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Roberto Martinez discussion

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We're only 3 points better of than last season with a better squad by far. Martinez can't cut it simple as that

We've done worse in the league than we should in the last 18 months. Agreed.

Which is why the manager needs to prove himself, either by showing real form in the league or winning a cup. If he can't do either of those things, and I assume you think he can't, then you have to wonder what he offers. But I don't see what we'd lose by giving him 4 months to prove that he can.
 
I do think that if we get knocked out of both cups and if we don't improve massively in the league, you would have to seriously consider sacking him this summer. He has the next 4 months to show that he's worth keeping, would be my view on it. Winning a trophy would do that, going on a proper run of wins in the league to get us to a respectable finish would probably also do that but continue playing like we currently are and it's hard to justify keeping him.

We were saying the same last season. Are we going to be saying the same next year?
 


Martinez's job is to win us trophies. If he doesn't, then he'll have failed here like bingham, lee, harvey, moyes, smith and many others have failed here.

If he does then he's succeeded.

It's not a plaster over the main issues, it's the actual goal of every manager.

Now I don't think he will, because the hard bit is very much still to do and we don't really look good enough to do it. But if it doesn't change your opinion on the manager if we were to do it then you're too blinkered in your views.

Now i am not suggesting this at all, if we won a trophy and got relegated is that a success? The worst thing to happen to football was the premiership and the fact as a business we budget every year based on a league position.

As a club, finishing in the bottom half isn't good enough. Ill celebrate a trophy win the same i celebrated every one in the 80's, but right now we are not anywhere near being a successful side. Winning the capital one cup will be amazing, winning that then facing 3/4 more months of what we are doing in the premiership will not be.

Its all a very big "if" at the moment, don't win this week and go out - he shouldn't hold onto his position? We have gone from knocking on the door every season to whats happening now. This was the season to knock through the door, the players knew it you hear them talking - now its forget about it (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/spor.../everton-can-forget-champions-league-10782611).

Winning a cup will be brilliant, but it will be a plaster over the cracks if we don't improve all around and lose people in the summer.
 
Like many others I've slept on it and found myself just as annoyed this morning.

I wanted him gone around this time last season, but convinced myself that he deserved time to turn it around. Well, 12 months on and very little has changed.

Putting aside his dire record and our astonishing underachievement, two things that make me utterly despair are his stubbornness and the complete and utter bollocks he talks in the media. Remember Moyes? Remember how stubborn we thought he was? Martinez makes Moyes look like the ultimate pragmatist in comparison. If something wasn't working under Moyes, more often than not he'd change it (sometimes not as quickly as we'd like, granted). But ask yourselves, would we have gone 18 months under Moyes letting in goals right, left and centre? Not a chance. We'd tighten up for a few weeks and get a few scrappy results, and then we'd be okay. Martinez doesn't even seem to think defending is a legitimate part of the game, his complete ambivalence is infuriating.

Then we get on to his media appearances - listening to them every week, you can only surmise that he's either 1) A WUM or 2) Utterly deluded. If we're playing terribly (which we patently are), I want our manager to acknowledge that, but when asked he comes out with the biggest load of toss you could possibly imagine. He almost seems unmoved by our results, as if passing the ball around the back 4 and keeping 60% possession is somehow more important and worthy of praise.

I've no doubt he's a wonderful man and a brilliant ambassador for our club, but the sad truth is he doesn't have what it takes to be a manager at this level. And despite my praise for Moyes, I don't want him back, we can do better, but is he a better manager than Martinez? It's increasingly hard to say no.
 

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