Which, for England, is a major achievement.
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Semifinals: Croatia vs England
- Thread starter ilikecheese
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RedNotLikelyToPost
Player Valuation: £225k
I didn’t fancy having to play Russia in Russia with all the momentum and fan excitement behind them, so am pleased it’s Croatia.
That they’ve had to go to penalties in each of the last 2 games is a positive for England, but they are without doubt the most talented side we’ve come up against so far.
The good thing is they’re not really playing up to that talent.
Their major strength is midfield and we saw in the Colombia game that we can struggle in the middle with Henderson, Alli and Lingard as there’s too much attacking intent and it leaves Henderson exposed, and his flaws (athleticism and speed) are highlighted.
I’d suggest bringing in Delph for lingard, as he’s a halfway house between him and dier, who seems to have gone backwards in his development as a midfielder.
I didn’t see much to be scared of last night, or on their last game, so England has every chance.
I think it’ll be 2-1, possibly in extra time.
That they’ve had to go to penalties in each of the last 2 games is a positive for England, but they are without doubt the most talented side we’ve come up against so far.
The good thing is they’re not really playing up to that talent.
Their major strength is midfield and we saw in the Colombia game that we can struggle in the middle with Henderson, Alli and Lingard as there’s too much attacking intent and it leaves Henderson exposed, and his flaws (athleticism and speed) are highlighted.
I’d suggest bringing in Delph for lingard, as he’s a halfway house between him and dier, who seems to have gone backwards in his development as a midfielder.
I didn’t see much to be scared of last night, or on their last game, so England has every chance.
I think it’ll be 2-1, possibly in extra time.
Croatia peaked too soon with their win over the Argies, and have stumbled through since then. England look like a team that's growing in stature by each game. Destiny awaits, I vaguely remember being upstairs in bed when England won in 66, I wouldn't mind watching them in a final.
Chris O'Connor
Player Valuation: £35m
Southgate really went up in my estimation for taking what was a gamble against Belgium's second string - (which we lost to finish second in the group) even if it was very much a strategically justified one and one he really had to take imo.
Gareth gambled by resting almost his entire team against Belgium's second string, he could easily have tried to maintain 'momentum' with an easier last sixteen tie against Japan in prospect and field a stronger team (indeed many here were posting he should definitely have done just that and maintaining that any people proposing any alternative plan were just deluded) but it's paid off big time.
Lots of England managers have failed before we know that, a few have reached the quarters or better but only a very select few the semis or better, in fact only Ramsey and Robson.
Southgate despite having a young side, one which is likely to be far better in future tournaments, in two and four years time, has seized the chance to take this side beyond any realistic pre-tournament expectations. He's now achieved that and the gamble has produced the results hoped for. He gambled for a reason and it didn't involve games against Brazil or France.
The side has obvious defensive frailties and lacks an effective central playmaker normally so needed in tournament football, an English one doesn't exist atm and Gareth can't simply magic one up, he's not a club manager and he can't just buy one.
Suddenly, and perhaps quite unexpectedly, a freak of the draw offered this side, one so lacking in so many ways, a unique opportunity to reach a stage way beyond its capabilities would normally merit.
This was possibly a once in a lifetime and life changing opportunity that has put Southgate's name in the same bracket as Bobby Robson. He's now achieved this and could even go better.
He could have tried to take the nice easy safe option and aimed to put a ceiling, an upper limit on England's best possible outcome, one of beating Japan even if probably exposed by Brazil. He could have played more or less his strongest team and tried to beat a second string Belgium and gone on to maybe beat Japan, not a certainty either.
He instead thought strategically, recognised the opportunity such a massively lopsided draw had given him, it was so stark, it was absolutely unique, it had never broken this way before, it had just never ever happened before.
He was risking the gleeful 'told you so's' of all the hindsight merchants, all the press who win both ways and the usual friendly souls who always predict or wish the worst possible catastrophe on any England manager, the chippy and those Scots who support anyone England play. To be such a one isn't a good look.
He had to go for it and did
To come back now and slate him for not achieving anything as the route was easier is not just unfair, it's patently ludicrous.
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twoblue
Player Valuation: £35m
Yeah, I hate it when people actually enjoy things going well at football. When we could all be smearing ourselves in our own crap and picking flaws in the national team reaching the SEMI FINAL of a World Cup. They would be far more enjoyable.
England have been better than the teams they have played. Apart from Belgium... and another day we would still have a chance with them.
In 2014 England finished bottom of their group and didn’t win a game.
In 2018 we’ve at worst got to the semi finals, scored 6 in one match, won a penalty shootout, currently have the leading goal scorer and an Everton goalkeeper is making worldie saves.
Impressive progress even if you accept there have been large dollops of luck and so am going to take the glass half full approach ...or slightly more
In 2018 we’ve at worst got to the semi finals, scored 6 in one match, won a penalty shootout, currently have the leading goal scorer and an Everton goalkeeper is making worldie saves.
Impressive progress even if you accept there have been large dollops of luck and so am going to take the glass half full approach ...or slightly more
Think your overestimating the call, it wasn't some master plan, he rested players and then one reserve team outclassed another. I agree with the call, rest was the most important thing, but he's not a mastermind for being second best
They've beaten 3 very poor teams and drawn with an okay team missing it's best playerIn 2014 England finished bottom of their group and didn’t win a game.
In 2018 we’ve at worst got to the semi finals, scored 6 in one match, won a penalty shootout, currently have the leading goal scorer and an Everton goalkeeper is making worldie saves.
Impressive progress even if you accept there have been large dollops of luck and so am going to take the glass half full approach ...or slightly more
But we usually don’t beat very poor teams by 6 or OK teams even if they are missing their best player!
And the penality shootout win is a huge physiological improvement.
It's not really though, it's something you chance your way through, it's not the 4 minute mile, the 3 teams England have beaten are league 2 standard at best, you all need to chill and stop smashing ambos
Think we might be coming home sooner than we think yano lads.
Chris O'Connor
Player Valuation: £35m
A manager can only do so much and talk up a win while quietly dropping everyone who is liable to make that happen, it's true he didnt actually tell his reserves to not try or go out and lose, that would undermine the whole squad and seriously be wrong, but nevertheless he thought resting so many the correct choice.
To turn the tables, he could have played his first team and gone for the win.
Lauded for being confident
Lauded for playing in the right spirit (throwing a game is something those pesky foreigners do).
Lauded for keeping momentum going
If he played the first team and lost then he’d have been criticised for risking their confidence.
So this could have meant possibly losing confidence even with a win resulting in a tougher half of the draw. On the plus side, we did the honourable thing AND got the easier side of the draw.
Play the reserves, keep players fit, keep everyone involved.
Win with the reserves - risky decision re draw chances but he’s honourable and we keep momentum.
Play the reserves and lose - momentum isn’t an issue in this scenario and we get the easy draw.
So to a massive extent, Southgate couldn’t lose.
Whatever the choice and the outcome, it could have been spun positively.
You can't completely ignore what Gareth has at his disposal even if they lack in so many areas, he can't just pick better or even foreign players, he's not a club manager so he's stuck with selecting the best English qualified players he can.
If this results in the best he can possibly pick being somewhat short of the usual standard required to win tournaments then that is the reality, he can't alter that shortcoming, he hasn't a magic formula.
He then has to make use of every strategy he can and plan ahead for a future where they may have better resources. The planning is well on the way and a route back to sustained improvement has been mapped, one that stretches well beyond just this team and this world cup.
St George's Park and all associated with it was so often laughed at and derided as a sure and expensive failure. Gareth has been involved in the expansion of the age group sides whereas there are now four in all, with the same possession based playing style, all being very competitive in tournament football too.
For the first time for decades England's age group teams below senior level are winning world cups or getting to semis, last year was a truly golden year.
Gareth Southgate has a plan and a way of playing, he has the ideas and formula if not yet all the personnel to fit. He has to make the best of what he has but be ready to introduce better players when (hopefully) the opportunity comes.
These players and this side will be better in two and four years and those below promise more.
It is right to call a semi-final or final success with this side - one so imperfect and by merit not at all really suited for high honours, he has used stratagems and has grabbed every chance of luck and circumstance to his advantage as any good planner should, to achieve as much with a side carrying such low expectations and 'just not ready' is extremely notable indeed.
To say anything different is just to miss the point completely as well as being ridiculously perverse and extremely churlish.
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I'm not gonna read that essay Chris, I sincerely hope you enjoy the world cup as it's been thrilling, but the idea of some kind of meta tactics from Southgate is laughable, good day sir
Even if it is all luck I wish we’d had some more of it in past World Cups!
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