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Ronald Koeman discussion

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davek said:
Precisely, and where are they now? Languishing at other clubs, in the U23s or benched forever.
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We 'should' have:

Coleman / Williams / Mori / Baines
Kenny / Holgate / Galloway / Connolly

Or similar and after one poor game swap in the young player. The only one this season who would be a mainstay would be Williams.

Same in midfield...Barry and Gana with Davies to slot in.

Holgate and Davies should be in for swansea at least.
 
neil999 said:
BTW @davek you are in danger of the majority agreeing with you lol
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Well, if they agree with me then they feel that Koeman is a decent enough manager but that we in no way shape or form should be on our knees thankful we have him. He's achieved nothing as a manager and he has to prove to us that he's a manager who can do it with us.

Too much fawning gone on around Koeman. He has changed nothing fundamentally, despite all the BS claims that defensive basket case is now rehabilitated.
 
neil999 said:
Yeah the top 5 are frightening...and utd and spurs squads are miles ahead of us

Reality bites
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And they didn't have a negative net spend in the summer. Their squads have been enhanced after each window, even allowing for moshiri coming to the club and a new TV deal to have a negative net spend is criminal. We are were we deserve to be in the league.
 
davek said:
Well, if they agree with me then they feel that Koeman is a decent enough manager but that we in no way shape or form should be on our knees thankful we have him. He's achieved nothing as a manager and he has to prove to us that he's a manager who can do it with us.

Too much fawning gone on around Koeman. He has changed nothing fundamentally, despite all the BS claims that defensive basket case is now rehabilitated.
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Serious question, who did you want as manager? Who realistically did you want and would come to a team that had finished 11th in successive seasons.
 
rochdaleblue said:
Serious question, who did you want as manager? Who realistically did you want and would come to a team that had finished 11th in successive seasons.
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Koeman. I said so too.

I still think he's a safe pair of hands for us. That doesn't mean I see the emperor's new clothes though.

He's decent, he could be very good. At the moment he just looks like he'll be decent: pragmatic and a bit dull but getting midtable or slightly above.
 

rochdaleblue said:
And they didn't have a negative net spend in the summer. Their squads have been enhanced after each window, even allowing for moshiri coming to the club and a new TV deal to have a negative net spend is criminal. We are were we deserve to be in the league.
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Liverpool did...oh no
 
Zatara said:
We 'should' have:

Coleman / Williams / Mori / Baines
Kenny / Holgate / Galloway / Connolly

Or similar and after one poor game swap in the young player. The only one this season who would be a mainstay would be Williams.

Same in midfield...Barry and Gana with Davies to slot in.

Holgate and Davies should be in for swansea at least.
Click to expand...
For me the answer isn't kids anymore. I'm tired of waiting on potential. Only Holgate of those youngsters you list looks like he could perform immediately . We need quality players throughout the team. I'm fed up going to matches saying he could be good ,I want to walk away saying he IS brilliant. Throwing unproven youngsters in is just more shoestring management,I thought this was over, Ha Ha.
 
I think he & us as fans underestimated the difficulty of the job be has. I thought 'theres good players there and he will get more out of them', this clearly isnt the case & he's working with utter dross. People questioned some of our summer signings but they've been our best players alonside Lukaku & Barry. The rest are utter dross and i wouldnt care if they were all flogged.
 
Eggsyblueskin said:
For me the answer isn't kids anymore. I'm tired of waiting on potential. Only Holgate of those youngsters you list looks like he could perform immediately . We need quality players throughout the team. I'm fed up going to matches saying he could be good ,I want to walk away saying he IS brilliant. Throwing unproven youngsters in is just more shoestring management,I thought this was over, Ha Ha.
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We cant sign top players so need to develop them. These are England youth internationals and looked prem standard already.

We havent brought through potential since Ball, Dunne and Jeffers...only Unsworth vs Norwich which was great.
 
Its time for a clear out. For whatever reason the majority of players either are not good enough to reach the top, have an inferiority complex or lack the brains and know how to adapt to new formations and tactics.

At present the only players in and around the first team i wouldn't want to go are Williams, Holgate ( i think there is a top player in there) Gana, Barry and Lukaku. All the rest are fair game to go. Send Davies out on loan to the championship and see how he develops. All the rest can jog on and we rebuild in the next few windows.
 

Zatara said:
We cant sign top players so need to develop them. These are England youth internationals and looked prem standard already.

We havent brought through potential since Ball, Dunne and Jeffers...only Unsworth vs Norwich which was great.
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Yes ,let's develop them ,let's watch them making mistakes on their way to a career for Rotherham,costing us points as they go. Oh and let's enjoy the one or two that are any good, leave for a top club as soon as they can. I'm working under the premise that we may have money,laughable I know. If we haven't then mid table obscurity livened up by occasional relegation battles will be our lot for the foreseeable regardless of snot nosed kids or gormless managers. Becoming the modern day Crewe Alexandria , developing players for the top clubs to benefit from doesn't interest me, sorry.
 
Zatara said:
We cant sign top players so need to develop them. These are England youth internationals and looked prem standard already.

We havent brought through potential since Ball, Dunne and Jeffers...only Unsworth vs Norwich which was great.
Click to expand...

Eh? Rooney, Osman, Barkley, Rodwell, (ish, but we got a few bob), arguably Stones, and probably 1/2 dozen more that I cant remember.
 
Yes. Get rid and start again.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/spor...ws/ronald-koeman-wasting-time-trying-12135263

Is Ronald Koeman wasting his time trying to transform this Everton squad?

Phil Kirkbride believes the humiliation at Stamford Bridge exposed a serious underlying issue for the Blues

Antonio Conte was bang on the money when he pinpointed Everton ’s downfall to the moment they decided to create “man-to-man situations” - because this was men versus boys.

This was fast versus slow. Strong versus weak and the right attitude versus the wrong one.

It felt like a Premier League team against one from the Championship.

Sure, Chelsea are a very good team and made a statement of intent by going top of the league with this merciless slaying but they didn’t just expose the gulf in class and quality - they exposed the chasm that exists in the fundamentals.

Working hard, running yourself into the ground, competing, challenging for 50-50s, blood, sweat, tears and bravery.

Not tricks, flicks, turns, 35-yard screamers and rabonas but the stuff that should be a given, but in too many of Everton’s players isn’t.

READ MORE
Chelsea 5-0 Everton
The question is, will it ever be found in them?

And while Ronald Koeman spoke about his players being taught a “big lesson” by Chelsea you left Stamford Bridge wondering if some will ever learn to play how he wants.

Eleven games into the new Premier League season and the Everton boss, win, lose or draw, is still having to use phrases like “aggression”, “winning second balls”, “run”, “work” and “mentality”.

It set the alarm bells ringing when he spoke about one of the differences at Stamford Bridge being “hunger” and it’s clear that Everton need to rediscover old fashioned English football values to be able to compete at the top of the English game again.

Koeman could easily have thrown in “leadership” and “spirit” after yesterday’s drubbing.

4221396001_5198722061001_5198719798001-vs.jpg


CLICK TO PLAY
PHIL KIRKBRIDE ON THE EVERTON DEFEAT AT STAMFORD BRIDGE

Everton are currently good enough to overawe most of the teams in the bottom half of the table, as well as a few in the top half, but when they face the elite sides in the division they risk being give the runaround or, as they did on Saturday night, risk being run over.

You either approach the Premier League like Manchester City and Arsenal, and try and pass your way to the top, or you do what Chelsea are doing, what Spurs do and what Leicester City did last season.

Koeman wants that.

He wants to build a team of athletes, big, strong powerful players who, if absolutely nothing else and on afternoons when they are up against it or having off days, will battle, scrap, run and work to make life as hard as possible for the opposition.

Consider what he recently said about the state of players from his homeland. “Physically, we are losing a lot in Holland because we had too much of ‘always about football’ and we lost a little bit the workrate of players and the physical strengths of the players.

“And if you are not physically strong then you need to be a very good player.”
 

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