Roberto Martinez discussion

[davek]

You keep changing your stance slightly.

What makes a good captain?

Someone who is a consummate professional and leads through 100% effort in training and matches.

Someone who makes players play better around them.

Someone who has pride and dignity for being a captain of our great club.

A level headed player who can talk to refs and officials on players in his team not so calm.

Think jags has all of them to be honest.

In bold: I've never seen any evidence of this. Jagielka plays his own game, that's it. I've never seen anyone about him being made to play 'better'. Demonstrably guiding them into better positions, calling to them etc - not in his game I'm afraid.

In blue: a soft one, but an easy claim to make. But all players are expected to be 100% professional and most of our players are. It's not peculiar to being a captain.

In red: is that 'being a good captain' that he has pride in wearing the armband? Not an awful lot of use as an onfield quality.

 

[micknick]

In bold: I've never seen any evidence of this. Jagielka plays his own game, that's it. I've never seen anyone about him being made to play 'better'. Demonstrably guiding them into better positions, calling to them etc - not in his game I'm afraid.

In blue: a soft one, but an easy claim to make. But all players are expected to be 100% professional and most of our players are. It's not peculiar to being a captain.

In red: is that 'being a good captain' that he has pride in wearing the armband? Not an awful lot of use as an onfield quality.

Look you dont see him running around shouting and balling at everyone on the pitch and if you think that makes a good captain again I think you are misguided and probably never played any sport yourself.

Im not saying that from what I see is that he is a superb captain but I believe he is very underrated player that has a calming influence on the side- the proof is in the pudding:

- Lescott was never the same player when he didnt have Jags next to him
- Distin pretty much resurrected his career playing next to him
- Stones looks far more composed when he is there with Jags (which you alluded to yourself)

I just dont get the bashing of Jags- hes a good player and I think if he had been playing especially the games where we snatched draws from the jaws of victory they would have in fact been wins.

Oh and a good captain in my opinion represents the club on and off the field.

 

[chicoazul]

told ya
preview writing WUM.
Only contender for official court jester to GOT...I did enjoy me saucer of milk though

I prefer to think of thyself as a moderate viewed agent of harmony on here.

 

[davek]

Look you dont see him running around shouting and balling at everyone on the pitch and you think that makes a good captain again I think yiu are misguided and probably never played any sport yourself.

Im not saying that from what I see is that he is a superb captain but I believe he is very underrated player that has a calming influence on the side- the proof is in the pudding:

- Lescott was never the same player when he didnt have Jags next to him
- Distin pretty much resurrected his career playing next to him
- Stones looks far more composed when he is there with Jags (which you alluded to yourself)

I just dont get the bashing of Jags- hes a good player and I think if he had been playing especially the games where we snatched draws from the jaws of victory they would have in fact been wins.

Oh and a good captain in my opinion represents the club on and off the field.

The examples of players becoming better are shaky:

Lescott played much of his career at LB at Everton, he wasn't really Jagielka's partner; Distin was an accomplished CB before he arrived at GP and it could equally be claimed he showed Jagielka what's what; yes, Stones is more conservative and less wayward when Jagielka is there - but he hasn't brought his game on in any way that I can see (if he's made him more positionally aware, for example, I see no evidence of it).

Overall: it's the easiest claim in the world to make that someone is being a good captain by being 'statesmanlike'.

 

[micknick]

The examples of players becoming better are shaky:

Lescott played much of his career at LB at Everton, he wasn't really Jagielka's partner; Distin was an accomplished CB before he arrived at GP and it could equally be claimed he showed Jagielka what's what; yes, Stones is more conservative and less wayward when Jagielka is there - but he hasn't brought his game on in any way that I can see (if he's made him more positionally aware, for example, I see no evidence of it).

Overall: it's the easiest claim in the world to make that someone is being a good captain by being 'statesmanlike'.

Ok who would you have as captain instead?

 

[jal123]

I'm sure it's only in this country that we seem to put some bizarre thing on who's the captain? Does it matter? Some people are natural leaders and some are followers, having a bit of elastic round your bicep doesn't suddenly make you a great leader.

 

[davek]

Ok who would you have as captain instead?

That presupposes that there's an alternative to be had right now. I dont think we have natural organiser at the heart of the team who has the stamp of a leader about them. We need one. Maybe if the armband is given to someone like McCarthy they rise to the occasion. Who knows.

 

[neil999]

I prefer to think of thyself as a moderate viewed agent of harmony on here.

i dont really know what one of those is

 

[chicoazul]

i dont really know what one of those is

Then long you shall prosper on GOT brother.

 

[degsy]

I prefer to think of thyself as a moderate viewed agent of harmony on here.

you're all things to all men...or not, as the case may be

You've got my vote for the motley

 

[chicoazul]

you're all things to all men...or not, as the case may be

You've got my vote for the motley

We should spread the word of love, understanding and community on here together man.

 

[Little Ralphy]

That presupposes that there's an alternative to be had right now. I dont think we have natural organiser at the heart of the team who has the stamp of a leader about them. We need one. Maybe if the armband is given to someone like McCarthy they rise to the occasion. Who knows.

Kind of shows your limited knowledge of playing sport there. Just pick the angriest player as surely if they shout that makes them a good captain.

Are you also one of those who thinks players only care about losing if they kick off and sulk after it?

The manager you worship praises the man he chose to be his Captain, as @micknick says, there is obviously a lot more to the man than most are picking up on, and a football Club Captain does a lot more than just the 90 minutes on the pitch.

Also you can often see/hear Jags shouting and talking to players in games, and Lescott and Jags were highly praised as a central defensive partnership, and it was funny that at the time Yobo and Lescott could never hit it off the same, but either one alongside Jags seemed to look great.

 

[degsy]

We should spread the word of love, understanding and community on here together man.

'koff you hippy bell

 

[chicoazul]

'koff you hippy bell

Embrace me degga and let's walk into the night and share our love with all the Evertonians we engage on the nightshift.

Together you and I can change things. But first you need to stop hating Latinos you taeg.

 

[degsy]

Embrace me degga and let's walk into the night and share our love with all the Evertonians we engage on the nightshift.

Together you and I can change things. But first you need to stop hating Latinos you taeg.

*grabs ankles.

Mods. no more off topic, honest.