Ronald Koeman discussion

[Dirty Dutch]

PSV - how did he have a disastrous run mate, he was their for just over 1 season - won the league in his only complete season in charge and then got head hunted by Valencia the following October - PSV went on to retain the title btw with Koemans team.

Feyenoord - as you say he was rbilliant at, arguably his greatest acheievement as a manager tbf.

Southampton - he was brilliant at, tok over a team guted both his seasons in charge and got them finishing higher and higher each season - and imprved on what Pocch did there as well.

Vitesse - done well and qualified foe Europe with an utter monnow

Ajax - won the league 2 out of his 3 full seaosns in charge, 4th season PSV had a blinding season and he payed the price for having a poor year. Overall - looking at his time in Ajax a comparrision could be made to how Mourinho and his tiem tends to go at a club, god three years then fourth season a bad one (given an abbrassive managerial style that can maybe be expected though unkless your Fergie)

AZ - he took over from a LVG at his peak, who at that time was a much better manager and more experienced - and AZ he couldnt get to reach that level that LVG had done, think from memory though the team was also basically gutted of all it's better players so was a poor choice to take them over mate.

Benfica - came third, won the cup, and reached the QF of the CL mate (losing to the winners Barca), and wasnt sacked but left to join PSV,

Valencia - the one job you can say was an unmitigated disater on his resume - but it was 9 years ago now, and he made the huge mistake of going head to head against a core of veteran players at the team and paid the price when they stopped playing for him, same situation happened with Chelsea last year with Mourinho and you saw the results of it mate.

As an interest the three players he wanted out the club which led to all the problems, one of them threathened to retire if he wasnt played every game, Canazres - he subsequently did at the end of the season when Valencia released him, another Abelda (the captain) sued the club to try to get out of his contract and publicly opened up on Koeman at a press conference (guven he was a huge fan favourite you can imagine how this turned the atmosphere poisonous with the fans for him) and Angulo who at that time in his career was basically finished as a player - went on to play one more season (badly) and only played about 15 games more before retiring.

As i said the situation seems very similar to the situation at Spurs when Pocch faced a split dressing room over the Adebeyor and Kane argument, only dfference being the majority of the Valencia team sided with the senior players (basically he badly misjudged the influence those 3 had) and Abelda was a cult here with them, meanwhilst at Spurs the fans got behind Pocc due to Kane and the younger spurs players backing

As an interesting point though heres a list of managers he has taken over from.

LVG - AZ
Hiddink- PSV
Trappatoni - Benfica
Pocc - Saints

some big boots to fill in each account there

Verry good summary. With ajax he also reached the quarter finals of the CL with a verry young squad. They got knocked out by a last minute goal against a Milan team with gatusso, pirlo, kaka, Seedorf at their best who won the CL later that year. he managed to get ajax through the groupstages with teams like arsenal(with Henry and bergkamp), Valencia and as roma. His teams were tactically always verry strong against the topsides and he always managed to get a good result against them( didnt lost against Arsenal).

And everywhere he played kids when they were good enough. Only saints fans were crying that he didnt do that when he left but the same fans are now saying that he was right and that those young players are not good enough.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

One thing I will say, the football leading up to winning the penalty was lovely stuff

Fluid passing, forward thinking and it paid off

I'm hoping that this is how Koeman has wanted us to play all along and he's just been trying to get us there

If so, I'm enthused

 

[nsno-chris]

Oh god zat is morphing into damo and is starting to tag dave into his posts

God have mercy

 

[deipnosophist]

Awwww diddums, did I hurt your feelings, bless you. Least I'm not a try hard eh, a boring unfunny one.

Koemans doing ok.

...oh, but you are. You are one of the more miserable contributors to the forum...boring, unfunny and, if not a try hard, most certainly trying.

Try to have a happy new year

 

[Blue Cheese]

...oh, but you are. You are one of the more miserable contributors to the forum...boring, unfunny and, if not a try hard, most certainly trying.

Try to have a happy new year

dull as dishwater you lad, dull as dishwater. I tell it like I see it, I don't copy others posting style in a vain attempt at humour and fail miserably. Haha, such a dullard.

Anyway Goodbye, that's enough of that in here.

 

[bluestevon]

Ajax -- Double first season / 3rd season also won...4th season 8 pts behind and quit in Feb after losing in Uefa Cup.

Note: Ajax had by far the best side in Holland, google their team!

Benfica-- Fans thought he was weird and he finished 3rd in a 3 horse race...won charity shield.

PSV -- Tanked the side Jan/Feb onwards and they were VERY lucky to win on the last day of the season with rivals losing at minnows to hand them the league.

Valencia -- It was David Albelda who was considered an experienced DM (like Barry) and still around the Spain side if im not wrong...Canizares and others were treated shamefully as he basically dropped them from the squad and didnt speak to them or phase them out + wouldnt allow them to leave so there were massive arguments with one or two asking to buy out their contracts. Hated and would have relegated them....never the same since his stint there and were my favourite spanish side to watch at the time.

AZ - just lol

Feyenoord -- Forced to play kids who actually had some great talents.

Southampton -- But ok. Almost sacked 12months ago.


Not exactly a great CV.

Was he sakced at Southampton mate, or did he in fact lead them to there best ever top flight season bar none? Isn't a true test of a manager how they deal with adversity btw, Kendall and Ferguson both came within a game or two of being sacked

PSV - they where very lucky to win on the last day of the season? who cares mate, they won the league do you think any fan cares about luck when you win a title, was their rival btw the same Ajax who only two years earleir had what you desribed as by far the best side in Holland?

Benfica fans though he was wierd, who cares what they thought, maybe Benfica fans are the koppites of Portugal for all we know and wanted him on match day to turn up in a full kit with shinnies on, and you ignored him getting Benfica into the QF of the CL mate?

AZ - took over from one of the best managers in the world and lost some of their best players, and truly Zat i'm guessing like me you didn't watch too many Az games that season - or ever in fact.

Ajax - won 2 leagues in 3 years, the double in one, they had by far the best side in Holland did they, i am guessing it was also a very young side with aa lot of young players given starring roles by the manager mate? who was that manager who trusted in those young players again btw
? and did he instead of playing them go and buy 27yo players from rival dutch teams to avoid playing these kids?


Valencia - Canizares threathened to rtire if he was dropped mate - is that profesional - imagine if Southall had done that and went public with it, Abelda publicly criticised the mager in a press conference, layed into him for treatment of 'senior' players (basically looking out for there own) which IMO is the equivalent of Gerrard ripping into a current liverpool manager - we would have slaughtered him for it and rightly so, doing that proved to me that koeman was 100% correct for wanting him out the team, way too much influence and way too unprofessional doing that, christ a captain suing the club to be allowed to leave should have seen the club sell him first opportunit.

 

[deipnosophist]

dull as dishwater you lad, dull as dishwater. I tell it like I see it, I don't copy others posting style in a vein attempt at humour and fail miserably. Haha, such a dullard.

sorry mouldy cheese, but only in your own mind are you anything but a journeyman contributor; a misery embracing, humourless non-entity.
You're the sort of curmudgeonly fan who sucks the joy out of football.

Please try and make this a happy New Year ...

...and if you cannot, please stay in your ward.

 

[nsno-chris]

Was he sakced at Southampton mate, or did he in fact lead them to there best ever top flight season bar none? Isn't a true test of a manager how they deal with adversity btw, Kendall and Ferguson both came within a game or two of being sacked

PSV - they where very lucky to win on the last day of the season? who cares mate, they won the league do you think any fan cares about luck when you win a title, was their rival btw the same Ajax who only two years earleir had what you desribed as by far the best side in Holland?

Benfica fans though he was wierd, who cares what they thought, maybe Benfica fans are the koppites of Portugal for all we know and wanted him on match day to turn up in a full kit with shinnies on, and you ignored him getting Benfica into the QF of the CL mate?

AZ - took over from one of the best managers in the world and lost some of their best players, and truly Zat i'm guessing like me you didn't watch too many Az games that season - or ever in fact.

Ajax - won 2 leagues in 3 years, the double in one, they had by far the best side in Holland did they, i am guessing it was also a very young side with aa lot of young players given starring roles by the manager mate? who was that manager who trusted in those young players again btw
? and did he instead of playing them go and buy 27yo players from rival dutch teams to avoid playing these kids?


Valencia - Canizares threathened to rtire if he was dropped mate - is that profesional - imagine if Southall had done that and went public with it, Abelda publicly criticised the mager in a press conference, layed into him for treatment of 'senior' players (basically looking out for there own) which IMO is the equivalent of Gerrard ripping into a current liverpool manager - we would have slaughtered him for it and rightly so, doing that proved to me that koeman was 100% correct for wanting him out the team, way too much influence and way too unprofessional doing that, christ a captain suing the club to be allowed to leave should have seen the club sell him first opportunit.

Would also add that Valencia is an absolute mess of a club and koeman went there to sweep the decks clean, unfortunately player power won.

 

[Khalekan]

Koeman may well be the greatest manager of all time, I think @davek @Khalekan and myself (and others) may have been quick to judge him...

Perhaps I have been blinded by my pure hatred of him due to his below average career so far wrecking teams along the way..however;

Any manager who can have a team playing this badly with no structure, no consistency and what appears to be poor management of game time for players with a long ball strategy...

But still get us to 7th....


Must be the Greatest Manager EVER!!!


Edit: However Pulis is right behind us so hes in good company.

Best 2 managers in the world!!!

What are you like, Zat lol

Happy New Year, pal

 

[bluestevon]

Would also add that Valencia is an absolute mess of a club and koeman went there to sweep the decks clean, unfortunately player power won.

Pretty sure we are seeing the benefits of what he learnt there in how he's handling phasing out senior players mate, few sweetner contacts to influential figures, gradually reducing there role as with Barry and jags, and bringing in a leader in Williams,who is his man.

 

[BlueToff]

One thing I will say, the football leading up to winning the penalty was lovely stuff

Fluid passing, forward thinking and it paid off

I'm hoping that this is how Koeman has wanted us to play all along and he's just been trying to get us there

If so, I'm enthused

This Mikey.

It required a lot of things to come together but yesterday even in the first half we saw flashes of decent stuff.

The key though has to be the system. Rom requires support, and it's evident that what we really need is a better alternative to Valencia to provide that, and allow us to play a 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 that doesn't isolate Rom.

I think we saw two really different examples of how Koeman wants us to play yesterday with the second and third goals.

Second, as you say, was lovely build up to the penalty incident, with Barks pulling the strings and Mirallas finding room in the final third, rather than on the half-way line.

Third, high pressure, a brilliant tackle and a superb first-time pass by Davies, and class finish from Rom.

Quick, incisive play.

 

[a bell maul]

You try so hard to be @Moomin or @Bungle but sorry you just do not pull it off, very boring, very boring indeed.

pot calling the kettle black here

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Yeah but Dave rates Lennon, he's said it ample times. He's woeful and always has been.

You hate Lennon beyond rational standards though mate

I think he's a useful squad player

You and Dave are on the extreme ends of the spectrum when it comes to Aaron

 

[Groucho]

Awwww diddums, did I hurt your feelings, bless you. Least I'm not a try hard eh, a boring unfunny one.

Koemans doing ok.

...oh, but you are. You are one of the more miserable contributors to the forum...boring, unfunny and, if not a try hard, most certainly trying.

Try to have a happy new year

Knock it of lads.

 

[Blue Cheese]

Knock it of lads.

I tried, I said goodbye he kept going, I have popped him on ignore, and deleted some unsavoury posts. Sorry.