Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[Prevenger17]

People are complaining about our league performance as that is the only indicator of whether a team is making progress year after year

I don't think it is tbh. Leicester's relegation battle did very little to convince people they would be winning the league this year.

 

[bluestevon]

Jagielka: when you're getting results and things are upbeat and momentum is with a team, you dont need a leader so much. That was the case in 2013/14. Defence and attack were both performing well. It's when the going gets tough that you require a captain and leader to draw the line for their team, to get them fired up and organised. Jagielka is NOT that type of player and never will be. He should be stripped of the armband forthwith.

Fitness: the evidence anyone can present of fading in the latter parts of games can be offset with examples of how in the last 10 minutes or so we've done the exact opposite. Look at the City SF 1st leg at Goodison when we had to see out the last 10 minutes with 10 men on the pitch and it looked like we had 12 and they had 11; look at the way we overwhelmed Chelsea in the final 15 minutes of the cup QF. You see what you want to see.

Christ using that City games last ten minutes as evidence of anything positive, did you watch it dave, City effecitvely let us keep the ball and pass it around the last ten minutes - no pressure from them, no closing down like earlier in the game - they had settled for the 2-1 scoreline and it was bleeding obvious to anyone watching that they had done.

Yes we where fitter than Chelsea - then again we had 7 days rest and Chelsea has 3 days after their gruelling second leg against PSG gpoing into that game - which some unbiased people may say had some effect on the last 15 minutes energy levels for both teams

As for all this crap about 'leaders', and blaming Jagielka, here is some news for you mate, Martinez is the manager and it follows that with that he is the leader of this team, so why not start the blame game right at his doorstep instead of at the player HE is picking and who HE has left and endorsed repeatedly as HIS captain, do i think he is a good Caprain - ofc i don't - do i think he is worse in that role than martinez is in his - nope their both useless leaders, both should be relieved as you stated of that duty

Oh last little thing btw, City as i said let us keep ball the last ten minutes at the score being 2-1 and subsequently smashed us all voer the shop at their ground, and we looked dead on our feet the last 30 minutes of that game - when it actually mattered mate

 

[bluewally]

I don't think it is tbh. Leicester's relegation battle did very little to convince people they would be winning the league this year.

So by going from the championship to 15th to 1st the league doesn't show them making progress?

One year in isolation is not a trend

5th, 11th, 12th* is a trend

 

[FisherEFC]

The whole captain thing is rubbish, Rooney is one of the best captains in the league yet Utd still look a shambles under LVG, the only difference is they can scrape wins 1-0 whilst we can scrape 3-3 draws.

 

[Minimeister]

Yeah, but we haven't. So all those lads have won trophies in the last few years and we haven't. It's great to see that even though we soundly played Chelsea off the park, we could potentially do the same in the semis and the final and it will still be disregarded as a fluke.

This is what puts me off reading these threads bar the last page. Everyone has an opinion and fine, but when you start belittling your own clubs achievement by talking of 'flukey' cup runs then I can't be arsed reading it. Yes we've been dreadful at home in the league so have a go at that, don't talk about lucky cup runs when we've actually had some very good results and performances in it. They want to get out to a semi or something.

 

[Caolam]

I am of the opinion that the decision to let Martinez go has already been made. If we win the cup it will just make his going slightly more of an issue.
I look at how Martinez has preformed as our manager over the three years and we have gone backwards in terms of where we stand in the league. If I had £100 million to give to a manager to spend to bring my club up a level I would want to have confidence in him. I don't see how Martinez is instilling that confidence.
There is no doubt he can put together a side capable of playing entertaining football but he is unable to convert that entertaining team into a winning team.
The new owner doesn't want to watch us giving an entertaining afternoon to Stoke fans by loosing 3-4 and then being told how brilliant we played and how we are close to being what it is we are trying to achieve as a football club in this moment.
He will want results.

 

[navidson]

Yeah, but we haven't. So all those lads have won trophies in the last few years and we haven't. It's great to see that even though we soundly played Chelsea off the park, we could potentially do the same in the semis and the final and it will still be disregarded as a fluke.

Yes it will - because we're 12th in the league

 

[davek]

This is nothing more than the usual pat on the head from the big 5 media. I never expect any pressure on Martinez from them because he is a dream manager for not rocking the establishment. Finishing ahead of Liverpool and bothering the top 4 did not sit well with them. Staying in the bottom half and polishing up players for other clubs to use is their ideal scenario for Everton.

It is what it is. And it highlights the huge gulf between the fumeageddon on here and the industry perception. The latter is one of 'under-performing, but great football and very good players...the defence needs sorting'.

Only knuckle draggers like Barton and Merson have provided an alternative narrative....such as it it.

 

[davek]

@davek

Look at that mate, another Rodgers comparison !

He is our Brendan Rodgers, there is no difference except Rodgers actually done a better job despite the money spent.

They are certainly 2 peas in a pod in many ways, their owners had sense to suss Rodgers out and hook him let's hope Moshiri does the same.

Chalk and cheese.

Until Martinez spends £300M and wins nothing it'll remain that way too. A bogus 'comparison' if ever there were one.

 

[Prevenger17]

Yes it will - because we're 12th in the league

It takes no skill and consistency to win a cup then? Not to worry mate, I'll get on the blower to Barcelona and let them know

 

[davek]

languishing in the bottom half of the table (again) below west brom, level with newly promoted Bournemouth, 2 points ahead of Swansea who by their own admission are having a bad season; with the squad we have is a total failure. having two good cup runs to me does not make up for that.

A game in hand on WBA and two games in hand on Swansea and B'mouth.

The table is squeezed between 9th and 12th. A win here and a loss there turns the table on its head again. It was only a month ago when a win from us and losses around us put us top 7. It's all head of a pin stuff. You cant say below those in the European spots that one team is clearly better than others in and around them...or where they'll finish.

 

[eddy]

I would sooner someone else spent the 300 million rather than Martinez, just to prove to a few, that he is not up to the job
whilst the majority can already see this. Let someone better have the purse. The kopites I have spoken to are laughing at us and hoping martinez stays just like we laughed at rodgers. Martinez failures are a daily talking point for the sports pundits Mosh needs to act quickly

 

[bluewally]

It is what it is. And it highlights the huge gulf between the fumeageddon on here and the industry perception. The latter is one of 'under-performing, but great football and very good players...the defence needs sorting'.

Only knuckle draggers like Barton and Merson have provided an alternative narrative....such as it it.

Since you have such a high respect for that article let's take some more

"But Everton's worrying league form raises questions over whether the squad and Martinez should be doing better, given the talent they have at their disposal.

"In the league they're underachieving," says former Everton striker Tony Cottee. "They should be where West Ham and Manchester United are, looking to push into the top four.

"For Everton to finish in the bottom half of the Premier League - especially when it has been such an open division this season, with all of the big guns misfiring - would be more than disappointing.

"It's a serious problem. You can't keep saying 'oh well, we'll get it right next year'. They need to start getting it right now.""

Oh my, "worrying league form", "more than disappointing", "serious problem", isn't that what every anti Martinez poster has been saying.

Keep calling it fume. It's the truth and it's the industry perception.

 

[navidson]

It takes no skill and consistency to win a cup then? Not to worry mate, I'll get on the blower to Barcelona and let them know

It takes greater skill and consistency to perform well in the league though - Which we've undoubtedly failed miserably at for the past 2 seasons

Barcelona are about to win their league

I would question the attitude of the players if they are lifting their game for cup matches - Which seems to be what you're suggesting

 

[Prevenger17]

I would question the attitude of the players if they are lifting their game for cup matches - Which seems to be what you're suggesting

I would question the attitude of the Lower Glwadys, but that's a different argument