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Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

Martinez in or out?

  • In

  • Out

  • Getting splinters eating cheese on toast on the fence

Results are only viewable after voting.
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davek said:
Spot on mate. He's being held to account under conditions that his predecessors never were; at least give him the cash that would justifiably make judging him by a different criteria the correct call.
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Are you saying where we are at is par for the course?
 
bluewally said:
He's had enough cash
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He's had as much as those around him. No more than that. Want to judge him more critically and sack him? Give him amounts that suggest he cant operate under conditions in 'the New Era' of Everton, not a second before.

That's just appropriate and logical.
 
davek said:
He's just another voice.

If I take to twitter and hand you and thousands of "followers" my view, does that make me a sage too?
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I wouldn't just dismiss you if 20+ thousand people followed you because they liked your content. Especially if you only followed about 200 in return.
 
oldblue said:
Depends where you are as to how worrying this is. If you're on your phone staring out to sea then nothing on the horizon is a shocking state of affairs.
Or put a less facetious way, how the hell do people conjur up these doom laden prophecies.
Surely the main appeal to your average football fan has always been the randomness of it all. How things can turn around. How much confidence, spontaneity and chance play a part.
I think part of the reason I've shifted over to actually stand by Martinez for now is this constant barrage of formulations designed to prove something that's completely unprovable. And thank god for that.
Thank god for Leicester just clicking for no calculable reason. Thank god for the magic. Thank you for the music etc..
FA cup semi coming up kids. Who fancies it?
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And the point of your outburst?
 

davek said:
He's had as much as those around him. No more than that. Want to judge him more critically and sack him? Give him amounts that suggest he cant operate under conditions in 'the New Era' of Everton, not a second before.

That's just appropriate and logical.
Click to expand...
Mate, with all respect if your approach was logical, surely more people would agree? Sort of 50/50 or even 60/40.
 
davek said:
Spot on mate. He's being held to account under conditions that his predecessors never were; at least give him the cash that would justifiably make judging him by a different criteria the correct call.
Click to expand...

I do say that we need to see the back of this tendency to ship soft goals.

That will change my judgement on him. This is what the manager needs to address as a high priority.

If certain players are not onboard they need to be shipped out.

Simple as that.

If I were Martinez I would be looking to address why we are shipping soft goals. Part of this was the combination of John 'take too many risks' Stones and Tim 'inconsistent' Howard.

This can be easily addressed.

The other is to look at what happened against Arsenal.


Mo "giving the ball away" Besic and inviting pressure and you saw McCarthy having a go at him. We need to get a central midfielder who can play through balls and play with the ball.

We also need more pace out wide. Without Mirallas and/or a fit Geri we look weak.

I would also look at the GK position for obvious reasons. We need another top quality keeper.


I will judge this manager at Christmas after the FA Cup and the summer and if he has learnt from this years mistakes. Particularly if we ship stupid goals then things will in my view need to change. Not before.

Martinez is still fairly young managerially speaking. He's not managed at Everton's level before. So I do not expect instant results if things go badly.

This summer he really needs to get into the issues.
 
davek said:
"Competitive decline" - from what to what? From being a success to being a failure? I must have missed that spectacular decline, because I was under the impression that Moyes achieved precisely sweet f.a. while he was here. We did nothing of consequence in his 11 years.

...and...

"Competitive decline" - from PL seasons where we never troubled 70 points whatsoever in donkeys years to one where we surpassed that mark - which any manager we have will have to match and shift further on to get a CL spot? Or a decline from winning cups to not winning cups - when we have a very decent chance this season to actually win something with a manager who wont concede defeat before any big match is played.



As said thus far: your critique of Martinez hits the rocks when attempting to justify exactly why Martinez should be judged by criteria NEVER used on any of his predecessors. Your best shot seems to be to suggest Martinez has assembled a great squad that he should have turned more performances into gold with. It's a p.o.v that was also at large when Moyes also had "the best squad since the 80s'" to manage when he was here...and never had the hysterical reaction for dismissal that Martinez faces on a forum like this.

Double standards. It's not a very good basis to argue anything form.
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Dave - your the onyl one constantly harping on about we should use the same criteria to judge martinez that we did for Moyes - one question - why should we do that? You yourself banged the drum wanting Moyes out and now almost petulantly because we never changed him when you wanted you now want Martinez to be given the same amount of time that Moyes in your opinion unjustly got?

P.S. as of right now we have not onyl not won the cup mate, we have not even reached as close to winning one as we did udner Moyes, so cart, horse and all that.

Your main line of defense for martinez seems to be 'people didn't give moyes this much stick, people didn't call in such large ammounts for moyes to be sacked' etc etc etc, honestly who cares what happend udner a previous manager - for right or wrong, lets just box this off and look at the last 3 years of results and that alone is enough to say bye bye Roberto

and you accuse @The Esk of double standards?
 
davek said:
He's had as much as those around him. No more than that. Want to judge him more critically and sack him? Give him amounts that suggest he cant operate under conditions in 'the New Era' of Everton, not a second before.

That's just appropriate and logical.
Click to expand...

Logical based on what? His unparalleled success in the league?
 

ianefc said:
I wouldn't just dismiss you if 20+ thousand people followed you because they liked your content. Especially if you only followed about 200 in return.
Click to expand...

To be fair I think the argument that the number of followers one has on twitter somehow relates to the quality of your tweets is somewhat spurious.
 
davek said:
Spot on mate. He's being held to account under conditions that his predecessors never were; at least give him the cash that would justifiably make judging him by a different criteria the correct call.
Click to expand...

davek said:
He's had as much as those around him. No more than that. Want to judge him more critically and sack him? Give him amounts that suggest he cant operate under conditions in 'the New Era' of Everton, not a second before.

That's just appropriate and logical.
Click to expand...

Fair enough that I guess.

The positives would be any players he did buy would be decent ones based on his big calls so far. And there would be a clear objective set. If he is on track, everyones a winner, and if he is falling short, any new manager at least has a decent squad to coach to the standard expected of Martinez.
 

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