Ronald Koeman discussion

[GrandOldTeam]

Conversely, Pochettinos record was no great shakes when Tottenham took him. He's doing ok.

He hadnt failed in a big way at multiple clubs, had he? Espanyol then Southampton...

Koeman bombed elsewhere. As I was saying before we appointed him...

Neither.

De Boer would be a shot in the dark.

Koeman has done decent at Southampton. Big thrill? Prior that what did he do at Valencia, Benfica and the rest? Football nomad and flavour of the month like Laudrup/Swansea was after Moyes left.

I think Koeman is doing at Southampton what Moyes was doing at Everton all those years ago. Fair play to him.

Fans have a tendency to look at just the last year or two in isolation - wider picture for Koeman;

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I look at all those teams, he has been quickly moved on in succession and wonder...

 

[Blue Cheese]

Valencia and Benfica were going on for a decade ago mate...

He did very well with Southampton - not 'ok'

To improve on what Poch built there in his first two years in English football? Give him time.

He's got a lot of improvements to make, but at this stage I find it utterly ridiculous how people are jumping on his back, given the tosh we've had to put up with before...

Jumping on his back due to the performances they are witnessing and thoroughly deserved too.

 

[BlueToff]

I'm not saying I want him sacked. I'm just saying that i think you're wrong in saying he won't be sacked if we lose our next 3. I think it would definitely happen. To be honest, if he doesn't win any of the next 5 tho, then I'd get rid too. Not because I think he's a bad manager, but because if we get to that point, it categorically won't have worked out.

That said I'm confident we won't get to that stage, but it's a serious situation .

I don't think he'll get sacked before he's had at least another window - and nor should he be.

Mosh won't panic

 

[GrandOldTeam]

He won the Copa Del Rey with a team that were already in free fall hence why they sacked Flores. Anyway, Valencia is circus of a club and not one to use as a yard stick

And Martinez won the FA Cup with Wigan.

Koeman was moved on from 3 clubs in 3 seasons. Benfica, PSV and Valencia.

Whatever way we spin it - that's not a good sign.

 

[BlueToff]

Jumping on his back due to the performances they are witnessing and thoroughly deserved too.

But how do the players (that have been putting in these displays for nye on three years) get away with it mate?

We are fundamentally a mid-table side - based on the squad we have we're right about where we belong.

That needs to change, but the new manager needs more than 15 games to do that.

 

[MikeH72]

What are our players? like honestly what are they?

Any number of adjectives could be used to answer that question.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

I don't think he'll get sacked before he's had at least another window - and nor should he be.

Mosh won't panic

Moshiri: "He's Koeman. He does what he wants"

Hopefully no Sissoko or Kones to add to Bolasie balls up in January.

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

He needs time. He is working some of the most unprofessional players I've seen in years. They don't care. They downed tools under Martinez and some of them just can't seem to pick them back up again.

James McCarthy would rather leave and go to Newcastle in the Championship than fight for his place here.

I don't think we will see the best of Koeman till next season.

Even at the start of the season when we were winning games, Koeman said that we still were not at the right level or playing well enough. He has warned us for long enough. If anything the club let him down in the summer with the lack of signings. I expect a huge change in playing staff over the next two windows. A lot of the old guard, Jagielka etc will be shown the door too.

You can't expect miracles, just look at United and they've spent loads. Stop demanding instant success and just give it time.

Obviously he needs time, and we can't expect 'miracles' but 1 win in 10 league games mate (and I can't see where our next win is coming from) is not just down to the players.

 

[Blue Cheese]

But how do the players (that have been putting in these displays for nye on three years) get away with it mate?

We are fundamentally a mid-table side - based on the squad we have we're right about where we belong.

That needs to change, but the new manager needs more than 15 games to do that.

His first 15 they may be but they have been dreadful I don't care who he is or what his reputation is, the fact is he is under-performing quite substantially.

The players may not be as good as they or us thought but a good man manager would still motivate them, he seem to be lacking in that area for me, his man management skills just don't exist, he prefers to throw them under the bus than take responsibility.

 

[BlueToff]

Moshiri: "He's Koeman. He does what he wants"

Hopefully no Sissoko or Kones to add to Bolasie balls up in January.

It's all hypothetical though.

Sissoko would have been a much better option for central midfield than McCarthy/Clevs or an out of form Barkley.

He suits a high-intensity pressing style and thrived in a 4-3-3 at international level.

In short you can easily see the logic in that.

Similarly with Kone - he was excellent last season. He didn't replicate that form early this season but he'd still have added height, strength and speed to our one-paced defence.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

He's had 15 games. That is not enough time.

He inherited a mess.

That's like the tories blaming labour for the continuing austerity measures after being in government for 7 years.

He inherited a squad that really should be pressing for top 6 at the very least. We've struggled to break down each and every team we've played so far. That's just not good enough. We have yet to dominate a side for 45 minutes, nevermind a whole match. And the style of play's essentially the same in every match.

Our defence is abysmal (I thought koeman was gonna sort it, what with him being the defensive maestro he was as a player?!) and our attacking play the same.

£12m on Williams. A 32 year-old. We're no better for him, it appears. But then there's £28m on bolasie. If that wasn't enough to get the alarm bells ringing I don't know what is. I have very, very little faith in koeman, and fear he won't bring in the necessary reinforcements, especially at the correct (Not bolasie-type) amount. Not that they'll clamouring to sign in any case...

 

[GrandOldTeam]

He'd also benefit to referring to his team as "us" and "we" rather than "Everton"

But ok, that doesnt matter if we start to pick up points, have more good weekends than bad and stay in contention for europe most of the season.

 

[BlueToff]

His first 15 they may be but they have been dreadful I don't care who he is or what his reputation is, the fact is he is under-performing quite substantially.

The players may not be as good as they or us thought but a good man manager would still motivate them, he seem to be lacking in that are for me, his man management skills just don't exist, he prefers to throw them under the bus than take responsibility.

We had our best start ever mate, so they haven't all been dreadful.

We are on an awful run, and it has to have taught Koeman lessons.

I'm worried that he hasn't made simple changes (like switching the system) that has improved us, but equally so 15 games is not enough time.

We're 9th, not 19th. A new manager isn't getting sacked for that, with this squad (that has finished 11th two years running).

 

[ianefc]

And Martinez won the FA Cup with Wigan.

Koeman was moved on from 3 clubs in 3 seasons. Benfica, PSV and Valencia.

Whatever way we spin it - that's not a good sign.

You could argue that whatever he did in those spells prior to Southampton alerted the attention of the widely praised Les Reed.

I'm not in the mood to stick up for Koeman, but something must have been seen in him to have been given that job when Southampton were shedding 'star' players left, right and centre.

Also when rating his time at his previous clubs I'd suggest what he did at Southampton was more worthy of praise then what he did at Benfica/Valencia was worthy of criticism.

Only because the majority of us saw what was happening at Southampton yet by all accounts Valencia were a mess before and a mess long after.

 

[ToffeeTim]

I don't think he'll get sacked before he's had at least another window - and nor should he be.

Mosh won't panic

If we don't register any wins in our next 5 then we're in a relegation scrap, and to be honest that's unacceptable. Does Mosh back a manager who's left us fighting relegation? I strongly doubt it.

Anything above relegation fight was tolerable this season. If he lands us in one he deserves to go. It's a huge month coming up. And it's his responsibility to turn it round. I'd love nothing more than for us to shock the life out of me with 4 or 6 points in the incoming week.