Roberto Martinez discussion

[Ashtonian]

I Think west ham's game was Martinez's Sunderland / Newcastle moment for me to a very large extent.

The breaking point for me with Moyes was when we played newcastle, and 2-1 down he replaced injured midfielder neville with distin and moved heitinga in midfield. then a few games later at most, we scored after 6 minutes against sunderland, then defended our 6 yard box as if the game was nearly over. He didnt bring strikers on until thr 82nd and 83rd minute.

West ham rings of that, not defending a 2-0 lead for only 15 minutes? That win could have been a massive platform for the rest of the season, a third chance of getting somewhere, instead it is the same old story with another win turned into a defeat, nothing to show for our efforts and ultimately losing vs arsenal and a Bournemouth win will pretty much end any hope of keeping our best players in the summer away from a new manager.

 

[BlueToff]

I thought I'd feel better about it today. I don't, I feel somehow worse.....but I think our friends across the park may have contributed somewhat to that like...

And I desperately want to get 'up' for the CHEL game in the same way some seem 'up & confident abarrr it on the thread. Yet I have the most awful feeling about it, that he's gonna do something SO tactically inept that it creates further head in hands moments.

Onward though eh, hope must prevail....all that bollocks.

*gonna be a long week this.

To be fair to RM, I never really doubt his ability to set up a team from the start. A case-in point would be Saturday's game. We were all baffled by the three at the back yet actually it worked a treat up until Kev got himself sent off.

He then made a good sub at HT to reshuffle the pack and again it worked.

He then ruins all that work with a stupid sub and suddenly we capitulate (which is as much down to the players as manager but as I said RM facilitated the opportunity for that to happen).

 

[BlueToff]

Bottom half manager.

Yes with a bottom half club for the first four years.

He's got what it takes if he's willing to change.

He'd shown since the turn of the year that he was and then manages to go and f it all up.

 

[deipnosophist]

Basically, his substitution left our entire left flank undefended, thus exposing our centre to unchallenged bombardment (ie crosses)....and eventual defeat. If he were a general, he'd be court martialled.

 

[Ashtonian]

To be fair to RM, I never really doubt his ability to set up a team from the start. A case-in point would be Saturday's game. We were all baffled by the three at the back yet actually it worked a treat up until Kev got himself sent off.

He then made a good sub at HT to reshuffle the pack and again it worked.

He then ruins all that work with a stupid sub and suddenly we capitulate (which is as much down to the players as manager but as I said RM facilitated the opportunity for that to happen).

And that is the thing mate, makes no difference how well he managed for 75 minutes if we walk away with no points because he didn't tell the team to drop deep to cover space and see it out.

I'm not a manager, but you know what i would do at that point knowing we needed the points? Bring Baines and Barry on, have three holding midfielders cutting out space in front of the box, double up the full backs (oviedo/baines for example) and restrict west ham to find a way through. The longer it took them, the less of the game they had to win.

 

[Eric Djemba-Djemba]

Yes with a bottom half club for the first four years.

He's got what it takes if he's willing to change.

He'd shown since the turn of the year that he was and then manages to go and f it all up.

I don't think he does.

 

[TheHumbleEgg]

To be fair to RM, I never really doubt his ability to set up a team from the start. A case-in point would be Saturday's game. We were all baffled by the three at the back yet actually it worked a treat up until Kev got himself sent off.

He then made a good sub at HT to reshuffle the pack and again it worked.

He then ruins all that work with a stupid sub and suddenly we capitulate (which is as much down to the players as manager but as I said RM facilitated the opportunity for that to happen).

Again, to give him credit, he seems to grab these opportunities with both hands. Every time. Pffff.....

I'm SO far from wanting us to be a sacking club....but I genuinely don't know how many seasons can be written of as 'developmental' now.

He simply doesn't learn.

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

So right now it still feels as rubbish as it did on Saturday night.

In one match Martinez showed everything about him which is right and wrong. makes the right adjustment with Besic - playing great football. Then a substitution of sheer lunacy brings the house of cards falling down. He is so infuriating its untrue, if only he learned from the mistakes of other games and learnt to see it out, he would be a good manager.

Shame he won't, and that sub for Niasse i am literally still struggling to figure it out - it should have been for Lukaku and Barry for Lennon - if he was actually so tired he couldn't walk hahaha. So while i was willing to judge him at the end of the season (even though i was falling on the get rid side), I am now not behind the manager.

 

[hktoffee]

I don't think he does.

Me either. He does not want to defend a 2-0 lead with 15 mins to go that is for sure. He won't change and never will.

 

[dano195]

If we were to win the FA Cup or get into Europe (both unlikely) I think i'd still like to see Martinez get sacked. I've been a strong supporter of his especially when others wanted him gone however I've joined the party now. Defensively we are embarrassing!

 

[TheHumbleEgg]

If we were to win the FA Cup or get into Europe (both unlikely) I think i'd still like to see Martinez get sacked. I've been a strong supporter of his especially when others wanted him gone however I've joined the party now. Defensively we are embarrassing!

....embarrassing with a LOAD of international defenders.

That's quite an achievement really.

 

[hktoffee]

If we were to win the FA Cup or get into Europe (both unlikely) I think i'd still like to see Martinez get sacked. I've been a strong supporter of his especially when others wanted him gone however I've joined the party now. Defensively we are embarrassing!

Some people keep moving the goal post for Martinez. Yes the season has 10 games to go but in reality do you think he can win about 60 per cent of it and get Europa? Unlikely. Have we beaten a team which is above us in the table this season? We win 4 league games at Goodison which could be the worst ever PL records if we don't reach 7 by May.

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

....embarrassing with a LOAD of international defenders.

That's quite an achievement really.

See this was the argument i had with someone who was saying that we need new defenders. Every single one off our back line (bar Robles) is an international. There is no excuse for the way they are defending, the have to take a massive amount of blame for this, but Martinez has to take blame of the way its set up and the training they do.

I am not letting the players off in the slightest with their performances, but the set up must have something massively wrong if we can't defend crossed. We have never been weak touches at the back - yet the last two seasons have been absolutely terrible.

 

[deipnosophist]

Many people see Mr Martinez as a 'good bloke'. I view him in different light. I think he's narcissistic, arrogant and delusional ( bordering on unhinged). He's a snake oil salesman who's pulled the wool over far too many eyes...

 

[markmarkmark]

The only way we will become a successful club (again) is if we become a sacking club in the process