Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[riddick]

Leicester don't do it anywheres near as good as us. Kick & rush team, them. They'll implode next time they get beat, them. Horrendous footballing side, them etc etc etc...

There are loads of differences between us and Leicester. Like, when we break, its usually just 2 people. Thats it. We never break as a team. I cannot count the amount of times that we have a break only to end wiht someone looking for ANYONE else either near them or in the box to cross to.

 

[riddick]

We're on course to do both of those things

Haven't you heard tho? The Europa League is a complete and utter sham. Why bother winning the FA Cup if THAT is your 'reward'?

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

There are loads of differences between us and Leicester. Like, when we break, its usually just 2 people. Thats it. We never break as a team. I cannot count the amount of times that we have a break only to end wiht someone looking for ANYONE else either near them or in the box to cross to.

80% of the time it goes through Barkley - who then loses the ball. Sometimes he'll get a lucky rebound, but you're right - the rest level with or behind him casually trot forward.

I suppose that's what happens when you insist on 2 defensively minded midfielders alongside Barkley, plus a winger who isn't a winger.

 

[davek]

I am slightly confused here. I see that the lack of leadership is mentioned and blamed on Jagielka. I also see references on how wonderful our team did 2 seasons ago with the 75 points (a new Everton record in the PL)...and how Martinez deserves praise for that season for achieving that. Yet no praise for our club captain that season and Jagielka is the main reason we are struggling due to lack of leadership skills? Am I missing something here or weren't Jagielka our captain in that season? Weren't we the team with the 3rd best defence that season in the league under the same captain. The reason I ask is because I am scratching my head on how the same captain of 2013-2014 all of a sudden have no leadership skills.

I might be wrong but to me it seems our biggest problem is not really tactics or the way we play etc. I honestly think the players are not fit and that is the reason that we concede so many goals towards the end of the game. When one gets tired one also loses concentration which leads to errors etc. Yes there are many other factors i know. To the best of my knowledge and I stand to be corrected...we lost some key staff members all related to physio, conditioning and performance coaching. I it coincidence that we have lost key staff members in that department. I will mention 2 of them below which I think had an impact on Everton.

Steve Tashjian left at the end of the 2013-2014 season. He was a fitness coach specializing in conditioning and performance, as some would say getting the best out of players. As I also understand he was key in planning our preseason preparations as well. 2014-2015 in my opinion we looked terrible in preseason...unfit, unprepared etc. One of the main reasons I think we had a disastrous season regardless of the World Cup excuses

Danny Donachie resigned and left at the end of December 2014. He was the head of medical services at Everton and during the Moyes era he was credited with playing a major part in getting Everton to perform. Apparently he resigned due to disagreement with Martinez on how players fitness/rehabilitation should be treated.

Once again...above is just an opinion of mine but I do think the problem is not lying at a lack of leadership from our captain.

Jagielka: when you're getting results and things are upbeat and momentum is with a team, you dont need a leader so much. That was the case in 2013/14. Defence and attack were both performing well. It's when the going gets tough that you require a captain and leader to draw the line for their team, to get them fired up and organised. Jagielka is NOT that type of player and never will be. He should be stripped of the armband forthwith.

Fitness: the evidence anyone can present of fading in the latter parts of games can be offset with examples of how in the last 10 minutes or so we've done the exact opposite. Look at the City SF 1st leg at Goodison when we had to see out the last 10 minutes with 10 men on the pitch and it looked like we had 12 and they had 11; look at the way we overwhelmed Chelsea in the final 15 minutes of the cup QF. You see what you want to see.

 

[bluewally]

I don't think calls for patience and letting the lad get on with his job until May is overzealous. The lynchings after every bad result and the overwhelming silence when we win is more notable for its zeal

I think the silence when we win is because the short term match to match view of the pro Martinez posters is impossible to deal with

When we lose anyone saying anything against is a kneejerker

When we win anyone saying anything against is crazy

This is in spite of the reality that most people who are against are looking at results over the past 2 years and one win or loss in isolation doesn't change the overall downward trend

 

[davek]

I knew when reading it that you'd pick that out.

It's spot on.

An inconvenient truth that the wave of dissenters' arguments for change crashes upon.

 

[davek]

Rodgers got Liverpool to the semi finals of both cups last season mate. Means absolutely nothing unless you win the things and even then we'll be seen as another plucky Swansea/Wigan mid table club getting their 15 minutes of fame.

We should be winning trophies and fighting for the European places.

Rodgers got £300M to spend. Not exactly the same thing, is it?

 

[navidson]

Why does everybody get so heated on here? I could understand if this was a BBC comments page made up of all teams fans - We all support Everton and want them to do well.

Really don't see the point in factions being created and insults traded amongst fellow blues

IMO I cannot fathom why certain Everton fans would not be disappointed and frustrated by the last 2 seasons - The league is our bread and butter, the cups are just a bonus - Anybody can fluke a cup final (Look at the past six years, Villa, Hull, Wigan, Stoke and Portsmouth made the cup final - What does that say?)

Despite this frustration, I try not to bust a blood vessel and start point-scoring over fellow blues - Seems a bit perverse to me!

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

It's spot on.

An inconvenient truth that the wave of dissenters' arguments for change crashes upon.

The 'pat on the head' from the condescending punditry that you were so desperately craving. The only glimmer of hope (IF you can call it that -it's nothing more than a thinly-veiled, backhanded compliment) in an otherwise grim bit of reading.

No bookie would have given odds that you'd highlight that single line. You'd have had to place the equivalent of the national debt to win a penny.

But you did it, nonetheless. And in doing so, have shown what you're about. More than happy with the 'entertainers' euphemism.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

Merged the two Martinez threads.

Later noticed the old one had been closed, and there is an odd glitch that is preventing me from opening this one after the merge.

Will sort...

[Edit] Fixed.

 

[bluewally]

It's spot on.

An inconvenient truth that the wave of dissenters' arguments for change crashes upon.

It's an opinion based on whether you want to see the club progressing or just depending on the luck of the draw each year to get to a cup semi

Look at plucky little Everton getting to the cup semi

 

[Prevenger17]

This is in spite of the reality that most people who are against are looking at results over the past 2 years and one win or loss in isolation doesn't change the overall downward trend

It doesn't, but I guarantee a Martinez: Post FA Cup victory poll would represent quite a reversal of the tide, wouldn't you agree? People are complaining that we're not fighting for Europe? We are. We're not fighting for trophies? We are for the first time in a few years, and it will be true up until the point we're knocked out of the FA Cup or win it. Let's relax until then. People can explain our home form in any number of ways but, personally, I'm a great believer that all the negative juju isn't doing much to help our team. Football has become so short term, 3 years wasn't always considered a long time.

 

[bluewally]

It doesn't, but I guarantee a Martinez: Post FA Cup victory poll would represent quite a reversal of the tide, wouldn't you agree? People are complaining that we're not fighting for Europe? We are. We're not fighting for trophies? We are for the first time in a few years, and it will be true up until the point we're knocked out of the FA Cup or win it. Let's relax until then. People can explain our home form in any number of ways but, personally, I'm a great believer that all the negative juju isn't doing much to help our team. Football has become so short term, 3 years wasn't always considered a long time.

No. People are complaining about our league performance as that is the only indicator of whether a team is making progress year after year which they blatantly are not

 

[Prevenger17]

Anybody can fluke a cup final

Yeah, but we haven't. So all those lads have won trophies in the last few years and we haven't. It's great to see that even though we soundly played Chelsea off the park, we could potentially do the same in the semis and the final and it will still be disregarded as a fluke.

 

[FisherEFC]

Rodgers got £300M to spend. Not exactly the same thing, is it?

I agree I just think with the new owner we should be showing ambition and getting a manager in who has a good record of winning cups AND finishing strongly in the league. Newcastle have been whipping boys in the league for years and are in line for relegation yet have just hired a manager that's won trophies, league titles and a champions league (whilst finishing 2nd in the prem one year).

I think unless Martinez can deliver the cup this year then he doesn't deserve a 4th season based on the previous 2, we should offer big money and a big transfer kitty to an Emery, Hiddink, Mancini, Koeman, Pellegrini heck even a risk young manager like De Boer. I think it's doing us as a historically massive club a huge disservice to hold onto a bloke who looks to not be turning things around.

Heck even West Ham dropped Big Sam and they haven't looked back.