Ronald Koeman discussion

[nsno-chris]

That's true, but my only concern is now that the options are better Koeman seems like he wants to shoehorn as many of them in as possible. Which I thought was to our detriment in the Boro/Spurs games.

I really wish we'd go back to the 3-5-2 to get some width in the side.

I get we're you're coming from, but apart from Spurs I think it's worked quite well. Boro, I'll disagree with, their defensive unit is very very well drilled, and they're quite dirty as well, they stopped us dead and will do the same to a few up there.

If you look at the Sunderland game again, watch how deep morgs goes back for the ball, when in possession the defence splits and he went deep and everything started from him, it gave us that same width with 3 CBS. When we lost possession then they closed up ranks and made it tight in the middle, with Gueye and Morgs then operating as the 2 holding players.

He has options now, but the run in will see if you're correct and he tries to shoehorn players in for the sake of it. It'll be interesting

 

[Nymzee]

McCarthy is back to fitness, Besic is on the cusp of that, Barry is so much on his last legs he's started most of our games this season including the last one. Davies has not been benched since he broke through and so we now have the spectacle of a manager playing FOUR CMs in one game in order to justify the madness of his transfer dealings.

Should have used that cash for Schneiderlin to buy Sigurdsson and this problem wouldn't have arisen.

So we sign Sigurdsson and bench Barkley or drop him further back into midfield creating just the same amount of numbers you're currently moaning about.

 

[davek]

Erm where did I use the word starters? I just said players we used in central midfield last season. Cleverley and Gibson may not have played much but neither has Besic or to an extent McCarthy this season. At the end of the day wherever they played they're all central midfielders.

Nice way of swerving reason though.

But STARTERS is the issue. If you have SIX players all chomping at the bit and expecting a start that places enormous pressure on you to accommodate them and that affects the way you set up...you saw that obviously in the last match against Spurs, and I dont think it'll be the last time we see four CMs shoe-horned into a starting line up either.

Koeman has made a rod for his own back here.

 

[Mountfield1985]

McCarthy is back to fitness, Besic is on the cusp of that, Barry is so much on his last legs he's started most of our games this season including the last one. Davies has not been benched since he broke through and so we now have the spectacle of a manager playing FOUR CMs in one game in order to justify the madness of his transfer dealings.

Should have used that cash for Schneiderlin to buy Sigurdsson and this problem wouldn't have arisen.

Sigurdsson would be a good signing, but there was no chance in hell Swansea were selling him in January when they were in a relegation scrap.

Schneiderlin was available, takes us up a level and is well worth the money in my opinion. It's good that Koeman's got a headache in centre mid, I hope we soon have those headaches all over the park.

I do agree in general that we are trying to crowbar too many central players into the team though. I understand why he tried to pack the midfield at Spurs but it clearly didn't work and I hope he's learnt from that.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

McCarthy is back to fitness, Besic is on the cusp of that, Barry is so much on his last legs he's started most of our games this season including the last one. Davies has not been benched since he broke through and so we now have the spectacle of a manager playing FOUR CMs in one game in order to justify the madness of his transfer dealings.

Should have used that cash for Schneiderlin to buy Sigurdsson and this problem wouldn't have arisen.

Dave, I admire you greatly, but even if we had signed Sigurdsson you'd have found a reason to have a problem with it somehow

We could sign Messi on a free and you'd probably find a way to blast Koeman for it (My money would be that you'd say he was too old)

Methinks the Orange doth protest too much

Allow Koeman into your heart, then he can start to make it better

xx

 

[nsno-chris]

McCarthy is back to fitness, Besic is on the cusp of that, Barry is so much on his last legs he's started most of our games this season including the last one. Davies has not been benched since he broke through and so we now have the spectacle of a manager playing FOUR CMs in one game in order to justify the madness of his transfer dealings.

Should have used that cash for Schneiderlin to buy Sigurdsson and this problem wouldn't have arisen.

McCarthy and Besic both have long standing injury problems, you cannot rely on them. Barry started games because we had no options other than the tosh of Gibson and Snivelly.

You're so blind with hatred it's unreal

And Sigurdsson is not the type of player we should be aiming for to unlock defences. He's found a team where he can get away with a one in five performance and they love him

 

[Nymzee]

But STARTERS is the issue. If you have SIX players all chomping at the bit and expecting a start that places enormous pressure on you to accommodate them and that affects the way you set up...you saw that obviously in the last match against Spurs, and I dont think it'll be the last time we see four CMs shoe-horned into a starting line up either.

Koeman has made a rod for his own back here.

But they're not all expecting to be starters? Besic hasn't played a minute under Koeman, Barry knows (Koeman has even said) he's not a guaranteed starter, McCarthy is just trying to stay fit at the minute, Davies is 18.

Gueye and Schneiderlin are the only two that will think they're back guaranteed starters when fit.

Let's get hypothetical now though as I'm intrigued. Imagine you're the current Everton manager and it's now summer 2017. Answer these:

1. How many central midfielders do you want playing in the game?
2. How many do you want in the squad?
3. Who do you let go?

And please stop bringing up the Spurs game. Everyone agrees it was poorly managed but it's not every game we use that many central midfielders is it.

 

[davek]

So we sign Sigurdsson and bench Barkley or drop him further back into midfield creating just the same amount of numbers you're currently moaning about.

No, no, no. Why do you drop Barkley with Sigurdsson's arrival?!?!

He could play up in a 3-4-3 with Barkley in an advanced midfield role.

 

[davek]

Sigurdsson would be a good signing, but there was no chance in hell Swansea were selling him in January when they were in a relegation scrap.

Schneiderlin was available, takes us up a level and is well worth the money in my opinion. It's good that Koeman's got a headache in centre mid, I hope we soon have those headaches all over the park.

I do agree in general that we are trying to crowbar too many central players into the team though. I understand why he tried to pack the midfield at Spurs but it clearly didn't work and I hope he's learnt from that.

I honestly think it;s a mess and that Spurs last week is the beginning of it as a selection dilemma.

 

[davek]

Dave, I admire you greatly, but even if we had signed Sigurdsson you'd have found a reason to have a problem with it somehow

We could sign Messi on a free and you'd probably find a way to blast Koeman for it (My money would be that you'd say he was too old)

Methinks the Orange doth protest too much

Allow Koeman into your heart, then he can start to make it better

xx

...nah, nah, nah, na, na, na, na....

 

[Mountfield1985]

I get we're you're coming from, but apart from Spurs I think it's worked quite well. Boro, I'll disagree with, their defensive unit is very very well drilled, and they're quite dirty as well, they stopped us dead and will do the same to a few up there.

If you look at the Sunderland game again, watch how deep morgs goes back for the ball, when in possession the defence splits and he went deep and everything started from him, it gave us that same width with 3 CBS. When we lost possession then they closed up ranks and made it tight in the middle, with Gueye and Morgs then operating as the 2 holding players.

He has options now, but the run in will see if you're correct and he tries to shoehorn players in for the sake of it. It'll be interesting

Yeah good points. I just feel we found a formation that seemed to really suit us in the 3-5-2, and we've changed to accomodate the central players. Personal preference on my part maybe, but either way it's good to see the manager trying different things.

It'll be interesting to see how we set up to break down WBA tomorrow.

 

[Nymzee]

No, no, no. Why do you drop Barkley with Sigurdsson's arrival?!?!

He could play up in a 3-4-3 with Barkley in an advanced midfield role.

I never said to drop Barkley I was asking what you'd do if he signed. Sigurdsson, Rom, Ross up top? 2 central midfielders?

Sounds good, but you're acting like January just gone was the last ever transfer window. We might sign him in the summer and have Gueye/Morgan behind them. Would love that team myself.

 

[davek]

McCarthy and Besic both have long standing injury problems, you cannot rely on them. Barry started games because we had no options other than the tosh of Gibson and Snivelly.

You're so blind with hatred it's unreal

And Sigurdsson is not the type of player we should be aiming for to unlock defences. He's found a team where he can get away with a one in five performance and they love him

Ha Ha Ha Ha ha.

WHAT?!?!

You have seen the feller play haven't you?

'kin ell.

 

[Mountfield1985]

I honestly think it;s a mess and that Spurs last week is the beginning of it as a selection dilemma.

Selection dilemma's aren't a bad thing. The amount of competition we have in central areas is fantastic. The aim should be to build that level of competition in all areas of the pitch, not moan about our strongest area.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

No, no, no. Why do you drop Barkley with Sigurdsson's arrival?!?!

He could play up in a 3-4-3 with Barkley in an advanced midfield role.

Robles
Williams, Funes Mori, Holgate
Coleman, ???, ???, Baines
Siggy Stardust, Rom, Barkley

So we'd have McCarthy, Besic, Barry, Davies and Gana to put in that middle slot

Barry has shown that he'll always struggle against the top sides now
Gana was in Africa
Besic was injured and will likely be again
McCarthy was injured and will likely be again

Come on Dave, that's a ludicrous lack of depth in the middle

The 3-5-2 with

Robles
Williams, Funes Mori, Holgate
Coleman, Gana, Schneiderlin, Davies, Baines
Barkley, Rom

Makes so much more sense

Replace Funes Mori with an actual defender and bring in some cover to rotate in for Baines and that's a very good side