill arteta pienaar all for a combined total of around £7m, he brought in 3 future England defenders for a total of around £14m

There is no comparison, martinez had experience of the premier league and is STILL MAKING the same mistakes year after year, bar one. He dismantled a team with a proud home record, a team that would fight, he's on course to give us our worst home record EVER. The football on offer, for the majority of the time, is dull and boring but hidden behind this ideology of beautiful football.

This season has been partiality saved by one man, a man who has now told us that he'd like to play at the top level, disproving the belief that "5th (and actually showing some challenge for the top spots) is the same as 15th".

He us up there with mike walker as one of the worst managers, and delivering the F.A. Cup should be no way a consolation to give him another season. Deliver and then sling ye'hook

 

[balggy]

You're the melt mate! You wouldn't know the truth about Everton if it slapped you in the face!

On the point about Stones, Martinez, and Moyes. Ask yourself why Moyes got him and Martinez didn't. It wasn't necessarily because Moyes was better at attracting good players than Martinez (although his record suggests he was), it's because he was offering him the chance to join EVERTON FOOTBALL CLUB! Which still has a massive pull, and absolutely obliterates the likes of Wigan if a player is faced with choosing one of the two teams.

You are spot on with the point that Moyes got him.

In addition to Everton being the biggest draw, he may have looked at both Moyes's and Martniez's defensive credentials and come to the conclusion that he would rather train and learn under one of the best defensive managers in the league rather than one who gets tonked 9-0 at Spurs.

 

[Groucho]

I wish Evertonians acceded to evidence presented them.

Roberto Martinez is a sham.

Instead, too many hang onto the coat-tails of the 'twice right a day' broken clock that the strangely avatared citrus headed da-Vek presents them


I nowaday read little of his WUM stompings

da-Vek's painted himself into an unabashedly parochial, kopite-like 'I'm right... you're wrong' corner and in incendiary fury, stamps his furious feet at any argument that dares threaten his regard...


...he's the Rumpelstiltskin of GOT

I lend da-Vek zero currency

Outside of the dyed in the wool cultists herein this forum, I suggest others exercise similar bureau de change

We have asked many times now for things not to be made personal. You have clearly ignored these many requests. Threadban I'm afraid.

 

[bluewally]

Keep telling yourself fairy stories mate.

The scores on the doors are as follows:

We have a manager supported by his chairman
The chairman is making the decisions
The manager is proven in the PL and the transfer market
The club are within touching distance of ending a 21 year trophy drought


Beyond the world of football forum fever, no one is arsed about the stuff you're preoccupied with.

All is good.

Proven in the PL. Good one lollol

 

[balggy]

Keep telling yourself fairy stories mate.

The scores on the doors are as follows:

We have a manager supported by his chairman
The chairman is making the decisions
The manager is proven in the PL and the transfer market
The club are within touching distance of ending a 21 year trophy drought


Beyond the world of football forum fever, no one is arsed about the stuff you're preoccupied with.

All is good.

You could easily state the alternative:

• He has lost the fan base
• The media are turning on him, even the Echo are getting critical
• We are on course to finish bottom half, for the second season on the bounce - something we haven't done in 14 years.
• We are on course for our worst home record ever
• With the exception of Troyes, we have the worst home defensive record in Europe
• Moshiri hasn't publicly backed him. The only time he mentioned him was "good luck to Roberto and the boys" before the Chelsea match .
• Our goal machine striker (who without his goals we would be in a relegation fight) has affectively said that he wants off in the summer
• In 7 premier league seasons, he has finished bottom half in six of them.
• It could get so much worse

 

[FisherEFC]

You talk absolute guff, I mean we're you even supporting Everton when moyes took over??? Because to use the comparison of "they're finding their way" is ridiculous.

1. Moyes inherited a truly awful team (you probably don't know this). It was filled with the deadwood of the premier league
2. Moyes had never managed in top flight in his career and was thrust into one of the biggest clubs in england
3. He was lucky to get £10m a summer, for Christ sake his man leading the line was journeyman called Marcus bent
4.he dragged a team that was bottom half finishes for 4 years and potential relegation candidates to a team fighting for Europe each year on a shoestring. Cahill arteta pienaar all for a combined total of around £7m, he brought in 3 future England defenders for a total of around £14m

There is no comparison, martinez had experience of the premier league and is STILL MAKING the same mistakes year after year, bar one. He dismantled a team with a proud home record, a team that would fight, he's on course to give us our worst home record EVER. The football on offer, for the majority of the time, is dull and boring but hidden behind this ideology of beautiful football.

This season has been partiality saved by one man, a man who has now told us that he'd like to play at the top level, disproving the belief that "5th (and actually showing some challenge for the top spots) is the same as 15th".

He us up there with mike walker as one of the worst managers, and delivering the F.A. Cup should be no way a consolation to give him another season. Deliver and then sling ye'hook

Spot on and I would say the FA Cup is vital now for Europe. If we don't get EL football next season we can kiss goodbye to replacing Rom with an even half decent striker. Unbelievable the position we are in thanks to the clown of a manager we have.

 

[Saint Domingo]

The rank averageness of this team and particularly the midfield will be apparent as soon as Lukaku leaves. I hope Roberto has a realistic creative midfielder targeted and the goals are spread around the team more. We cannot afford another summer of dithering on the purchase of a top keeper and a creative midfielder. These should have been the priorities in the last 4 or so windows. I fear however that the Lukaku and Stones sagas will see us scramble to replace like for like and again overlook the key signings we need.

 

[Blue Cheese]

Why all the Moyes talk, totally irrelevant in my opinion, he has long gone. Martinez failures have nought to do with Moyes.

 

[Blue Cheese]

The rank averageness of this team and particularly the midfield will be apparent as soon as Lukaku leaves. I hope Roberto has a realistic creative midfielder targeted and the goals are spread around the team more. We cannot afford another summer of dithering on the purchase of a top keeper and a creative midfielder. These should have been the priorities in the last 4 or so windows. I fear however that the Lukaku and Stones sagas will see us scramble to replace like for like and again overlook the key signings we need.

Hopefully, having money on the board means we get our preferred targets early, wait and see I guess

 

[oldblue]

I guess there is not really much point in this debate now until after the semi final. If he wins the cup he will get a reprieve, unless we lose every league game and drop like a stone. Looks to me though that even if we lose our next 4 league games there would still be some here defending him and not considering the league form at all due to agendas.

Also gonna be loads still slating him even if he goes unbeaten. Think all these ultimatums without context at the moment are a bit meaningless.
I asked a few months ago, when people were asking for defensive improvement and giving ultimatums, how many games would we have to show improvement in before overlooking a one off performance. And judging by the reaction to the West Ham game I'd say many weren't looking for overall signs of improvement and actually had seen enough. Which is a fair enough position, but not one that's monitoring the situation with context.
So I'm sure there are people who are immovable on both sides barring something extraordinary. I can't see it really adds any weight to the actual debate about him staying or not.

 

[i started duncan chant]

Results count. Can't always be the best due to resources so doing the best with what you have got is the measure. Bobby is therefore a massive failure. Finding it hard to get excited by a Wembley trip as this clown has made match days an effort. I will celebrate his departure when it finally happens. Two more years and we will be facing relegation battles should he remain in charge. Utter clown. Everybody loves coming to Goodison..........funny how the fine margins never go in our favour. Last person I disliked this much was Pistone as he was totally gutless and this clown has now managed to produce a team that is gutless.

 

[oldblue]

.funny how the fine margins never go in our favour.

It is isn't it. But it can happen and I think it's fair enough you've acknowledged it. How many points do you reckon the fine margins have cost us? Do you think Martinez is automatically responsible for all of them, poor decisions say or missed pens.

 

[Saint Domingo]

Hopefully, having money on the board means we get our preferred targets early, wait and see I guess

They've got to be the right ones though. I was disappointed with the summer transfer window and roundly mocked for my insistence that Martinez had brought in the wrong players even if they had been good ones.

Quite simply we did not really need Cleverley. When everyone is fit he ineffectively struggles on the left wing. We also did not need both of Lennon and Deulofeu. I rate both players but in most games this season two of Mirallas Lennon and Del sit on the bench.

The priorities last summer were clear. A keeper, a centreback, a creative midfielder and an effective backup striker. Martinez delivered one of these (Funes Mori). Rodriguez has offered nothing to the first team and cannot be thought of as a backup to Rom. I'm sure Niasse will be, but he was a window too late and not fit.

Martinez cannot afford another window of an incoherent transfer policy.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

It is isn't it. But it can happens and I think it's fair enough you've acknowledged it. How many points do you reckon the fine margins have cost us? Do you think Martinez is automatically responsible for all of them, poor decisions say or missed pens.

Yes, I most certainly do. Especially in games when we've been two goals to the good. No excuses for it happening THREE times in one season and us losing seven points.....And that's just those three games alone - fool me once & all that, but THREE times??

And I haven't mentioned the CC semi when we had a 2.1 advantage that went out the window.

The buck stops with martinez.