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Steven Naismith though.

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I dont think he gets any treatment off the opposition right now, tbh. He isn't one of those players who opposing bosses tell their players to keep under wraps. He's aided by that ability he has at present to fly under the radar. If they do look more closely and decide to neutralise him they could do it very easily is my guess, and he doesn't have another power game that could counter that move.

That's basically what happened at the end yesterday. Nessi is very good at 'linking' the play, but he can't hold it up and hasn't got the pace to turn a man and get in behind. So when he was our only outlet for the last 15 yesterday, then we started getting deeper and ultimately threw it away. That's not to say it was Naismith's fault, it's just he's a very specialist player - he's perfect as a second-striker who'll link up play and make runs and get into good positions. He hasn't got the attributes to be a loan forward.
 
That's basically what happened at the end yesterday. Nessi is very good at 'linking' the play, but he can't hold it up and hasn't got the pace to turn a man and get in behind. So when he was our only outlet for the last 15 yesterday, then we started getting deeper and ultimately threw it away. That's not to say it was Naismith's fault, it's just he's a very specialist player - he's perfect as a second-striker who'll link up play and make runs and get into good positions. He hasn't got the attributes to be a loan forward.
It's why he's vulnerable to the return of Barkley and why he's seen as a square peg in a round hole at Everton. We dont play two up and he'll be squeezed when Ross returns.


I maintain his role really is off the bench. We could go a different system like we did yesterday but I thought we looked like a team that was pretty blunt with Lukaku out wide.
 
It's why he's vulnerable to the return of Barkley and why he's seen as a square peg in a round hole at Everton. We dont play two up and he'll be squeezed when Ross returns.


I maintain his role really is off the bench. We could go a different system like we did yesterday but I thought we looked like a team that was pretty blunt with Lukaku out wide.

I think we looked 'blunt' more because of how we sat-back 2nd half though. 1st half we were knocking it about brilliantly and getting in good positions. We were incredibly stupid to sit back yesterday, the subs could've probably been done earlier and we needed players who were gonna get about like Besic so we could press high.

Against opposition where we play this 4-3-1-2 formation and counter-attack, Naismith is the best option. Against teams where the onus is on us , Barkely (if fit) would play. He'd have won us the game yesterday and he'll be a huge miss for us. Not exactly an easy player to replace either!
 

He can lay a ball off very efficiently, but he lacks vision in terms of penetrating passes and he cant really pick the ball up and drive at teams - qualities you need in his position at a top four pushing club. He's doing bits and pieces out there that seem to be adding up to something more than the sum of their parts these days though.

Thomas Muller doesn't have any of those qualities either, yet he's still incredibly effective. If Naismith can play the Muller role for us then that's great. The Germans showed in the World Cup that it isn't the squad with the best individual players that wins, but the one with the best collective unit.
 
I honestly think he's one of the best 'second strikers' in the league at the moment. His link-up play, heading, jumping, general positioning and finishing are superb. But, like you said, he doesn't really have the vision and he isn't someone who's going to pick up a ball on the turn and scare the oppo sh1tless! But still, he's gonna bag 15 this season I reckon.


There was a lot about Naismith that reminded me of Tim at the peak o his powers yesterday. High praise indeed. When Rom made his break for the second goal, I was screaming for him to pass to Naismith and not Mirallas.

Best slotter in the club.
 
Delighted with the way Naisy has turned things around. Being brutally honest, at right wing, he was absolutely horrific. I genuinely don't think he was at Championship standard, other than the odd glimpses of quality he showed popping up in the box at the right moment.

He's now being played in his proper position and is proving all the doubters wrong, including myself. Improved drastically from January onwards last season, and has been our most consistent player in the first two games.

And one of his best attributes is that he will run all day long and give 100% effort. Can't ask for much more than that.
 
Thomas Muller doesn't have any of those qualities either, yet he's still incredibly effective. If Naismith can play the Muller role for us then that's great. The Germans showed in the World Cup that it isn't the squad with the best individual players that wins, but the one with the best collective unit.
The Mueller role? But where does he go once Barkley is back? Someone like Mueller can do his stuff in behind a striker and (more often than not) from wide right. He has that flexibility. Put Naismith out on the right and you'll just get the same car crash again. And Martinez wants his wingers. He's bought McGeady and brought in Atsu. Martinez wont drop Barkley once he's back, and he wont go without genuine width either.

It sounds great like "Naismith can be our Mueller".
 

The Mueller role? But where does he go once Barkley is back? Someone like Mueller can do his stuff in behind a striker and (more often than not) from wide right. He has that flexibility. Put Naismith out on the right and you'll just get the same car crash again. And Martinez wants his wingers. He's bought McGeady and brought in Atsu. Martinez wont drop Barkley once he's back, and he wont go without genuine width either.

It sounds great like "Naismith can be our Mueller".

Yeah, I thought so too. Joking aside though, English/British football has traditionally undervalued the player that can do relatively 'simple' things really well in favour of the Hollywood type player that Gerrard and Rooney are.

Whilst I wouldn't compare Naismith to Mueller, I think both suffer from a lack of anything that really stands out in their game, yet both are (Mueller) or hopefully will be (Naismith) very effective.

If we're continuing the comparison, it's worth remembering that Gerrard was at his best in a wide role under Houllier. Have we ruled out such a role for Ross?
 
Yeah, I thought so too. Joking aside though, English/British football has traditionally undervalued the player that can do relatively 'simple' things really well in favour of the Hollywood type player that Gerrard and Rooney are.

Whilst I wouldn't compare Naismith to Mueller, I think both suffer from a lack of anything that really stands out in their game, yet both are (Mueller) or hopefully will be (Naismith) very effective.

If we're continuing the comparison, it's worth remembering that Gerrard was at his best in a wide role under Houllier. Have we ruled out such a role for Ross?

The few times I've seen Barkley out there it hasn't been too pretty, tbh.
 
The few times I've seen Barkley out there it hasn't been too pretty, tbh.

It'll be an interesting one. I'm sure he'll develop as a player. He's only young after all. I'm not sure he's all that suited to the #10 role either. His standout moments in games tend to be individual brilliance rather than a great assist. He's been compared to Gazza, but I think Gazza was a much more natural #10 as he could both create for others and do things himself. Ross has the latter but not the former.
 

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