2024/25 Sean Dyche

[GrandOldTeam]

Great counter point TBF. My gripe with Dyche currently is about the new players rather than Dixon, but you could theoretically extend this to Dixon (with less justification).

My gripe with Dyche surrounds the team he picked on Saturday and leaving out O'Brien, Lindstrom and N'Diaye - all signed to address issues within the squad, all players Dyche signed off on signing - and picking players who we know have limitations (otherwise we wouldn't have signed the new ones) and benching all the new ones barring the young lad from Villa who'd have been on the bench if Garner was fit. That's where I have a beef. He signed off on these players and didn't pick any of them and yet we should be surprised when the issues of last season were apparent on Saturday too.

Dixon is a kid who came through the system that Dyche has never had any input into signing. I have less of an issue with him preferring what he already has at his disposal in that context.

Did he mate?

 

[NathDogg]

You said he deserved a chance. Based on what? I'm not even doubting the kid, but saying he deserves a shot means he's done something to earn that. He hasn't, or he likely would have been in the squad this past week.

It's not just because he's inexperienced, if he was good enough right this second he would be playing.

I understand I'm going against the grain here, but it's just nonsense to expect this kid to do any better at Tottenham who scored 74 goals last season.

No one is holding him back. Dyche will act in self interest, if he feels he can do the job he'll play him. It's more likely we'll see a back three this weekend.

"All he needs is a chance" is a false premise, and a tiring one at that. We've seen countless times evidence of this, yet it still persists.

So is "he can't be any worse than x." Based on what?

He deserves a chance based on what our options are at this time. tbf I can take young starting ahead of Dixon, but in no universe should holgate be coming in ahead of the kid.

Same argument goes for O’Brien, and it highlights Dyches limitations.

You say no one is holding him back - I disagree.

Dyche is holding O’Brien back, he’s doing the same with Dixon chucking him out of the squad when he’s played pre-season.

Unless you’re recovering from a full frontal lobotomy, Dyche held back branthwaite for his mate Keane last season, and he hasn’t changed his spots. He played Keane ahead of a fit Mina the season before, with disastrous results.

Dyche won’t act in self interest - he’s a stubborn idiot, who only changed to Mina and Tarks then branthwaite and Tarks because his pal Keane had gave him no room to do anything else.

I don’t think Dixon or O’Brien would be any worse than those selected, based on my eyes seeing Keane/holgate/young make total arses of themselves for a good number of seasons.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

He deserves a chance based on what our options are at this time. tbf I can take young starting ahead of Dixon, but in no universe should holgate be coming in ahead of the kid.

It's because Holgate will be starting vs Spurs - some minutes.

Same argument goes for O’Brien, and it highlights Dyches limitations.

You say no one is holding him back - I disagree.

Dyche is holding O’Brien back, he’s doing the same with Dixon chucking him out of the squad when he’s played pre-season.

Unless you’re recovering from a full frontal lobotomy, Dyche held back branthwaite for his mate Keane last season, and he hasn’t changed his spots. He played Keane ahead of a fit Mina the season before, with disastrous results.

No, he didn't.

Branthwaite was injured/late in pre-season. Second he was fit, he was in.

Lot of sticks to hit Dyche with - his handling of Branthwaite absolutely isn't one of them. Especially when fans were cry arsing for us to sign Coady to block his path to the team.

 

[JLW]

Dyche will be punted from this club the minute we have someone to do it who's interested.

I cant wait for that day.

 

[NathDogg]

The flip argument to this...

Dyche sees Young, Holgate and Dixon in training. If you were him and you could see day in, day out that Holgate and Young are better than Dixon, why would we expect him to pick Dixon?

In fact, if that were the case, I'd be livid at him for doing that just to appease the fan base.

I really don’t get this sees them in training. I’ve seen enough of holgate to know he’s garbage. Young is just too old now, sadly.

Holgate and Young probably got the nod because they finished gaffers day better than the young lad or something, knowing Dyche.

I wouldn’t be livid at him for trying something different to his usual failed methods of picking known crap players.

 

[toffeeblue9]

Who looked better or at least competent in preseason? Even if Dixon can't do anything more than run faster and defend 1v1, that's improvement on Ash.

The only thing people want is for Dyche to stop persisting with garbage we already know doesn't work. Take a risk from time to time...

I hate making this argument because seeing Young in the team infuriates me, but again the unknown isn't always better than a negative known. In fact it very, very often isn't.

There's a balance here between desperation and wanting better.

E.g. When Rondon was stinking the gaff out as a lone striker for Benitez, Dobbin wouldn't have done any better, regardless of what people thought because he wasn't a striker. You might as well have argued Coleman should play there.

It's an age old thing with young players. As fans we say we should throw them in because they MUST be better than the rubbish weve been seeing, but actually experience should tell us that isn't the case at all. Even half the kids who do actually get thrown in don't end up being anywhere near good enough and thats after the manager has deemed them worth a try.

I hate seeing Young, Keane, Holgate, Maupay and one or two others in the team, but I'm not going to sit here and say that we should play the kids ahead of them when we have zero knowledge about the level they're at.

It's classic magic beans stuff and it's a well-documented psychological phenomenon. The unknown must be better than something we don't like. Actually, it usually isn't.

 

[toffeeblue9]

Did he mate?

According to Thelwell, he would never sign a player that the manager didn't agree to.

Further than that, perhaps you know more than me?

 

[GrandOldTeam]

Dyche will be punted from this club the minute we have someone to do it who's interested.

I cant wait for that day.

I reckon if I searched your posts, Oct/Nov you're saying we need to stick with Lampard. Then you'll be saying in December we're cooked/going down so need to sack him. I reckon you have us down as relegated before Dyche.

We're a fickle bunch, but we'd do well to be less entitled and acknowledge the job he has done.

 

[NathDogg]

It's because Holgate will be starting vs Spurs - some minutes.



No, he didn't.

Branthwaite was injured/late in pre-season. Second he was fit, he was in.

Lot of sticks to hit Dyche with - his handling of Branthwaite absolutely isn't one of them. Especially when fans were cry arsing for us to sign Coady to block his path to the team.

Holgate shouldn’t be starting at spurs or anywhere else, minutes shouldn’t matter.

I disagree about branthwaite, he was held back for Keane, as was Mina the season before.

Let’s see what Dyche does in the next few games to see if he’s learned any lessons…..

 

[Thomasc]

I can’t believe for one minute that there is another manager in the PL who would have played both Keane and Young on Saturday.

You are supposed to progress each season, not regress and start the following season with players long past their sell by date and a player you deemed not good enough last season.

He’s no new ideas at all. Total one trick pony with one style of leadership and one style of football.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

According to Thelwell, he would never sign a player that the manager didn't agree to.

Further than that, perhaps you know more than me?

And often, managers will give the same lip service. Not convinced, personally.

I said this yesterday;

We'll never know.

But do you think Dyche knew who Chermiti was? Do you think Dyche wanted Iroegbunam and it was a happy coincidence of a FFP swindle? Is Dyche calling for us to sign Danjuma when we wanted him before he was manager? Is Dyche saying lash nearly £20m at Textors best mate O'Brien to then put him on the bench behind Keane? Do we think Dyche wants Gnonto even though we've been trying to sign him since long before him?

To me, reading between the lines - I think Dyche is a passenger on recruitment.

 

[Papa Shango]

Holgate shouldn’t be starting at spurs or anywhere else, minutes shouldn’t matter.

I disagree about branthwaite, he was held back for Keane, as was Mina the season before.

Let’s see what Dyche does in the next few games to see if he’s learned any lessons…..

You can disagree all you want about the Branthwaite thing, you are still wrong! He literally missed out on one game!

 

[JLW]

I hate making this argument because seeing Young in the team infuriates me, but again the unknown isn't always better than a negative known. In fact it very, very often isn't.

There's a balance here between desperation and wanting better.

E.g. When Rondon was stinking the gaff out as a lone striker for Benitez, Dobbin wouldn't have done any better, regardless of what people thought because he wasn't a striker. You might as well have argued Coleman should play there.

It's an age old thing with young players. As fans we say we should throw them in because they MUST be better than the rubbish weve been seeing, but actually experience should tell us that isn't the case at all. Even half the kids who do actually get thrown in don't end up being anywhere near good enough and thats after the manager has deemed them worth a try.

I hate seeing Young, Keane, Holgate, Maupay and one or two others in the team, but I'm not going to sit here and say that we should play the kids ahead of them when we have zero knowledge about the level they're at.

It's classic magic beans stuff and it's a well-documented psychological phenomenon. The unknown must be better than something we don't like. Actually, it usually isn't.

I see it like this.

Holgate Young will give us a 3 to 5/10 performance week in week out and wont improve.

A young kid might give you the same or better and has room for improvement.

When the bar is set so low regarding who your leaving out of the team its no lose situation.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

Holgate shouldn’t be starting at spurs or anywhere else, minutes shouldn’t matter.

I disagree about branthwaite, he was held back for Keane, as was Mina the season before.

Let’s see what Dyche does in the next few games to see if he’s learned any lessons…..

No, he really wasn't. Someone else said this in the past - it just isn't true;

Nah no chance mate - it was Branthwaite who wasn't fit when he was on the bench at the start of the season. He missed a bit of pre-season. Both the manager and player said so at the time, and after the event.

There's sticks to beat Dyche with, but it's definitely not Branthwaite. He ensured the pathway was there and has played him every opportunity when he's been fit.

Also;

Towards the end of that campaign there were claims PSV would seek to make his move permanent. Asked whether the Dutch club indicated its interest to him, Dyche said: “Not to me. I was making it clear he wouldn’t be a player who was available. I knew there were certain players who had to leave the building, whether I wanted them to leave or not, we had to bring down the wage bill a little bit. So I made it clear - ‘no he’s one I want to be in the building and I see development in him’.”

He was definitely injured/wasnt deemed fully fit - Branthwaite himself said it. Dyche said a few times he was a few weeks behind others in pre-season.

When fans were screaming for us to sign Coady - others, including Dyche, evidently knew they had Branthwaite.

The second he was fit, he was straight in.

"He was very unfortunate in pre-season," Dyche tells Sky Sports.

"He missed two-and-a-half weeks of pre-season. That would have maybe given him the opportunity to push on and start the season." As it was, Branthwaite only had to sit out the first two fixtures, both defeats. He has been a fixture in the team ever since.

"Once he got fit, he has taken the chance."

 

[Papa Shango]

I can’t believe for one minute that there is another manager in the PL who would have played both Keane and Young on Saturday.

You are supposed to progress each season, not regress and start the following season with players long past their sell by date and a player you deemed not good enough last season.

He’s no new ideas at all. Total one trick pony with one style of leadership and one style of football.

Who else was he going to play at right back? We don't have anybody to play there right now.

I mean he very may well have played him even if everybody was available but he was the only player available.