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Roberto Martinez discussion

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Everyone arguing amongst eachother trying to find either A)Martinez sacked. Or B) Excuses for him.

Truth is nobody wants to see him sacked but if he cant change a game like he did in his first season then he should go.
Wait until Romelu and Kev want out then you all start kicking off, he is a mercenary, he thinks too much of himself etc etc... truth is if I was Kev id want out and romelu too. No wingers, no change in style, one up front, all falls down to one man.
Like is said last year we were too close to relegation for a period of time in which even the most hardened Martinez supporter had his/her doubts, maybe except for davek. Im sure he was Bobby in disguise lol
 
We play a certain way which, at its best is very attractive, attacking and penetrative.
There are two reasons for me why this isn't achieved every game.

1) Players having an off day (see man utd result)
2) Injuries.

In both of these instances we need able deputies to our best 11. We don't have that.

You say that teams know that all our threat comes from wide areas, yet fail to acknowledge that we are missing Baines and were missing Coleman for a hefty chunk of the start of the season. Martinez looked to bring in Oviedo at left back, but he picked up an injury. He then picked Galloway who I think we can all agree, plays the game like a fearless CB at full back -full of endeavour, honest running, but lacks the fundamental skills that an attacking left back now needs in the modern game. I personally think that Martinez should be playing Mirrallas or Osman on the left i.e. someone who lacks a bit of defensive acumen but can either commit opposing full-backs (Mirrallas) or can execute something a little 'cuter' in the final third (Osman). Instead he has picked Naismith out there, I guess to protect Galloway. Again, I think this is wrong of Martinez and criticism of this selection is warranted in my opinion. But it's got nothing to do with central midfield.

On the other side of the pitch, Martinez has picked Browning and, then a combination of more attacking players ahead of him (and Coleman when he was fit). The right hand side of our play has looked impressive for the most part - whether it's been Deulofeu against WBA, or Kone vs Chelsea/Southampton. Again, I think Martinez made a mistake in picking Lennon against Utd. It was too-safe. But this isn't an issue with central midfield.

The point i'm making here is that team selection in the wide areas is causing us to look inconsistent, not in central midfield. Dropping Deulofeu, on the face of it, was very unlike Martinez as he has in the past played the younger players in the game after they made errors so their confidence isn't affected and they can put into practice what they learned from their previous game and mistake.

You make the statement of 'we needed another goal in the derby and didnt look like getting one", and by that you're suggesting a change of system? What about the fact that in the derby we were missing Coleman, Baines, Cleverley, Pienaar, Mirrallas. Players that we don't have the finances (another debate for another time) to have ready-made replacements for. Instead, the easy solution to some fans is "we should have dropped a holding player and thrown another man forward". It's not like we weren't putting Liverpool under pressure was it? We were missing some quality in the final third, in creating a goal threat. Whoever Martinez brings in will be giving the ball to these attacking players, not providing it himself.

You say that the midfield 2 don't offer protection I think they do, I'd throw your 'watch the games again" right back at you. Barry and McCarthy position themselves when we don't have the ball in the best place they can win it back. That might be not be sat on top of the 2 CB's, it might be trying to win the ball back higher, but their solely purpose is protection in these instances.

I'm sorry if this comes across as rude because it genuinely isn't supposed to. But you really are missing the point quite spectacularly.

I'm not sure how clearly I can make the point that it's not working. I understand that Baines and Coleman aren't playing - my point is, does Roberto? It seems blatantly obvious that we cannot play the same way with Galloway and Browning, and yet we try to. Without our major threat, we need a different way of breaking teams down. And we don't have one. This is why I don't think the system works without a midfielder who can take an active part in the attack. I think we rely on the natural ability of players to beat a man or pull a wonder strike out of the bag, rather than having a clear and coherent plan to break teams down. When the two full backs are replaced by centre halves, and Mirallas/Deulofeu (and to a lesser extent McGeady) are overlooked for Naismith and Lennon, the number of players who can do something out of nothing are reduced to two, and it becomes very difficult for us to score.

Again, you resort later on to telling me how the system is set up to work. I've already stated that i'm fully aware of how we are set up to play and what the midfielders are being asked to do. The whole point is that i think it's wrong and doesn't work! You seem to be under the mistaken impression that i'm saying the midfielders should be getting 10 goals a season, but that isn't what i'm getting at. I believe that we need a midfielder who can orchestrate the play, playing quick, incisive passes forward from a deep lying role.
 
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So you asked him a ridiculous binary yes no question on Martinez in a continuation of a ridiculous movement in here to push people into opposing camps. When he's answered down the middle you've trawled through and taken his posts out of context or from moments of intense frustration (we've all said stuff after bad defeats we don't mean) to try and prove that somehow he's back-pedalling just because you don't agree with his point of view on Martinez. It truly is baffling stuff.
No I think you'll find I asked him a simple question about if he wants Bobby sacked. No with reservations/caveats is still a no.

He said he didn't want him sacked which surprised me due to the number of times i'd seen him post the complete opposite. I pointed this out.

I hope you're wearing a parachute, because that's a very high Horse you are currently on.
 
So you asked him a ridiculous binary yes no question on Martinez in a continuation of a ridiculous movement in here to push people into opposing camps. When he's answered down the middle you've trawled through and taken his posts out of context or from moments of intense frustration (we've all said stuff after bad defeats we don't mean) to try and prove that somehow he's back-pedalling just because you don't agree with his point of view on Martinez. It truly is baffling stuff.

The only thing baffling is that after a harmless and straight forward question the answer given is completely at odds with his posting history.
 
No I think you'll find I asked him a simple question about if he wants Bobby sacked. No with reservations/caveats is still a no.

He said He didn't want him sacked (which surprised me due to the number of times i'd seen him post the complete opposite. I pointed this out.

I hope you're wearing a parachute, because that's a very high Horse you are currently on.

I just don't get this obsession people have with trying to out others with Martinez yes or no questions. You are allowed to change your mind as well you know. There's people still being criticised for not wanting Martinez before he even came! There's a whole myriad of views on here about Martinez but it seems that some are spiking for a battle basically 'admit you want Martibez fired so I can vault you later and call you a bad fan'. There's also been a lot of 'I respect those posters who say they want him out, but not those who criticise him all the time but won't say they want him out'. Maybe that's because they don't! What warped 5 year old logic is this?
 

I just don't get this obsession people have with trying to out others with Martinez yes or no questions. You are allowed to change your mind as well you know. There's people still being criticised for not wanting Martinez before he even came! There's a whole myriad of views on here about Martinez but it seems that some are spiking for a battle basically 'admit you want Martibez fired so I can vault you later and call you a bad fan'. There's also been a lot of 'I respect those posters who say they want him out, but not those who criticise him all the time but won't say they want him out'. Maybe that's because they don't! What warped 5 year old logic is this?
I followed up my first simple question with another question asking him what had changed his mind from his previous posts.

Really you should try actually reading posts before going on the offensive

It doesn't matter what his answer is yes/no and it doesn't matter that he changed his answer. I asked him a simple question, his answer surprised me (because of his previous posts) and I asked him his reasoning for the change.

Wow, the Paranoia is rife in the Plotter Camp today.....
 
I followed up my first simple question with another question asking him what had changed his mind from his previous posts.

Really you should try actually reading posts before going on the offence

It doesn't matter what his answer is yes/no and it doesn't matter that he changed his answer. I asked him a simple question, his answer surprised me (because of his previous posts) and I asked him his reasoning for the change.

Wow, the Paranoia is rife in the Plotter Camp today.....

Does it really not matter to you that he changed his answer?
'Perhaps in future he should get his Carer to check his posts the next time he starts bouncing his headwand off the keyboard? It would save him a lot of embarrassment'

As a genuine plotter (you know that group of people who don't want Martinez out) I'm interested how the above quotation shows that his answer is of no matter to you.
 
Does it really not matter to you that he changed his answer?
'Perhaps in future he should get his Carer to check his posts the next time he starts bouncing his headwand off the keyboard? It would save him a lot of embarrassment'

As a genuine plotter (you know that group of people who don't want Martinez out) I'm interested how the above quotation shows that his answer is of no matter to you.
Of course it doesn't matter to me that he changed his answer (as i've already said), I did however wonder what made him change his answer. That also doesn't MATTER to me but I was curious, so I asked.

I still have't had an answer, not that he need to justify himself to me or anything but I merely asked for him to share his reasoning for his change of view.
 


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