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Roberto Martinez discussion

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evertony said:
I couldn't understand it either. However, I seem to be in a very small minority, perhaps even a minority of one who thought the Europa campaign was really good for us in the medium to long term, even at the expense of a few league platings. The Europa, and taking it seriously, has given this young squad a great grounding in European football. It's no use busting a gut to get top four only to be unceremoniously dumped out of the CL at the first qualifying round, and without European experience that's exactly what would happen. It's given us much needed experience, and it's given us a 55-60 game season in most players legs which I reckon will see us massively fitter this year for the duration of the season.
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Oh yeah, it's money in the bank in this group of players' development. But, imo, it depleted our time to prepare for PL games and energy levels required for them...and we also had a novice manager in Europe who obviously found it difficult to get the balance of his efforts right.

In future (in the EL) a club in our position has to relax a bit in the early stages of that tournament and play a lot of peripheral players. If we go on to the KO stages then take it more seriously. I just think we left a lot of our best football last season in early rounds of a competition that only really becomes interesting at the stage we were eliminated.
 
davek said:
Oh yeah, it's money in the bank in this group of players' development. But, imo, it depleted our time to prepare for PL games and energy levels required for them...and we also had a novice manager in Europe who obviously found it difficult to get the balance of his efforts right.

In future (in the EL) a club in our position has to relax a bit in the early stages of that tournament and play a lot of peripheral players. If we go on to the KO stages then take it more seriously. I just think we left a lot of our best football last season in early rounds of a competition that only really becomes interesting at the stage we were eliminated.
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Should have rested barry and baines in the grp, without a bkup striker we where doomed though
 
davek said:
I could never understand the sizeable shift against Martinez last season. I expected the few troubled souls who have always had it in for RM to hector a few more waverers into their camp, but there were some surprises in terms of who jumped ship. Last season was so obviously about the Europa League invasion of the season. It was like a lead weight around the team's ankles. They just couldn't manage to find a balance. That was my main gripe with Martinez and I said it very early last season too, because it was observable: he'd prioritized the European programme (or at least given it equal status with the domestic programme). It was madness and it very nearly cost him his job.

It's early days, but I fully expect us to build on this start and have a very good season.
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Bob will do my head in with his insistence to start Barry every match when its clear that he has his best games with a healthy amount of rest. His subs are also perplexing at times. Then again I also know that a Clough/Ferguson/Jose hybrid manager would probably have his pets that play every match and have weird subs. That being said he's decent in the transfer market, and we do play nice footie often. So yea there might be better out there, but there are a bunch of potential managers that would be way worse.

Europa didn't help, but I think it was a lot on a bunch of players starting in the 1st world cup and not having an offseason. Jags came back with everybody blaming him for stoopid reasons. Coleman came back injured and other sides were wise to the fact that he was never ever going to cross (see how he's working that into his game after having an offseason?). Barkley came back a marked man off a Harry Kane like year in which everything went right for him. Lukaku wasn't really fit at the beginning of the season either. It was like in August and Sept of last year the only player who was ready for the season to start was Naisy.
 

evertony said:
I couldn't understand it either. However, I seem to be in a very small minority, perhaps even a minority of one who thought the Europa campaign was really good for us in the medium to long term, even at the expense of a few league platings. The Europa, and taking it seriously, has given this young squad a great grounding in European football. It's no use busting a gut to get top four only to be unceremoniously dumped out of the CL at the first qualifying round, and without European experience that's exactly what would happen. It's given us much needed experience, and it's given us a 55-60 game season in most players legs which I reckon will see us massively fitter this year for the duration of the season.
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nailed it. we'd all have settled for a 14th/15th place finish if we won the europa. The way we were playing, we could have won it - just had one shocker of a night.

we were always too good to go down, people were over-panicking.

but like you say, experience in europe is vital if we want to become regulars. it was his first season managing domestic with europe, he's still young as a manager. we have fans who crave young players coming in instead of experience, so why can't the same patience be applied to the manager?

we've all seen how bad city have struggled to adapt to the CL - it takes time and experience.
 
roydo said:
Been a good few weeks for the boss. Very good few weeks.

Not gonna lie, had misgivings around Christmas, something was not right. I think we all know what that was now. But that flair and "sod em" attitude we had in his first season is returning.

Never wanted him out, search all you like, but I was baffled at what I watching at times last season. Ace to seemingly see the "old" Everton dusting themselves off.

Sky is the limit. Sort of.
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What was it in your opinion? There seems to be a number of candidates. Genuinely interested in hearing what you think the sources of the malaise were? (Distin isn't that powerful surely?)
 
chicoazul said:
Imagine wanting Martinez fired though?

There was a moment there where a load of you turned into geordies and was screaming for his head. Had you got your way you would have set back Everton by years.

One brave man stood against you all, take a bow @davek.

For those who wanted him gone I deny you the right to enjoy Saturday's win.
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Think you got close enough yourself to be fair. (I have a full list and once we win the league by Christmas this year, I plan to open a thread for the obligatory Maoist acts of "self criticism." It will be sons denouncing fathers. Weeping life-longs fans of Everton screamed down by Bobby's blue guards. Lads shaking copies of the program with Naisey's pictures on it in the faces of plotters. That sort of thing.)
 
chicoazul said:
Imagine wanting Martinez fired though?

There was a moment there where a load of you turned into geordies and was screaming for his head. Had you got your way you would have set back Everton by years.

One brave man stood against you all, take a bow @davek.

For those who wanted him gone I deny you the right to enjoy Saturday's win.
Click to expand...

He wasn't alone though, Chico.

When the plotters were at their most dastardly, Damon bizarro had his back......:drunk:
 

chicoazul said:
Imagine wanting Martinez fired though?

There was a moment there where a load of you turned into geordies and was screaming for his head. Had you got your way you would have set back Everton by years.

One brave man stood against you all, take a bow @davek.

For those who wanted him gone I deny you the right to enjoy Saturday's win.
Click to expand...

We lose our next game and they'll be back with their pitchforks and torches rest assured.

As soon as the teamsheet is announced there will be fuming. We have some folks that ain't happy unless they are moaning.

They are waiting to turn on Kone, Barry, and Howard as well and will slate them at the first sign of a poor performance. Hate that crap.
 
davek said:
Oh yeah, it's money in the bank in this group of players' development. But, imo, it depleted our time to prepare for PL games and energy levels required for them...and we also had a novice manager in Europe who obviously found it difficult to get the balance of his efforts right.

In future (in the EL) a club in our position has to relax a bit in the early stages of that tournament and play a lot of peripheral players. If we go on to the KO stages then take it more seriously. I just think we left a lot of our best football last season in early rounds of a competition that only really becomes interesting at the stage we were eliminated.
Click to expand...

We did also have a legitimately tough group by which we were no means guaranteed to go through. Three "Big 5" clubs plus a faraway Russian side to top it off? EL groups are rarely that brutal.

I don't blame Martinez for not wanting to rotate more against sides like Wolfsburg and Lille.
 
chicoazul said:
Imagine wanting Martinez fired though?

There was a moment there where a load of you turned into geordies and was screaming for his head. Had you got your way you would have set back Everton by years.

One brave man stood against you all, take a bow @davek.

For those who wanted him gone I deny you the right to enjoy Saturday's win.
Click to expand...
Think ill give it another 2 or 3 impressive wins, then the vaults are getting opened
 

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